Came up yesterday to check on things. Was at the pond late yesterday when the feeder went off. I noticed very low feeding activity, so I dialed back the number of seconds the feeder would run. I went back down this morning and watched it go off. Absolutely zero fish coming to feed? I’ve got the battery disconnected for now. Lots of things doing on here. Hopefully someone can shed some light on the situation.
#1 it’s cool (56 degrees) east wind, and sprinkling. It was sprinkling last night also. I’ve been told YP don’t feed if it is raining, but zero activity?
#2 I killed out all the FA last week. I put copper sulfate crystals in a burlap bag and rowed it around the edge of the pond. I put out about 12 lbs in a 1 ac pond. Mostly within 20’ of the bank.
#3 I was out of Optima when I came up last week. I feed a mix of blue gill and bass formulas. I didn’t think I had any left, but found one bag in my storage bin. It was the blue gill formula. Manufactured in May of 2018. It had spent most of last summer and all winter in the locker. It is totally dry, and smells normal. That’s all that’s coming out now. I’ve got new bags of BG and LMB Optima feeds on hand now.

FYI, the fish were feeding very aggressively a few weeks ago. Larger fish than I’ve ever noticed before, plus the usual suspects. Lots of smaller fry pushing pellets around also.
I don’t think I’ve had any other fishermen in, or otters.

Suggestions? More info needed? I forgot my thermometer this morning, so I don’t have water temp, but I can get it easily enough. Water is cold though. Very clear right now, and NO FA, it’s gone. I did see some fish come out of the weeds near the bank as I walked along. Just weird, could be weather related, but it’s the first time I’ve put out feed without the water boiling. (In 4 years).
Thx
Jeff

I hand feed around the pond nearly every day (although now I have a feeder newly installed).

I would notice around the time of a storm or change in weather pattern there would be some days the fish just did not seem much interested. I would throw out a little feed but maybe only a fourth as much. Usually the next day or two they would back to being ravenous.

I think fish (and most wild animals for that matter) are used to going from feast to famine, depending on the availability of the food at the time. Of course we want them to keep growing so want them to eat. But I think they are adapted to having lots then little. Maybe just part of their instinctual eating patterns????

Hope that’s all it is John. I think I’ll pull the old food out, and go with the fresher food. Plus the mixture of BG and LMB feeds. It’s just weird to see the feeder shoot all that feed out there, and then,,, nothing..

I use a weather underground station to view the weather near my pond and to monitor the rainfall. This is a network of privately owned stations anyone can access. The thing I like best is the ability to view data by day, week, or month that the station has been operating.
For instance over the past few days we have had a substantial drop in atmospheric pressure, this could influence fish feeding if in your area also. Here is link to one in my area, you can use search function to find a local one.
weather underground

article on pressure and fish feeding

Setter, are your feeding TIMES still the same as before? I know nothing about YP but your bluegill should be doing something.My pond is about the same age as yours and the only times (other than winter) have I seen no activity at all was after I either had a otter or a water turkey show up. Even after I solved the problem it seems each time it took about 2-3 days for them to get "back" to their regular feeding frenzy. Hope for sure that's not the problem you have. I'm sure if you give them a day or two whatever has them "turned off" they will be back. Best of luck to you.

Sure hope so. I have a GBH that visits, but he’s been around since day one. (Along with a couple green herons and a few kingfishers).
I hope it’s not an otter, but I’ve seen zero evidence of one being around.
Maybe roundy is on the nose. Big pressure drop. I’ll look into it. It’s about 15 degrees cooler today than yesterday.

I haven’t changed feeding times, but the feeder was empty for a few days.

Fishing was pretty slow last weekend. We caught 10 YP, 5-6 HBG, 3 RES, and several GS. Grandkids all fishing with worms. No SMB, which is unusual, and of course, no HSB, I haven’t seen one in four years. We usually have double those numbers.

I believe the fish have to show up and 'try' the feed before they know the feed is good or bad, so I don't think the age of your feed has to do with the no-shows.

It's certainly odd, but then you did say that you've seen fish, so no reason to believe they're not still in there.

Exactly. No evidence of dead ones, or trespassers. Just a fluke, I guess,, I hope!
Found a dead crawdad and a dead tadpole after the copper sulfate went in. It says on the package it doesn’t harm fish.. Hopefully they’ll get back to eating.

In Spring I turn off my feeder depending on weather conditions - feeding can vary during cold fronts which leads to significant uneaten pellets/pending water quality issues and I shut down during nasty North winds 15 MPH+ which blows a lot of feed to shore. Missing a day here or there doesn't impact fish growth IMO, based on the compensatory feeding theory.

