Seeing as my PB support crew has been there with me every step of the way, this would be no time to cut ya loose. I'm gonna use this thread to share the growth of our Liberty Nature Preserve pond project as each rainfall brings a little more depth. I will also incorporate it into my anthology thread, Chasing A Dream.
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I'll begin by posting an aerial view of LNP for reference. It includes GPS mapped overlays of improvements (the dotted line is the entry driveway; the lite green lines are proposed roads that have now been completed; the little brown box within the knoll is the sand beach). This mapping work was performed by our county NRCS agent. He has been very helpful and will continue as we pursue government funded programs for vegetation development Spring '07. Anyway, the pondsite permimeter was mapped Fall of 2005 based on walking the treeline that delineates the edge of the proposed normal pool level. This treeline was where we stopped during clearing the entire pondsite of fairly thick timber. Subsequent excavation to create the building site pad and it's blunt, man-made peninsula, the south perimeter road, and the northwest road across a draw has taken away some of the acreage (the lite green line in the NW corner is the road that ultimately swept from the dam, across that little cove, and terminated at the knoll. We filled in the isolated cove and drained it under the new road). Some acreage will be gained because he did not map up into the dense thicket at a substantial section that will flood up into the timber adjacent to a shallower wetlands we planned. Bottom line: I'm guessing the final product will likely come in at about 4.5 - 5 acres.

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7/25/06, taken from the south end of the dam, looking across to the knoll and the sand beach (the drain filter jacket in the basin at the base of the dam is 6 - 7 feet tall)

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10/29/06 taken from the same south end of the dam (about 6" of the drain filter remains exposed above water)

Brettski,

Thanks for the update! How far are you from brim full?

Good idea Bski . I can use this in the slide show. What about an in-between time pic say 9-1 +- . Also a pic time line from a different angle say from the dock/landing.

This post will be a series taken from the front edge of the man-made peninsula of the building site. The building site is a 3/4 ac. area carved out of the surrounding timber at the south-east end of the pond with a wide, blunt peninsula that bumps out into the original pondsite footprint.
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Nov 2005; clearing was completed 2 months ago. The entire area we view was fairly thick timber 4 months ago (alot of closely spaced "pole" timber). We are planning the dimensions and excavation needs for the homesite. Before leaving this day, I walk back into the timber that will need to be cleared to create the area to waste the 4500-5000 cu yards of soil to build up this proposed building site. I take this pano-pic from the approx area where a home may someday reside. We are looking out at the natural terrain with no excavation. This is the terrain that took me 4 years of searching to find. I could not have done it without Terra-server.

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(fast-forward to next Summer)
7/15/06, after we discovered that our excavator elected to dig these monster holes right out in front of the building site. He had to cut through the 6 or 7 ft of topsoil and silt to get to the thick blue clay deposit beneath. This clay was used to line the front edge of the building site pad that we now stand on. This pad was built up and constructed by moving nearly 5000 cu yards of soil from within the basin. Donna-ski looks up, likely wondering how much these things cost. The PB crew has already weighed in, assuring me that these deep anomolies will yield substantial benefit as bottomscaping.

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7/25/06, excavation is complete and the drain valve was recently closed

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9/22/06, after placing some of the fish structure. A slightly differnet camera angle since we have moved over about 75 feet to the north side of the building site peninsula, still near the front edge. The monster holes, left of frame, have filled.

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10/21/06, not alot of water elevation change but a better pic

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Russ,
The water will be deepest at the area in front of the dam, per usual. It will be 14 feet deep at normal pool. This area of 13 - 14' deep spans an area about 1 acre out in front of the dam. The balance varies greatly. For reference, the top of the black filter pipe for the drain is about 8 ft below normal pool.

Brettski,

Great pictorial.

What happened to the structures in the 9/22 to 10/21/06 pictures?

Gator

Great thread as us usual Brettski. You set a high mark for the rest of us. Keep those photos coming. I can't wait for the normal pool level pictures.

Don't tell me the pirates came by and they are now interested in artificial structure. Ugggh !!

Thanks for the additional pics. I would think that by year end you will have a pic of a full pond to share.

Nice looking pond. Thats going to be fun when its filled up. Enjoy buddy!

Looks a lot like mine. I like the structure you put in.

Yours might be better looking and bigger but mines growing faster than yours

(I'm not goin' there)

11/21/06 update...
Hmmmm, not alot of change except the trees are naked. We picked up about 4" or 5" more depth since the last pic. This is the water depth that we had to deal with while considering the installation location of the fingerling cribs. It had a lot to do with my final decision to install them closer to shore.
Sunil's mound is about 15" from disappearing; Norm's ditch is pretty full.
This pano is a 3 pic stitch, so the foreground is distorted. It is taken from the same front/center spot of the building site that I have been using for reference. The grass perimeter at our feet actually curves the opposite direction, arcing to surround us.

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...this is a 2 pic pano stitch from the same area; a little larger for detail.

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(edited in 12/10) I just came across this descriptive pano-shot looking up to the building site pad from the south perimeter road (taken same date as above).

Man, that's a nice pond. How many fatheads have you put in?

Sunil

Beautiful pond Brettski. It is amazingly similar to mine. How many acres of watershed do you have and how long do you think it will take to fill up?

Thanks, Poseidon. You are right, they do seem similar, except I believe you are working with a larger surface area. My NRCS agent I just walked the entire property with the GPS yesterday. The flagged waterline was included in the mapping along with new drives and a couple of nature trails. I expect we will come in around 4.5 - 5 acres surface. The depth will calculate around 35 - 40 ft/acres.
Our watershed estimates at 55 ac. On the bad side, this is less than ideal for fill up and maint (but definitely not a deal-breaker). On the good side, a frog strangler shouldn't keep me awake at night worrying.
Under normal, average precip and evap. I am guessing 2 years to fill, but hope this is conservative. What we have now is the quick stuff that appears to be filling fast as an illusion. The rest of it is the bulk; that is where reality sets in. Hey, it gives me time to do more structure stuff and bird habitat.
How goes your project?

