I have a confession to make.

I'm a big, fat liar.

I've told hundreds of people over the years that I know absolutely nothing about control of aquatic vegetation. I'm thankful for people who know lots about this, but my brain is full with fish knowledge, and I have no desire to discuss vegetation control with other pondmeisters. I actually know just enough to be dangerous, but I tell people that (in the words of Sgt. Shulz) "I KNOW NOTHINK"!!

Anyway, I have a neighbor with a 1/2 acre pond who has about 30% of the shoreline overrun with cattails. He wants to spray it himself, but I'd like to know any other forum member's opinion on a single application herbicide that would nuke this crap.

Thanks,

Bruce

I used round up on mine last year in three different spots then after it died I burnt it all down now this year two of the spots are coming back but the third one is not probably the best thing to do is pull them up by hand I read on here about the round up so I tried it

Thanks! Let's get as many comments as we can here, so I can archive this!

I have also used roundup and it worked very well and it didn't kill any fish but i was very careful and tried to keep as much as i could out of the pond.

I use Shore Clear with Cygnet adjuvant and it does a good job. They are both cleared for aquatic control. It would be very difficult to do a good job spraying cattails and not get a significant amount of the spray in the water. Roundup is definitely NOT cleared for aquatic use. Killing fish is not the only harm chemicals can do to your water.

If the cattails are thick and extend a ways out into the water it will be hard to get them all in a single treatment. Getting good herbicide coverage on everything is the issue. Rodeo and the right surfactant works well but it is very likely he will need to retreat anything that got missed in three to five weeks.

Why not stay away from harsh chemicals and go the organic route?

Introduce muskrats and snapping turtles to the pond. They both eat cattails.

Cattplex works well and is cheaper than round up and is fish, pet and people safe. 53.8% Glysophate and Round up super Concentrate is 50.3%
Sancoind.com

Be sure to use a glyphosate formulation that is labeled for use near water bodies.

+1

If it's not listed on the label as safe to use in the water and you do, and bad things happen, then there's the possibility of being liable. The label is law, if it isn't rated for pond use, then it hasn't been tested in ponds.

Round-up is at the most what, 53% Glyphosate? What's the other 47%? (That's the part that is not rated for pond use.)

Bruce:

Either dig them up with heavy equipment or spray them with an 8% glyphosate mix with 1-2 oz of non-ionic surfactant added to each gallon of tank mix. Wet them to just to the point of herbicide run-off, trying to wet as much of the growing cattails as possible. If he pays attention to how he's spraying, and gets 'em all, then they should all die. Like what was said, it might take 2-3 applications, depending on how good he is with the sprayer.

Add 1-2 ounces of pond dye to the sprayer to see what was sprayed if a little blue dye doesn't bother him. (either in the water or on him, depending on how careful he is)

I've been treating my cattails for 7 years using glyphosate without issues, but Scott's buffered method with surfactant might be safer. Definitely cheaper and less invasive than mechanical removal. I also think it's a more effective long range control method.

Scott's method is great! Did the job 100% kill on two stands. Now have 2 new stands in another area, gonna go whack-a-mole soon.

Shore-klear that comes with a surfactant mixed in. Usually two applications are required. Once they turn yellow whack them off with a weed cutter and rake them in. Then discard.

I kinda like Cattails.

Most cats are kinda partial to them too!

Cover Them up with large rocks?

Cecil, can ya be specific as to what is the exact name of what you're referring to? I googled and came up with three different kinds and am not sure which has the surfactant blended in. Probably the one that is $95.65 plus $15 s&h a qt. YIKES!!!

I'm using pasture dye or pond dye on every spray tank now. I was surprised how much coverage I missed.

Thanks everybody so far...

I'm not looking for a resolution, or a "best" answer, but merely a collection of different strategies and viewpoints.

Just went down and looked at the container. My apologies it's called Shoreklear-Plus which as I said has the surfactant mixed in. I got it either are Tractor Supply Comapany (TSC) or Rural King. Can't remember which.

O.K. it must have been TSC:

http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/wcs/...mp;cm_vc=-10005

FYI, I get Shoreklear at Rural King, and it's $20 a gallon cheaper then at TSC.

Is it the Shoreklear-plus or the regular Shoreklear?

It's the plus formulation. Also, TSC has Cutrine plus for $59.99, and it's $34.99 at Rural King. $29.99 when you catch it on sale.

Tony,

Just bought some more Aquashade at TSC for just under $50.00. I normally get it from Scot but I was in a hurry and I think he's out of the state right now.

Good to know there are better prices if you know where to shop.