I feed multiple 1 second throws during Spring until weather stabilizes, then I might pump up to 2 seconds - I feed 15 minutes apart. I suspect my fish density is significantly higher than yours due to very high predator population to manage my BG, I'm wondering if you are feeding too much. Lusk says feed only what fish can clean up in 10 minutes...I use a 5 minute rule myself in order to watch the feed bill and potential water quality issues due to wasted shore blown pellets. Also, I want all my apex predators to be encouraged to hammer my BG population...feed is SUPPLEMENTAL after all, not the sole source of forage/nutrition.

With all that in mind, consider shutting down the feeder during adverse feeding conditions and monitor your feeding activity. You could be feeding too much. Try 1 second throws 15 min apart...

Roundy - good post thank you. I've always wanted the ability to remotely change my feeding based on variable weather conditions - too bad that technology doesn't exist. This would be huge for absentee land owners...in addition to a feeder cam to monitor activity...

I have had two instances this year with NO feeding activity (HBG). One of the times I had measured water temps a couple of days before, then a 4.5" cool rain came in and the fish showed no interest for two days. The water temp dropped 6 degrees from the rain event (66 degrees back down to 60). My pond has some excess watershed which seems to amplify the cool rain effects. Combine the temperature drop with some added muddy water, change in barometric pressure and no one was interested in the feed. They started back up rather slow, but within a few days they were back to it like I would expect.

The other no-feed event was not as well documented, but corresponded with a cool rain event as well.

You stated the feeder was empty a few days and I assume you were talking in a row. That would certainly throw my fish off and would take them a couple of days to realize the buffet was back open. I really doubt you have anything to worry about. Keep us in the loop how they progress!!

Thanks TJ, I’ve always followed your 5 min rule in the past. I was feeding at dawn and dusk 8 seconds each. A
I’m also sure your fish density is a lot higher than mine.
I can’t come up and manage the feeder based on weather conditions. Just not feasible at this time. So I have to set it and let it run, but I run low run times. Twice a day.
I really think I found the problem. The empty bag I looked at was not the one I found in storage. That bag was still in the back of the utv. Looking closely at that bag I found a date of 5/14 on it. Optima must have just been getting started. I took that very old feed out of the feeder. It had almost no odor at all. The new feed has a much stronger fish smell. In fact as I was removing it, I spilled some, and my Setter wasn’t interested. Tells me a lot right there.
I’m hoping the old feed didn’t hurt the fish. I did a 2 second test run with the new feed and had some results. Not super strong, but the larger swirls were coming back.
I left it at 10 seconds a day (5 seconds at dawn and 5 at dusk). Hopefully that isn’t enough to cause water quality issues, if they aren’t hitting it all in 5 minutes.
I’ll not use old feed again..
Jeff

Unless the feed is moldy, you're not hurting fish with old feed, but they are likely not deriving much benefit from it, either...just creating lots of fish waste. I'd use all feed within 6-12 months of manufacture date, sooner if possible. Buy fewer bags at a time - this helps you keep it fresh.

You know your fish feeding habits, but 8 seconds seems like a long time when you're just feeding YP and HBG. Are you verifying pellets are all cleaned within 10 min? Checking all the banks? Be sure to watch how long it takes for them to clean that up, and check the shoreline for wasted pellets. Again I feed 1-2 seconds max every 15 min and this ensures all pellets are consumed...Right now I'm using 1 second throws at 7:50 PM and in 15 minute increments until 8:50 [five feedings]. When fish start to clean it up in 3 minutes I will increase to 2 seconds to keep within that five minute range.

Obviously do what works for you, just sharing my method to help eliminate excessive waste and reduce the food budget.

Thanks TJ. Before this the food was getting eaten up in just a few minutes. I don’t know if the SMB are feed trained or not. Plus the infamous, invisible HSB may be getting some too. But the feed has been gone in a couple of minutes. I actually thought I was feeding on the low side.
I somehow had forgotten about that one bag of feed. It sat in the locker for a few years. I order direct form Optima one BG and one LMB it takes a while to use that much feed.

Thanks again.
Jeff

I would guess, your application of copper sulfate crystals caused algal die-off, thus oxygen depletion as the dead algae decay.

Joey, would that just cause a slow down on feeding? Hopefully not fatal to the fish. No fish floating, but I’ve never had many floaters. Seems like the colder water I have makes them sink.
I’ll be back there Monday and see how they are feeding. I didn’t have that much FA at least compared to other ponds in the area. My banks are fairly steep. The FA was all fairly close to the bank.

Jeff your water temps are low enough in mid to upper 60s I guess...imagine your DO levels were just fine provided you didn't treat significant areas of the pond with copper. Try to relax, back off the feeding during major weather shifts, [anticipate low feeding at those times], and resume when the weather stabilizes. You worry too much, amigo...enjoy your pond!