Jeez, Brettski, the scope of your project is amazing. Are you building the pond first and then your home?

Have you ever done a project like this before?

It looks like it is going to be an absolutly beautiful place when you are done.

In a previous lifetime, Brettski hung around with a large blue ox and is credited for digging the Great Lakes.

Brettski,

Thanks for the pictures and updates. I'm suprised that you expect it to take two years to fill. What's your anual, average rainfall?

It's been fun watching your progress.

Eddie

...the Gallus Historical Society explains:
...Erie thought, eh? :rolleyes:
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...Jeffhasacouplequestions:
Actually, you are witnessing first hand the fruits of a second mortgage. This project is targeted as a weekend and vacation retreat with the potential of a retirement crib. At my current debt, the original forecast of 5 years (min) to develop a home remains firmly intact.
Yes, when I was 7 years old. I was forced to give it up when my folks made me put away my Lincoln Logs and empty the bathtub.

Is there a spring running? Or is the current fill-up from rain runoff 'only'?

Eddie,
The avg precip for my region is about 38".
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Lance,
Good to hear from ya...seems like it's been awhile, or you've been hangin' in the threads further down that I don't frequent so much.
All our water is derived from runoff; no springs.

-- 12/17/06 UPDATE --
Wonderful midwest temps of low/mid 50's about one week before Christmas...but drizzly, cloudy, and dreary. The ground is absolutely soaked; my ankle cut boots weigh a ton with clay, nearly falling off with each step. We got about 3" of rain over 2 days about 10 days ago. It lifted the pool about...oh, gotta guess maybe 8 - 10". Alot of on & off showers and drizzle since. The drain pipe filter case is submerged; this is a milestone. We are about 10" short of totally submerging the entire basin, covering all the whoop-de-doos.

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Theo's Cluster, located near the heal of the slope off the building site pad (foreground structure), is flirting with juice. Sunil's Mound, below the center structure array, is now submerged. Norm's ditch is a mere shadow radiating up and left from Sunil's Mound. The beach and pier framing provide good perspective for how much further we have to go...about 7 or 8 more feet of depth.
(low level telephoto shot)

I think you're gonna be purt near full come Spring, Brettski. Of course, that could just be the juice talking.

C'mon Theo...I'm tryin' to remain calm, convincing myself that it's gonna take a couple o' years. I dunno; it had just started raining when we left after taking the above set of photos. This next pic is 3 days later after 2"+ of rain on already soaked soil. I think we picked up another 6 - 7" and it's still comin' in thru one draw. Oh yeah, and the clay field tile is making serious contributions (please see my red flare on the Best cap for tile overflow thread .

This pano shot is taken from a very similar area as the other above pano's at the building site pad. I have walked down the front slope to the current shoreline. Oooo boy, another milestone; the entire basin is covered with water. All the whoops are submerged. For reference, the dark spot underwater (right/center of frame) is the last exposed dirt mound; the hump between the 2 monster holes off the front/middle of the building site pad.
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Another perspective, taken from the timberline at the wetland zone. From left to right: one of eight 4 x 4 poles for nesting structures (normal pool will be 2 ft below the pole top; there is a second pole extension coming to raise the nest boxes), bld'g pad with Theo's Cluster (getting his feet wet) on the slope, launch/dock/deck, Sunil's mound going under, cribs on shore with polyvinylphibian saucers beaming cryptic messages to Sunil's friends in the Mothership, screen tent tucked up on a nice hill (soon-to-be home of the B-ski tree house and deck...shhh, don't tell D-ski yet), tire/PVC tree reef, run-off channel from a draw entering behind us, the dam at distant/far right.

Brettski,

Your pond looks great. Looks like your investment is paying off. I envy your precipitation there. I closed the valve on my pond about 3 weeks ago and started catching water. Unfortunately things are pretty dry around here this winter, so I only have about 4 ft of water in the deepest part, and only about 1/3 acre of surface at this point. We were .75" below normal in Nov, and 2.25" behind normal as of today for the month of December. Hopefully it will fill by the end of winter and I'll have some good pics of my own to post. Keep the pics coming. Hope you get to start on your house soon. Happy New Year.

Hillbilly

Thank ya, Hillbilly. Your advice and persistence in challenging some of the construction details had a positive influence on the final product. And I, in turn, envy your ability to have created your prize as the guy in the seat of the dozer. I'll bet you'll have all the water you need WAY before I eliminate my debt. Wanna trade deficits?

1-13-07 UPDATE
I'm raining as fast as I can, but it looks like Eddie is gonna kick my butt as we race to the "pool finish line".
We took on what appears to be about another foot of water; this is a pretty substantial jump for my short history. It comes about after 2.5" of rain within 24 hours on completely saturated soil. Using the same building site pic-source reference...

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We move over to the right, still on the building pad at the extreme right side.

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Theo's cluster (bottom) has seriously wet feet. Sunil's mound (center structure)is a couple feet from needing a snorkel. The wood duck boxes taunt the slowly expanding shoreline to make my life more miserable as I try to find the time to get back out there and install their predator guards.

Figure out how to do it from a boat; that's one possibility for that job.

I stand by my prior assessment.

Looks awesome Brettski! How far up in the trees is the water going to be at full pool? From the pics it almost looks like some of the structure will not be fully underwater.

Thanks for the boost, Eric. The normal pool will be between 2 and 3 feet over the top of all the tires pyramids (assuming my laser was operating correctly AND that I can read measurements.....uh-oh). The pool level is about 2' right at the timberline. The grade in front of the timberline is steeper than the grade behind because it was scraped during construction. The lesser grade behind will allow the water to creep back into the timber about 20 - 40 feet along the entire shoreline.
FWIW, I hear we got another 1.75" of rain since these last pics taken 2 days ago. Theo The Prognosticator might be onto sumthin'.