In an unexpected (and questionable) move last fall, Monsanto retired their former aquatic-glyphosate brand known as AQUAMASTER and replaced it with; drum-roll please - "ROUNDUP CUSTOM".
Talk about confusing the market-place! Here we've preached for decades "Don't use ROUNDUP in aquatic sites!"... Now, that story has changed - sort of...
For what it's worth: There are numerous versions of ROUNDUP (XYZ) in the marketplace, not to mention multiple more flavors and concentrations of glyphosate under other brand names. Yes, there are disctinct differences between the various brands and formulations that exceed their "active ingredient" concentrations.
In short (and to my knowledge), virtually all but one brand-name of glyphosate labeled for aquatic sites contain 53.8% active-ingredient - and NO surfactant - so the addition of an appropriate surfactant (that is intended for aquatic sites) is necessary for maximized activity and performance on targeted plants.
ADDENDUM: Shore-Klear Plus IS labeled for aquatics and DOES contain a pre-blended surfactant. However, it is an 18% glyphosate formulation versus the 53.8% a.i. for most other aquatic-labeled formulations.
-
As usual, the one thing that is consistant is change.....

Interesting thread....I don't use Roundup except in the gravel driveway, Rodeo around the pond but I'm going to look into Shoreklear. Anyone know how safe it is around animals?

My experiences. I have three farmer friends that use Roundup in their ponds for years now with no known problems. I try to have a natural pond but I did spray full grown cattails in front of my deck in the middle of last summer and the kill was complete with none showing up so far this year in the sprayed area of about 50x50 feet. I use Eliminator from Walmart for about $ 10. I did small sample sprayings using different strength with and without dishwasher sufficient. I had dozen of minnows try to eat the spray bubbles on the water with no ill effects. The spray that really worked for me was 4 ozs. of Eliminator to one gal. of water or the whole bottle makes 2 1/2 gallons as I remember.

I've often wondered about just how much damage chemicals in ponds can do. In no way am I advocating wholesale or unwise use of chemicals in ponds.

However, when I think about it, one inch of water over one acre is 27,000 gallons at approx 8 3/4 pounds per gallon. If I figure a one acre pond with an average depth of 10 ft, I come up with a big chunk of water. Do your own math. So, what damage can 6 oz of Roundup, with a surfactant thrown in, mixed in 5 gallons of water really do when sprayed on shoreline plants?

Please remember and understand: I'm not giving advice here.

I'm one of the oddballs on this site that thinks there's a place on my pond for cattails. I use them at the north ends for erosion and nutrient control...which of course means I have to keep removing them on the 1/2 of the pond I DON'T want them.

I use a combo approach...mechanical cutting/pulling where I can get to them via tractor and/or scythe, and occasionally spraying them with shoreklear for the really hard to reach areas. For me cattails aren't something to be eradicated. Instead I just try to keep a balance.

Ask me in a few years if this works out...I don't pretend to know what I'm doing. I'm pretty much making it up as I go.

I still say the approval of a herbicide depends on how many thousands of dollars a company is willing to spend on testing of a product to show low levels of toxicity to aquatic life vs. whether it should be safe by doing comparisons. At least that is the case with drugs in aquaculture. There are very few drugs approved for aquaculture because the market is not large enough to justify the high costs of testing.

Dale, that's not a bad idea. Alan(FIH) has found that Lusk gave some good advice some years back on a visit to his pond. If you kill pond vegetation, another will almost always take it's place. And, you might dislike the newcomer more than you did the original one.

Just a note on using chemicals. Always mix them exactly as the label says and they will work if applied as directed. Also, mix them immediately before you use them and do not leave them in the tank for use tomorrow. Every chemical has a PH it likes to dwell at and mixing it with water of a different PH will alter the chemical and render it ineffective. The greater the difference in PH, the quicker it will break down the chemical in the tank. Something about atoms in the chemical bonding with iron atoms in the water. IIRC, name brand chemicals, the instructor mentioned Roundup, have added buffers to reduce the problem but generics usually do not. He said some chemicals can lose over 50% of their efficacy in 30 minutes in a tank with water of a large PH difference.

John, my grandmother used powdered DDT in the garden and had no ill effects from it to. Why isn't it on the market now?

When I went thru the class for my applicators license, they said the label was the law. I can't agree with using something that is NOT labeled for pond use in the pond.

Just like my grandmother, using it may be OK and then again maybe not. I don't want to tell someone to use something that might cause harm, or is illegal.

MSC I agree with that completely. When I had muskrats my cattails and spatterdock were kept at eye pleasing levels. But when I got my dog Dolly they left. So I sprayed the cattails in front of my deck and what happens,,,I now have curly leaf pond weed that is too thick in place of the cattails. Now my grass carp may take care of that over time or maybe I need a few more. Every action has a reaction doesn't it.

Fluridone completely killed off all cattails, but the treatment was for duck weed. The cattails were just a bonus.

The last time this topic came up I mentioned that I use a copper ground wire where cattails used to grow. I had one member say it would never work. But the fact remains that it has worked for me for years. Plus no chemicals.

John could you give details on how you use the copper ground wire?

Its a copper ground wire that I run along where the cattails were growing. I killed them first with a herbicide, but that was years ago.

IMO you will get more value by scrapping the copper.

John,

Had something similar happen. I eliminated some ferrel cats and next thing I know I have a chipmunk explosion in the garden.

Adding Giant burreed to replace the cattails would work.