SG....Our place is just east of Jerseyville, Illinois (west central IL) and the fish have been very slow to come to the feeder so far this year. Last weekend the water was about 60 on Friday and Saturday and only a handful of fish came to feed when the TX Hunter went off at 8:30 am and 5:15 pm.

I have had the feeder running just 8 seconds twice each day for about 2 weeks. Fish are just not moving much and the water is staying cooler than normal so far this year. This weekend won't help as the highs near St. Louis are only going to be in the mid-to-upper 50s.

I was concerned at first but with all the crazy, cold spring weather we have had it makes sense that LMB and BG are moving a little slower so far this season. A week of 75 degree weather will get them on the pellets. In our experience, a copper sulfate treatment made absolutely no difference in feeding patterns. BM61.

Thanks TJ. Every year it’s something different. I guess I’m still just a little inexperienced at all this. Five years seems like a long time, but it’s always something new..

BM61, yep my pond by Mark Twain Lake is straight west of you. Good news about the Copper Sulfate, and non-effects on feeding. Amazing weather this spring. I always swim by Memorial Day. Maybe not this year..

I agree with TJ. Since your water temps were lower, your starting DO was high and the decrease in DO from decaying vegetation won't kill the fish. It is just mother nature's reaction to decreasing DO levels.

In all honesty, my DO Meter is the best pond investment I ever made.

I have had the same problem of feeding and no fish come to the table! The weather here in Michigan has been up and down really bad this spring, with lots of rain, warm day followed by a cool to nearly cold and our temps are dropping into the 30s again, and it is MAY! But, even though they are not feeding they will hit a hook and worm, so I guess we just need warmer weather and time to adjust to mother nature's idea of spring/summer.

Was back at the pond this morning. Wanted to see if anything had changed. Good news, everything appears to be back to normal. Feed was cleaned up in a couple of minutes. Caught several, and released HBG and YP. All looked very healthy.
I may have had my first encounter with a HSB. I put out the trap and caught 20+ 1-3” HBG. I threw out a couple under bobbers in the middle of the pond. One went under, and I had a pretty nice fish on for a short while. He tossed the hook though, unseen.
Since it was near the middle of the pond I suspect HSB vs a SMB.
No other fish in the trap besides HBG. I was hoping for some small YP..

Possible hookup with the elusive HSB....now you have my attention.
This requires further research.

I'll bring the beer and lawnchairs.

Ha! I wonder where the best place is to run the hook through the small HBG? I ran it through the highest point below the dorsal fin. I would have thought I had him hooked well enough. Definitely going to try it again though.

If you're using a circle hook, I'd run it from its bottom jaw up through the nostril. Thats how I rig live shiners for bass. Live bait is usually taken head first. Circle hook will cut way down on gut hooking your HSB.

Through the eye sockets works pretty good too.

Ditto the circle hook recommendation.

Source hand throw LMB pellets, HSB prefer them, will soon get trained to look for them primarily provided their gape is sufficient. Optimal LMB pellets are smaller than AM - that's what I'd try. Once your HSB are used to taking the larger pellet it's very simple process to collect them anytime you're feeding with pellet fly or pantyhose wrapped pellet. If they exist in your fishery, you're guaranteed to get a strike - just set and reel it in. I advise laying off HSB angling once water temps hit 80s as they can fight themselves to exhaustion/death. I shut down all fishing from late June until September as I've lost too many trophy SMB and HSB even with a quick fight and clean release. Just not worth the risk for me.

Jeff - did you get a chance to review this post regarding HSB sampling? Call me if you want happy to help as always.

TJ, I just now read the post. Sorry about that. Thanks for the info. I’m headed back up on Friday. I have Optima LMB feed now, so I’ll try hand tossing some from the boat. I’ve also got some flies that look like pellets, although they sink.
We just keep getting crazy rain. Had 1.5” Sunday evening. Supposed to get more tonight, tomorrow, and almost every day for the next week.
We were out over the weekend, so I haven’t seen it for a week.

I’ll also get some circle hooks. Not sure what they even look like. Aren’t they the ones that set themselves. I’ll do some research.

Thx

I like the Gamakatsu Octopus circle hooks for fishing live or cut bait. I expect there are other brands that work equally as well.

Live bait under a float or free-lined - the hook will set itself, almost always in the corner of the mouth,
when the fish runs with the bait. Same deal tight-lined on the bottom. They work great and you will rarely, if ever, gut-hook a fish.

Jeff - I cut and tie pantyhose around a LMB pellet and tie off top with some sewing thread and trim off the top excess hose. I run a size 2 octopus hook through the pantyhose, cast, and hang the heck on. Of course you want your HSB to start anticipating your hand thrown pellets - get them acclimated to a pattern, then you can start angling for them during feeding time. If you use braid I find a 8-12" 12# mono or floro leader provides a margin of error on hookset and provides stealthier presentation, too. Bear in mind my HSB will not feed until dusk or during cloudy conditions...so evening is the best time for me. I can walk you through this if you want to call...always make time for PB Family.