** 1/28/07 UPDATE **
Brrrr....
It's been 2 weeks since the last pics. It was still raining when we left 2 weeks ago and the level is up about another 10 - 12" or so.
From the building site reference point:

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The water level is now touching the bottom of the concrete boat launch. I know the elevation of this concrete work from last summer. We are about 5'-4" from the spillway. The dry-hydrant intake pipe is also submerged...or should I say frozen? The Rockytopper Lunker Stopper tire array in front of the launch dock is gone.
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Theo's Cluster is definitely threatened. Sunil's Mound is pert-near a goner. The Wood Duck nesting boxes beckon me to enjoy cold, dry land and install the predator guards...NOW.

Brettski,

Looks like your water level is rising nicely!!

I don't know your area, but I'm guessing the spring rains will have no problem filling it up in a few months.

Very nice looking lake,
Eddie

That looks colder than my pond. Do you know how thick the ice was? (Don't find out the hard way, especially when Donna-ski stays home!)

nope...no hurry to find out, either. The lee end of the pond was frozen all the way along the shoreline and the opposite side was partially open along the shore. This was enough to minimize my curiosity. I expect that the coming week's prediction of consistent sub-freezing temps will raise my curiosity a bit by next week-end. What is a quick, down & dirty (hesitant to use that phrase) way to check if ice is safe to walk on?

"What is a quick, down & dirty (hesitant to use that phrase) way to check if ice is safe to walk on?"

Well, if you're asking my older brother that question, the answer is to send your younger brother (myself) out onto the ice to find out.

Sure that was about (30) years back, but who knows if it would work today?

Jumping on the ice usually will tell you, but put a hole in it and see how thick it is next time your there. Oh, and remember your iceskates. Its suppose to be wickedly cold by the end of the week.

3 solid inches of clear, dark ice and you're golden...anything less is dicey. More is always better.

Got an ice-auger? Heavy, sharp pole (4 feet of 3/4" hot-rolled steel) if you can't bang it through pretty easy, you're probably pretty safe...but hang on to it tight when testing.

B-ski,

I am curious……….. as your pond level rises, do your fish attracting devices rise also with the ice? (Only to be moved when ice thaws).
The reason I ask is; I am having trouble with railroad tie docks being lifted by 12” to 14” of ice as the ponds fill after last years dry conditions.....frustrating.

A very good question, Ed. This is all new to me, so I am uncertain as to the outcome. I imagine alot of that will be dictated by how much rain or melted snow is added before an appreciable thaw. Ironically, I did already consider the potential of ice movement as I sweated out the water level vs. the height of my 6' tall drain filter case unit. Fortunately, it is about 2+ feet below the water level right now.
I guess the "structure and ice" thing did come to me a few times, but brushed it off as unavoidable until the water level rises above them. I sure as heck would not want to try and place it after full pool.
As an aside, I did note that the mass of ice that had formed in the pics above was wide open around and within the tire pyramids. I gotta think that maybe the black color was absorbing some of the solar gain?

B-ski she's looking real good, it appears that any doubts you may have had on your watershed being marginal for the size pond should be lifted now. She seems to be catching plenty of runoff and the real rains haven't hit yet. Congrats

I think the key will be, to see how it holds up in the summer during a dry spell.

Thank ya, Rocky-T...your approval means alot to me. I agree that perhaps...just perhaps....I underestimated the run-off. I'll tell ya why.
I estimate, with the assistance of the local NRCS office, that we are working with about 55 - 60 acres of run-off. I have 3 main water feeds. 2 of them are draws that are reasonably easy to calculate acccurately. The third source is the wild card. It is the 8" clay field tile that I have been whinin' about on the tile overflow thread . I was pretty sure of the zones that this tile drained. Right after we purchased the property, I was able to find and contact the 80 year old guy that grew up on it, and the surrounding 180 acres, since 1935. We talked on the phone for almost 2 hours...v cool history lesson. Anyway, he was certain that he knew of the only 2 inlets for the tile and he told me about where they are. He said that they are the old fashioned inlets that are built like a french drain. The opening is well below the depth of a disc, covered in filter gravel, and topped with soil. He said that the second inlet was added by him and his brother when they were kids. They tee'd it into the longer, already existing run. I walked the areas where these 2 inlets would reside and found no breaches in the surface. This leads me to believe that the water we receive should be well filtered. Then....this last weekend I find small sections of corn cob and husk pc jammed up in the pop-up fitting that I put on our end of this drain, the outlet. Hmmmmm.
I told my contractor about this drain when I first found it at the bottom of the big 'ol blow-hole. I told him that I measured the ID about 7.5". His first response was that it might drain a heck of alot of acreage. I asked why. He said that a 7" or 8" tile was normally installed to carry a correspondingly sized flow of water. He felt that it is possible that I am getting alot more water than the old timer lead me to believe. After seeing the corn waste, I gotta think he may be right.
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Lance...right on the money; we will see. When I first laid out the pond plan and shot the elevations, I wrestled with adding 2 additional feet of depth or passing on the depth to have about 6 more acres of drainage. It was a topographical ground truth and I had to make a decision. My valued PB mentors helped me make the correct choice of adding the 2 additional feet of depth. If my observations in the above paragraph are correct, it seals the deal.

Sound like your running a detective show out in illinois. When will the show premiere on the pond boss channel?

I don't remember seeing the 2ft versus 6 acre thread. I'll have to do something in time if I want more than a bullhead pond. The pond goes down too much in the summer. I'll have to trap more of the snow runoff and spring rains by raising pool level or creating a pond above the primary one, to help store the precious water.

Looks great Brettski! I think you are gonna see full pool or 'purt near by the time the trees bud out.

Eric

I just got a copy of last year's strip map aerial from my NRCS office. Based on the stage of development, it's from August '06.
I thought it might be interesting to take a look at a series of aerial maps and photos to demonstrate my vision as it came into focus over 18 months of raw land development.
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The parcel, the way we found it, aerial taken in 2004.