Yep, good advice here.

Thank you both! I’ll try this weekend with the hand tossed feed. Will stop today and get some circle hooks. I would assume my HSB are dusk feeders also..
I’ve watched the last few years, some pretty big swirls around the pond. I know they have to have been made by a pretty good sized fish. I also see schools of fry jumping out of the water as they are being pursued by another big swirl or wake. I’m sure some are my SMB, but I’ve always had hope that some HSB survived. I have a lot of GS, so if they are there, they should be healthy.
Hooking them in the corner of the mouth sounds good also. Do they make a small enough hook that the grandkids could use them for worms? I keep all the male YP they catch no matter how they are hooked, but a few of the females have been hooked deep and I’ve had to keep them.
Thanks again

Eagle Claw L787
Owner 5185, 51775114
Gamakatsu 02506, 02507
Berkeley FSN19DRSH2, FSN19DRSH4, FSN19DRSH6

All of these are in the size 2-8 range.

Thanks Augie, I’m in CoMo today, hopefully will have time to swing by BassPro before heading back home.

Edit, these hooks really wouldn’t be a good fit with the grandkids, worms, and bobbers would they? We’ve been teaching them to set the hook, and you don’t set the hook with these, correct?

they'll work fine under a bobber for YP. By the time the kids see the bobber take off, the fish is already hooked for the most part. A smaller sized non circle octopus will usually not gut hook a fish when under a bobber. Using ice jigs will greatly reduce gut hooking as well

BTW I've only seen my hsb feed twice....and have never caught one haha I sure hope they're still in the pond

Ha! I’m not alone!! All I hear is how hard they fight. I hope this is the summer I actually see one.
Thx

Got in and out of BassPro for under $100. I did get three packs of hooks.

The HSB are very illusive, mine just started showing themselves, since last year, IF the the breeze blows feed far enough into the pond. They are unmistakable when they surface!

I had some really Big and aggressive feeding going on early this spring at the feeder, but now not so much, at least for the last few weeks. I couldn’t tell if they were SMB or what (HSB)?

TJ, I was at the pond this morning. Still just running 4 seconds twice a day. I hadn’t been there when the feeder went off for several weeks. The feed was gone in less than a minute. I thought about adding time, but I think 90% of the feed is being eaten by the HBG. I’m not all that interested in helping them. I put out a trap and caught 20+ fish. All HBG, except for one Golden Shiner. Maybe my RES have crossed with the HBG. Not sure. This one may be pure RES.

He’s stuffed full of Optima.

Jeff, that's a pretty fish!

Hey Jeff that's a beautiful looking GRES! Did you hand feed LMB pellets? Only your SMB and HSB should be able to handle that diameter.

Beautiful colors ! Looks like a HBG X RES.

Thanks all. Out of about 20 in the fish trap, there were three or four that had this coloration.
TJ, I was on the mower most of the time I was at the farm. Spent about an hour at the pond, near sunset, then went back early the following morning for about an hour. I haven’t had time to hand toss any feed. I do have the BG and LMB feeds mixed in the TH Feeder. I know it’s throwing at that rate 50/50. All the feed is gone in seconds. I see a flash and a swirl, but I can’t see what fish is taking what feed. Some of these HBG crosses have much larger mouths. Possibly they, or possibly the YP might be eating the Optima LMB? We have rain tonight and for the next three days. I believe our drought is over. My renter sprayed roundup on the fields above the pond. The weeds are history, now more and more rain. I’m getting great runoff. Possibly too much, and now some erosion from the fields. My water has a weird color, almost like tea. Keeps visibility down to a few inches. Hopefully the rain will eventually let up, and the water will clear. The fish can sure see the food though.
Edit, well, the pic doesn’t look much like tea, but it’s a different brown than it was when full of suspended clay.

TJ, I tried hand feeding yesterday. 8:00-8:15. I threw a few handfuls of Optima Bass food out. Nothing came up for it. I waited 20 min. Tried two spots, both had the same result. Out of curiosity I ran the feeder for a few seconds. It was cleaned up after a bit, but not as fast as usual. My feeder goes off a 7:00. (I’ll push it back to 8:30 today)
Some larger fish hit the surface hard. Not sure if they were taking feed, or other fish. As usual, the only fish I could clearly identify were the HBG. Can’t clearly see YP. Water clarity is only about 12”. I believe it’s algae, not suspended clay. Maybe some staining from the millions of hardwood leaves that fall in the pond every fall.
I’ll try hand throwing again, probably on Mon or Tues..