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The topo map, notes entered weeks after purchasing the parcel as I dreamed (the spring pond , as it was touted by the selling realtor, wound up being nothing more than a depression that collected about 2 ft of water in a bowl about 100 ft across)

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After clearing about 90% of the timber for the pondsite, my NRCS guy took GPS readings around the clearing that was to define the pond basin, the dam, and the area behind the dam. The building site was not yet cleared at the S.E. end. He also picked up the coordinates for the new driveway. He transferred these to the older strip map in pic #1. I added the proposed clearing for the building site and beach/knoll (yellow zones). I also added the perimeter pond road and the access roads to the building site and meadow (lite green).

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All the above excavation and raw development plans have been executed. The pond is already collecting water.

In no time at all, that pond is gonna look so-o-o-o-o beautiful, Brettski! I look forward to an aerial shot about next Fall.

Looks like a meteorite hit.

excellent comparison shots brettski. i like that the house will be just about smack in the middle of property let alone looking over the pond. yer driveway really disappears in the woods, must be a nice drive in.

looks like at time of pic, there is water in the pond basin (as the really light brown in deepest areas)?

hopefully you get along with that one neighbor to the north.

also, assuming north is straight up, what is the clearing on east side of property.....looks like soil is exposed there or rock outcrop?

Brettski,

With all the documentation you have collected for your pond, when are you going to have a book naming contest? GREAT job!!

Me too, Theo....me too.
would'a been more cost effective
Yep, it had just started to back up; maybe 4 feet deep in the wide/flat basin afronting the dam. (for a lack of better description) the puddle is shaped like a morel mushroom; the bottom of the stem in the SE and the top of the cap in the NW.
We actively reached out to all our bordering neighbors. Kinda funny, as we mentioned the names of the other neighbors to each that we were actively visiting, they would usually respond with "sorry, who's that?". Anyway, based on our best job of diplomacy, I feel much better than worse on the results. This is an area of 1.75 ac that is a meadow. It had a short hump of dirt with a few ratty trees in it. When the dozer was on site, we had him "pretty up the hump" to create a pad for building a gazebo viewing platform. The plan is to plant a shelterbelt of conifers across the north border (yes, north is up), closing off this meadow with trees at all four sides (there is a thin tree line along the east edge, beneath the yellow property line I inserted). Then, the entire area is gonna get loaded with native grasses and wildflowers. We want this to be a special "destination zone" to balance off the timber.
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...the view of the meadow, standing south of the small "building pad hump", and looking north. The north end of the treeline along the east edge can be seen right of frame. We will begin the shelterbelt at that point and stretch it west (to the left), effectively closing off this area with trees (someday).

i would like to know if it is wise to put some kind of plant growth on the bottom of the pond [hydro seed spread hay] to prevent silt build up

MTB, I wouldn't do that. You could easily (I have) wound up with a rotted mess of formerly green stuff.

I've heard of them planting rye grass prior to filling a lake to prevent erosion and to "jump start the ecosystem." I still don't know what they meant, like DD1 it seems to me it would just end up as dead muck once it filled but am interested in an explaination of what the article meant.

IIRC the theory is grass provides a substrate for aquatic plants and invertebrates to live on.

We just planted down about 2' below the eventual waterline, for erosion control before the pond filled. I suppose that's deep enough in most ponds to cover the light-penetrating zone in case there's anything to the above theory.

There was a thread some time ago started with a question about types of grass at the pond perimeter. IIRC ( ) Bob Lusk said to plant the grass well past the future shoreline and below the normal pool line. Something regarding the benefits of the underwater vegetation.

** 3/24/07 UPDATE **
Well, the ice is long gone. Ed Eitel asked a vexing question during the January freeze:
Whoa, that one spooked me. It appears that the fish structure fared well. I can barely see the tops of the remaining visible tire pyramids; they look fine. All the tires and PVC trees, on Sunil's Mound are totally submerged. The tops of the rest of the PVC trees at the reef and Theo's Cluster are barely visible, but they are all still there. Most of them are tipped over a bit; I contribute that to ice shift. Who cares, right?
I haven't posted pics of progress since the end of January. I have been to the project once since that time, but the only changes were 18" of snow; not post-worthy. D-ski and I visited yesterday, after a week of significant rain through the midwest. Yeah baby; she's comin' on. We picked up a little over 2 more feet of water elevation. We are 3'-2" from normal pool.
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The standard reference shot from the building site:

A few more milestones have been achieved. The sand beach is just beginning to slip below the surface. As noted above, the PVC trees and tire pyramids are about 6" from gone.
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The reference shot from the dam, looking back to the building site.
The launch and dock/deck are just right of building pad. The beach and beach dock are left/frame.
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...taken from the edge of the wetland area.

The structure reef is in the water foreground; almost gone. On the opposite shore, the cribs and saucers are almost gone. The water has reached the edge of the woods. The slope of the grade back into the timber is mostly gentle, so 3 more feet of water will flood it nicely. One of the 2 draws that feeds us water is in this zone. It has just started to back up water with the arrival of this new depth. Recent rains had it runnin' nice and smooth.

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Another valuable water feed is the drain tile. It was also anxious to share inflow.

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The dam is greening up fairly well. We planted it with cereal rye last fall to stabilize erosion.

This entire area will soon be prepared for warm weather native grasses, shrubs, and a heavy dose of wildflowers. In fact, the entire perimeter of the pond is slated for vegetation development in a few weeks by use of the NRCS W.H.I.P. program.
D-ski and I have alot of work ahead, all necessary to benefit nature and fulfillment of dreams. All in all, the progress is pleasing and rewarding.

That should be plenty of water for your wild friends to drink and play in.

Man that's a beautiful pond!

I second that! Check out B-ski's web site for more information. He has had an amazing journey with this project.

B\'ski\'s web site

Cool website too! Looks like B'ski put as much time into is website as he did into the pond.

Brettski, your pond/lake is really looking awesome! When do you plan to start stocking?

Eric

fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish,fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, when ya puttin in some fish.......??

how fun has it been to watch this project from the beginning? great update b'ski.

All together now and along with the badger music -- FISH , Fish , FISH , Fish , fish , fish .... little bitty fishy....

FISH ,Fish FISH ,Fish, fish, fish.... little bitty fishy.

FISH , Fish , FISH , Fish , fish , fish .... little bitty fishy....

FISH ,Fish FISH ,Fish, fish, fish ..... little bitty fishy.

:p

http://www.weebls-stuff.com/toons/badgers/

Fish heads, fish heads...roly-poly fish heads...
I've been workin' the phones to find the right vendor with the right inventory with the right quality at the right price (yeah, one of my many hats was purchasing agent for many years). When I get it dialed in a little more, I'll post the details of the forage on the Fathead thread and the stock on the Fish adoption thread . For the record, and to quell any notion that DD1 has promoted:
...the plan remains the same as FH, RES, YP, and SMB.
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...as always, thanks for the continued support and encouragement. This includes Dave; I know he means well.

Sideline heckling is such a thankless job!

But somebody has to do it.

4/1/07 UPDATE
No significant change from a week ago. We picked up about 4" more water elevation. We spent the day, as usual, working on peripheral projects. One very important project is installation of a hooded inlet. When we get it completed, target this coming weekend, I will post a couple of pics. It might spark some discussion as I don't recall a lot of forum activity on that little detail.
Anyway, I measure normal pool as 2' -11" away. Another 6" of water and Theo's cluster (left/frame) is a goner. Forecasts for this coming week seem to indicate that to be a foregone conclusion.

B-ski she's looking real real nice, I can really see the beach now. The hooded inlet I put in my silt pond has worked great thus far. I put 6 inch sq field wire around the sides it really keeps the big stuff from entering the pipe. I know your contractor didn't recommend it but I think you should consider it. Ever thing that clogs up a drain floats. Once the water level goes above the hood so does all the floating debre and the water exits below. The screening is just to keep the logs and limbs out, the openings are still big enough to allow leafs and grass thru. Keep up the good work my friend.

4/28/07 UPDATE
It continues to be a pretty wet spring...and I continue to be surprised by the steady surges of increased volume. I am beginning to see a very acceptable pattern of inflow that actually exceeds my expectations. It seems that even when we get a gully washer rain, my inflow is only strong...not substantial. Yes, maybe a little slow, but maybe not. As of this weekend, we are 25" short of full pool. Considering we corked it up last July, we have moved along very steadily for nearly 10 months. There have been some killer rainstorms, but we never experienced overwhelming inflow. Only a steady, strong increase. I like it.

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We planted a bunch of cereal rye last summer and fall. Man, is that stuff cheap...I couldn't believe it. A 60# bag is $12. The dam has filled in nicely.

We are now easing into the next new eye-candy experience as the trees fill in. Yep, pleased so far.

I would like to fish that pond someday. It looks fun.

He's halfway in between us, Bruce. Meet you for shore lunch. You catch and clean, I'll cook and eat.

Brettski, when that pond is full and those trees are leafed out (say in a month), that pond is going to look gorgeously mature.

....better bring real tiny hooks and forks
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I was just stitching up a few pano's from yesterday's visit and a kinda cool comparative thought hit me.

That big grassy secluded area would be a great place for a deer feeder in the fall. Then move it to the lake in spring and it could double as a fish feeder for those YP.

Brettski,

Rest assured, you will leave this world a more beautiful place than you found it. Thanks for letting us hitch a ride.

Joe

Hey Joe provides some motivation:
Thank you, Joe. We are very fortunate to have this opportunity. I doubt that it will offset much of the Brettski Gone Wild epic saga that St Pete will make me watch when I'm standing at the pearly gates, but I'm hopin' it will cover a box of popcorn. A big box of JuJuBees would help; I hear it's a 2 parter.
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Well, the rain machine has turned off for a couple of weeks. The level has gone back down by 4" from the peak after a good downpour. I'm not pleased, but not freakin' out (yet). All the water that we see now is creeping back into the flats of the timber and wetland area. I expect that there is a whole bunch of absorbin' goin' on. What has changed, tho, is the picture frame of green.

We are done planting the entire perimeter with native grasses and major league wildflowers. I know that it's gonna take a year or two to really see how the flowers take hold, but I expect some action this year...particularly the annuals in the mix. I can't wait...bring me some precip.

...7 months later (from the last post, above)
Man, it's been a long time waiting...and I'm still waiting.
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It's been about 16 months since we closed the valve on the drain. The first fall/winter '06/'07 was major league water and fill rate, topping at 25" short of pool. Then, the following spring/summer '07 was terrible. We got sporadic rains thru these warm months, but the level dropped and hovered around 36" - 42" short of pool. Now, we're seemingly back into the same cold weather pattern and have jumped back up to 22" short of pool as of today's measurement.
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(normal pool will be slightly higher than the bottom of the galvanized predator guard on the nesting tube pole at right of frame...gotta adjust them up a bit)
Brrrrrr...

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The tops of the cribs and the top set of spawn saucers will be the last exposed items to submerge.

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The water was still dribbling in thru the field tile feed. I can't quantitatively analyze how much water it contributes, but I am thankful for it's participation. The last 22" of water depth will flood this (and the adjacent 1/4 ac) of timber creating the wetland area we planned.

Brettski, I see you have something I am worrying about this Winter - partially submerged structure sticking up through the ice. I am concerned about ice shifting and moving/trashing my (and, what the heck, your) handcrafted fish habitats and attractors.

Did you have any structure at the proper level for this to be a concern last Winter, and if so, what happened.

I suspect that given how firmly you anchor things, in order for ice to move you structure it would have to rip the bottom out of the pond. But mine is not that well attached.

Bski thanks for the update - nice pics. You now have another piece of info and it is good. In a dry summer/period you only lost 12-15in +- of water. That should mean in normal conditions you will stay near full pool (+- 12 in). IMO you can't ask for or expect more than that.

Theo,
I don't think my ice ever got too thick last winter; guessing 4" - 6" max...? The water level was just a couple inches over many of the PVC Christmas trees and a couple of the tractor tire pyramids. I am sure that a number of the PVC trees were frozen in at the top. The tops of the tire pyramids, too. After the spring thaw and the water receding during the summer, I was able to survey the ice-shift damage. The tire pyramids; nothing/zip. The PVC trees; most of them got tipped over, the worst about 45 degrees from upright. For reference, the trees were set in a 5 gal bucket with about 40# of concrete, dug into the clay bottom about 6" - 8". This all occurred with almost 5 surface ac of ice. I have to guess that smaller and/or larger ice floes would have relative damage potential. Probably gotta figger in the wind exposure, too.
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Thanks for checking in, Ewest. That farm field tile will probably always be the wild card for in-flow. I really wish I could have seen 'er goin' this past week. I know that this new water level (at 22" shy) is no biggie, but it is new territory for me and I have been waiting since last spring to blaze this trail again. I remember in the beginning that I said that my estimated 60 ac watershed would likely take 2 years to fill the hole. I will probably be closer on that prediction than the total cost to make it.

Bski I want to come ice skate on your pond.

tagging along on ewest's remark.......no leaks dude.....with all that clay i wouldnt think the soil "wetting" would be all that significant either....bravo....here's to full pool in 08!



now you'll know how to budget for pond #2

You're welcome anytime, big guy! I'll have Dski slip into something Peggy Fleming-ish and you guys can re-create Beauty and the Beast on ice. You know, something that we can bill as the Rockytop-capades. (we might want to ride out the cold weather a little longer, tho. We're nowhere near Zamboni ice support thickness)

I stole the text and aerial shots from a previous post that I made within this thread. I just got the 2007 aerial strip map from my NRCS office and will add it the original pic line-up to update perspective of change.
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The parcel, the way we found it, aerial taken in 2004.

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The topo map, notes entered weeks after purchasing the parcel as I dreamed (the spring pond , as it was touted by the selling realtor, wound up being nothing more than a depression that collected about 2 ft of water in a bowl about 100 ft across)

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After clearing about 90% of the timber for the pondsite, my NRCS guy took GPS readings around the clearing that was to define the pond basin, the dam, and the area behind the dam. The building site was not yet cleared at the S.E. end. He also picked up the coordinates for the new driveway. He transferred these to the older strip map in pic #1. I added the proposed clearing for the building site and beach/knoll (yellow zones). I also added the perimeter pond road and the access roads to the building site and meadow (lite green).

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All the above excavation and raw development plans have been executed. The pond is already collecting water.

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Summer 2007 My NRCS guy added the yellow property boundaries on this aerial shot (nice try; close, but not quite). He said the shot is summer '07, but could not offer the exact date. It's kinda grainy, so I can't see enough detail to make an accurate guess, but I'm gonna say it's around June/July. At that point, the water level was back down to about 3 ft+ short of spillway. He used a planimeter on the map and got about 4.4 ac based on the shoreline that he could see on the pic. If that is accurate (and I question it just because of the tree shadows), we would likely wind up around 4.8 - 5 ac after fill-up as the perimeter stretches a bit and it spills into the timber in the NE corner.

OK, that's VERY COOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Eddie

Brettski - This is very interesting. Thanks for sharing. I hope my next question is not too intrusive - Would you care to estimate how much this project would have cost had you contracted out all of the work?

Thank ya, Mr Walker. We should be receiving some updates on the progress of your pond project since you filled up this last spring (correct?).
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Schroeder,
We did contract out all the dirt work. The peripheral projects (that still seem to have no end in sight) were the only things that the boss and I executed. I don't consider asking your question to be too intrusive, but I'm not prepared to to actually sit down and start adding it up. I am purposely staying away from that to keep myself duped into thinking that it was no big deal...just keep on working. (I think that Donna-ski has already caught on, tho).

One thing is certain - over the years of enjoyment it will be worth 20 times what you paid .

How much timber area will be inandated, how many trees? If it has any depth at all and the trees die and stay standing I'm picturing a nice bass habitat area.

Merry christmas Bski

May see fill with the snow melt in the first light of spring..

I don't have specific, calculated square footage, but guesstimate about 1/4 ac of flooded timber. Might be a little larger...? We planned the pond footprint this way to enhance the natural habitat. The center of this area is a shallow draw that runs off to the neighbor's property. This draw has received a lot of attention right from the get-go cuz it dictates how high I can back up the pond water before compromising the property line. We are anxious to see the results of this man-made wetland zone. I anticipate a couple of trees at the shoreline will die and eventually fall into the actual pond basin. Good!...that's the plan. Great fish and wildlife habitat and a natural looking transition.

It was...nice and quiet. Hopin' Santa was good to you too, big guy!

the last reported depth measurement on Dec 15 (4 weeks ago) was 22" short of pool
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The midwest got a fair share of a January thaw combined with a good dowsing of rain. The rain really came down about 4 days ago. We got about 2-1/2" in our little pocket of weather activity. With the ground absolutely saturated and the subsurface frozen, we gained alot of new water depth. I'm pleased to report that we are now 10" short of testing the spillway.
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(18" spillway pipe to right/frame surrounded by a patch of grass)

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The docks are beginning to look a bit more in place as the water level reaches upward. The cribs, spawn saucers, and PVC logs are gone, submerged along the shoreline beneath the duck decoy in the dock reflection.

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The red/white floats mark the end of the concrete boat ramp. At this stage, the top of the ramp at that end should be a little more than 4 feet below the surface (5 feet at full pool). This has become my favorite place during the summer. I see now why Bill Cody talks about a concrete swimming area. This has become mine. I put on my Rockytopper Blue-footed Booby beach shoes and hang out here (when it's a little warmer).

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The mini silt pond for the field tile feed has become part of the aquahabitat. FH were swimming up and down the new channel, checking out the newfound protection. The larger ones had a black patch on top of the head...that is a FH, right?

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10 more inches of water to meet full pool will do a nice job of filling in this little zone behind the nesting boxes and tubes to create a mini marsh/wetland. The bottom slope is fairly gradual from the edge of the timber and out for about 50 feet. I expect we will get good vegetation growth in this area. I hope I don't regret it; it might get out of hand...?

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Back to the standard pond growth reference point at the front of the building pad.

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...might be kinda tuff for detail, but a wide angle view stitching 4 pix. The white of the Sycamores looks cool.

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...and finally, backing up on the building pad to the approx area where a house might set (next time, I'll get a ladder to elevate to the correct deck-viewing height).

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I hope to return with the next set of pics, ushered in with a photo of water entering and/or exiting the spillway pipe.

Beautiful lake, Brettski. Don't you love it when a plan comes together? Hope you have many days to enjoy the fruit of all your labor.

Wow Brettski,

You've got your own project going there. And the pond is much bigger than our little watering hole. And bigger = more possibilities. Btw, how are you taking those panoramic pictures?

Yea, I also want to know about the panoramic photos.

Brettski, it is a pleasure to watch the progress unfold on your property. The magnatude of it is amazing to me.

Thank you, guys. I am sure y'all know the feeling.
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I'm gonna direct ya back to this thread (my post a little past half way down the page). Ironically, the same page contains some real potent flashback pix.

Brettski,
It sure shows up well in those panoramic shots, it also shows how well you planned the project. It will be stunning in the spring.

S T U N N I N G ! ! !

I can't wait until we get the first spring report that you witnessed the deer , ducks , fish and other inhabitants in their reaffirmation of the joy of life.

Fill 'er up and check the air in your tires, Mister?

Bski Look up It's Falling water............LNP
?(your last post)

Rocky'T...you're creativity is going to hasten my trip to the poor farm.

That's what friends are for.

The deed is done....And so it shall be.
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The pond is full.
It took 19 months, but 13 - 14 million guesstimated gallons (and then some) are present and accounted for. This last midwestern blast of precipitation and wild weather temps has taken us over the top (figuratively).
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D-ski and I were scheduled to be in Florida this week, but the same lousy weather that completely cancelled all the possible flights outta Chicago was the same system that took us to the spillway. Ironic, eh? So, instead of hangin' around at Universal Studios in Orlando, we spent our Saturday at the pond delivery room. It's a bouncing, baby 5-ac'er.
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The complete story and a whole buncha other pics are on a new page on our Liberty Nature Preserve website.
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Again...and again...
Thanks to the entire forum and those key players that encouraged me to push the envelope, then pulled me back from the ledge just before I fell off. I think it all turned out pretty dang good.

Congratulations, Dad. We're still at 8 cm dilated and holding here.

A beautiful thing is born.

What a gestation period !

How are the fish doing . In a couple mths you can watch them spawn - a second birth all in one winter/spring

A brand new bouncing baby 13 gallon, 3 pint beauty. Oh, wait. That's million gallons isn't it?

It's beautiful.

Wonderful! Can't wait to see some fish pictures this spring!

Get the fish food ready; you'll love it.

You are going to spend hours at that dock just watching smallies and other fish. Get a good pair of polarized sun glasses.

I went to the website and read the entire narrative. I could almost feel your triumph. You've created something marvelous. I'm glad you've been allowing all of us to witness it.

I'm thru drueling now, It's a master piece.

FANTASTIC job, B'ski!!

I hope to have a setup like yours someday.

dittos to all the above comments......glad to have been able to experience it w/ you (here anyways)...


p.s. looks like you still have a crib out of water?

Nah...I think you're lookin' at the hooded trash-guard I have installed over the spillway pipe inlet. Go to the new website page I created this morning (and linked in my last post) for a better explanation of the entire encounter.
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I bow to my Pond-Zen masters and teachers...thank you.

Wow!!!

Started reading this thread this morning and had to put it on hold (domestic duties called). I stopped right at the post where the water level had dropped.



Spent the rest of the day running around town with the family concerned... Did Brettski's pond fill? Is the watershed sufficient? Is Porturalia really a country the PB guys didn't make up?

Well, you can imagine my excitement to return to the thread tonight and find that just a few hours ago it was reported at full pool.

What a pond! What a place!


Some people idolize rock stars and fall all over themselves to get something signed.

Other people wear Eli Manning jerseys.

BUT... my heroes are guys that build their own ponds!

Nicely done, Brettski! Can I get your autograph?

Brettski - Went through your entire site. Read every word. What a great story! You've created a masterpiece.

Outstanding! Really, really nice. Congratulations.

...this guy's gonna fit right in
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Weissguy...thanks for coming to cyber-visit us. You're always welcome. Your support means alot.
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D. Helms...I am honored to be recognized on only your 13th post. Join us more often, would ya?

Just skipped through the whole thread. very interesting. Lot's of hard work paid off, pond looks great!

Brettski,

Congratulations!!! Now the really fun stuff starts to happen. Your pond becomes alive and things start to happen on their own. Wildlife shows up and makes it their home. Plants do the same thing. Every time we walk around ours, we're amazed to see the little changes that happen to it and discover new creatures.

You did a first class job of turning a dream into reality. Your research has benifited all of us, but maybe me more then most. Thank you, I've realy appreciated it and look forward to your continued updates and success.

Eddie

I just saw this Brettski, it's finally full! What an accomplishment. It's fantastic, a dream come true. You will have many many enjoyable hours at this place. I guess you've figured that out already. When do you start the house? The journey will continue.

Congratulations, Ski.

Beautiful! Victoria and I were just talking about your project this weekend and I wondered how close you were with the recent weather. I am so glad a took a couple of minutes to check. Congratulations! What an inspiration. Thank you.

...a bit of postscript stuff
Since GW trained me in the fine art of posting video stuff from my photobucket acct, I will (shamelessly) post a summer vid clip of the finished and full product (I have this same vid on our website, but this PhB vid clip is better quality...maybe I should have GeeDub tune up our website, too)
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...complete with neighborhood background sound

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There have been a number of posts and threads related to new ponds that experience considerable water loss as they fill. We went through the same scare. The common response from the experienced pondmeisters is a warning to chill as the surrounding soils become saturated.
Our first full summer saw a drop of about 16". Yep, I was spooked. Then, the following winter (this past winter), the heavy precip brought it up to full pool. We also had a wet spring and early summer. Since that time, tho, the balance of the summer has yielded average rainfall. In fact, nothing of significance for about a month. I just measured the water level. It's the middle of August and we are 4-1/2" shy of full pool. She's holding like a bathtub....a far cry from last summer's scare. I have to believe that we are proof that the soils gotta suck up and saturate with a new pond.

I have two comments.

First, I'd like to say that I now have an image in my mind of the pond to go with all of the bits of information you've given us. This literally brings the pond to life for me. Thanks. That was gorgeous.

Second, It's obvious that you need to embark on a prolonged and expensive cardinal eradication project.

But where was the road noise? I hear it at least 364 1/2 days a year here (occasionally on New Year's Day, if you get up early enough, and there's enough snow, there are no man-made noises).

Appreciate that commute to the pond a little more, Bski.

Great pond and video Bski.

Time to take the boat out for a ride.

We did....yesterday. I swiped the back-up battery for the sump pump, clamped the new trolling motor to the beater jon boat, and went for a cruise. I took D-ski for a ride; told her to bring along her new binocs to investigate the wetland area that is easiest to access by boat only. It was kinda fun.
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Because of the water clarity, I was able to use the decoy markers to locate the sunken PVC trees. I was surprised to see that they all had very little algae growing on them. I expected them to be more green. They appeared to still be all white.
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Thank ya kindly, GW. Your inspiration to upgrade to the Kodak Z812IS made a diff.

...a small, one-post video pondumentary
all 3 vid clips taken from the same vantage point
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taken with old digi-cam; 12 second vid, about 1 month after closing the drain valve; the only structure set is Sunil's Mound

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another 12 sec vid; about 3 months later; all the structure is set except the polyvinylphipian saucers

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new digi-cam, 1st summer after reaching full pool

Beauty, clerk.

Well done sir - well done.

Very nice, very nice

Just another atta boy for all your hard work. Hey, that video pan could be easier than trying to stitch photos with digital camera. Think I try that if my pond ever fills up. You mentioned water loss... mine went down 4' over the last month with 100+ temps & no rain..

FIRST CLASS

U learn well grasshopper!

It kills me that even though there are such great things with ponds that don't have to do with the fish, that you've built such a sweet place, and haven't gotten hooked into the fish.

It's coming. Who can get to Brettski for a crash course on fishing his pond?

Brettski, I love what you've done with the place! I have a slightly smaller pond and simliar drainage in Western IL. I'm hoping to get some rain in 09 like we did in the summer of 08'.

welcome midwest Dave:
This is a great place to get info and share success stories.

Thank ya, Dave. With a new pond and unestablished vegetation around the perimeter, you might want to be careful whatcha wish for when it comes to your first rains.

...not to beat a dead horse
My NRCS guy just sent me an email with some very cool shots. He has the 2008 strip maps and cropped out our LNP project. 2008 is a significant year for our pond project as it was the first year we sent water thru the overflow pipe.
I borrowed a set of growth aerial pics from earlier in this thread, adding the new aerial at the end.
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2004, raw property

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Topo map

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original pondsite projection by NRCS

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Just starting to collect water

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Summer 2007

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The new aerial; summer 2008

That is indeed cool!

Nice, real nice!

Awesome!

Can you find the cow in that last photo?


Oh sorry, just had a flashback.

You must get a lot of that.

I grew up in Southern California in the seventies. Nuff said.

Brettski:

That's nice! Knowing what I'm going thru to get rid of all the dirt, (still dealing with that) where did all of yours go? Mine is just a puddle in comparison.

That is the reason it took some 4 years to find the right property. The pondsite was a natural bowl waiting for a dam. When my dirt guy first walked the woods of the pondsite and we got to the area where the dam would be located, he stopped and his eyes widened as he noted "do you know what you've got here? If you could just drop a dam in this valley, you've got a natural pond, even without excavation". I think he was waiting for a big reaction like "Wow...really?". Instead, he got "yeah, I know...thats' why I bought it. Why is that such a big deal?". He said that he doesn't very many of 'em that are this natural.
Make no mistake; we moved thousands of yards of clay and dirt. The trick is to push to somewhere closeby to make it disappear. This is where a good dirt guy earns his keep. He suggested that we sacrafice some of the shoreline to create a roadway around the perimeter, providing a place to move the soil from the pond basin. Same thing with a building site. Of course, the dam and filling in the valley behind it was substantial.
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summary

This is the last pile that I have to deal with. It'll be gone by mid March. Some will be moved to my parents place 7 miles away because they need the fill, and the rest will be distributed down a 350 Yd x 25 ft wide lane that I cut in the woods. It's 95% sand.

The pond came up another 18" from when this pic was taken. I can't wait to get the banks planted and get the place green again!
[img][/img]

Is the lake full?
What kind of tree is on the island?

Otto:

That's a picture from last month of the hole in the ground that is getting formed in all the pictures that I'm posting in the pond renovation thread. At this water level, it's roughly 14" below full pool. It raised 18" since that picture was taken with the rain that we had and now the water is going out the outflow pipe at a pretty good rate. The tree on the island is a weeping willow. I know that it'll suck a lot of water up during the summer, but it looks nice when it's green.

[img][/img]

Right now the water is about 6" above where that orange stake is in the ground.

It looks great. The tree will not use enough water that you will ever know.

Plus I'll bet you'll find that fish will gather underneath the overhanging branches. I have several trees that overhang the pond and fish hang out there a lot.