I’m getting ready to plant permanent grass around the new pond to replace the annual rye grass I planted for temporary cover. That got me to thinking about mowing. I cut most of the rye grass with my bush-hog and string trimmers on the dam and around the edge. We finally got it finished, and I’m ready for the hydroseeding guy to come tomorrow.

I have a tractor and bush hog plus a Cub Cadet SL1554 riding mower. The tractor and bush hog scare me on slopes and near the edge. And I doubt that the Cub would even have enough power to manage the slopes. I first thought about a sickle mower, but read on some threads here that they are a pain. I had considered a DR or Kunz or Swisher offset trail mower. But when I called my Cub dealer, he mentioned the Cub Cadet Z-Force S models that are zero turn, but have a traditional-looking steering wheel that I understand controls the hydraulics for the power wheels. He thought it would be safer than a regular zero turn mower on slopes. Then someone suggested the Gizmow Formula mower (http://www.gizmow.com/home.htm) . It also has a steering wheel, and it looks like the Cub on steroids. Apparently it was designed specifically for slopes. It’s out of my price range, but it sure looks nice.

Anyway, I was just wondering if others had researched this issue and had some relevant experience with some of the options above. I have seen a few threads dealing in part with mowers, but I thought I would see what others think about the alternatives.

Thanks,

Charles

Charles, I was out mowing the slopes at my pond with a zero turn Ferris 1500 today. I have made up
my mind. I am going to pay someone to bring a backhoe out to make the slopes easier to deal with.
When i built my pond i thought it was ok for the mower. But that was with my backside sitting in a cat d3 not the mower, big difference. I should have lowered the slopes sooner but i didnt. It will be easier to make a permanant soloution to the lay of the land than buying a special mower. With the hyd steering of the zero turn mower its not possible to "feel" the tires starting to slip, so
i cannot stop it in time if it spins. My recomendation is to make less of a slope before you sod or lay grass. It will be the best decision, i feel.

I use a small 4WD Kubota tractor with loaded tires for a low center of gravity for my slopes. Also I have stone coming partway up from the water so I dont have to try and get the tractor down very far.

The 4WD is a must for anything you plan on driving on a slope IMO

I find that I have a lot more time since I stopped the recreational mowing. Adopting a natural pond edge saves time and money, discourages geese, and helps out a lot of wildlife. A floating dock allows me access for swimming, and a kayak allows me ample fishing access. The older I get, the more I appreciate a natural landscape. If you must mow and the ground is not too wet, a walk behing Scag zero-turn cannot be beat on slopes for a finish cut. Don't use unless the ground and grass are dry or you'll slip and slide. My 36-inch hydro is over 20-years old with no problems. You'll have to work pretty hard to flip it.

That's my understanding too about the regular zero turn mowers. You can't stop them going down hill, and they won't stay on the slope going sideways. I just got back from looking at the Cub Z-Force 48" with the steering wheel. The front wheels are controlled by the steering wheel--not on casters like a regular zero-turn mower. I think the steering wheel is also coupled to the drive like a regular zero turn. It's a hydrostatic drive like my Cub LT1554, and when you take your foot off the pedal, it stops on a dime. It seemed like it might work pretty well on slopes.

But I also want to look at the Gizmo Force. It is similar I think, but heavier duty and bigger--and a lot more expensive.

That's my long-term goal too. What I really want is warm season native grasses. But all the experts advised me to go ahead and get some turf started first, and then come back and convert to NWSG gradually once I have the dirt stable. What I want long-term is a mixture of NWSG and wildflowers.

I traverse my 3:1 sloped dam with a Ferris IS2000 and navigate a fair amount of ruts and loose stones. The suspension makes all the difference. I tested three zero turn mowers; Dixie Chopper, Xmark and Ferris. Chopper and the Xmark almost immediately broke free sliding sideways down the dam only to be saved by the rip rap (dealer was driving). I have to admit that I am pushing it's limits but two years running and it has stayed dry and on course. Wouldn't even consider running it on a steeper slope.

I agree with your recommendation to ease the slope now rather than waste effort on sodding or laying grass on a difficult-to-mow area. We're already experiencing here that the zero-turn mowers are just too finnicky to mow slopes. We'll get the dozer out eventually to fix our predecessor's mistake but until then I'll probably resort to push mowing and string trimming. I like the speed and agility of zero-turns but there are times we've run off into the pond far too easily. Fortunately the ATV is handy to winch it out!

Blane, I agree. I take my ferris almost everywhere my dozer used to go, they are top notch and mine handles my 3 to 1 slope but thats it. Nothing steeper. But less of a slope is always better. I only mow around the pond cause the kids are always there and i dont want them to come up on a snake.

I use my Cub Cadet GT2544 which is a bigger, more powerful tractor, but with a small deck to cut as close as I dare. I have slid it in twice and had to winch it out with the ATV. This is always good to get the heart racing!
I also use a push mower and string trimmer to finish up, but it is a pain and takes me longer to trim than it does to cut the rest of the yard.

Swisher makes a tow behind offset string trimmer that looked like it might have done the job. It was called a PostMaster and was intended to get you in close to a fence row. I could not make a decent deal with our TSC store and gave up on it. Unlike a regular offset tow behind, this thing had a set of small wheels that would stay up on high ground and leave the trimmer portion floating out to the waters edge.
http://www.swisherinc.com/postmaster.asp

I prefer my string trimmer. It may be a little more work, but . . .





Be careful! Be very careful!

I'm stuck with the slope I have, because the dam is pretty close to the fence line. It is about 3 to 1 in the steepest part.

Has anyone tried either of the zero-turn mowers with the steering wheels? They are supposed to perform better on slopes (even mowing across the slope), because the front wheels are not on casters, and will not tend to turn down the hill. I did a parking lot test of the Cub, and it worked pretty well. The only two down sides I observed were that the steering is a little hard to turn, and the deck can be set in only up or down positions unless you stop and reset a pin for a different height adjustment. As for the Gismow, the dealer is fifty miles away, and he doesn't stock them anyway. But it sure looked neat in the promo videos (at a cost about 100$ more than the Cub. The two WEB sites are Cub: http://tinyurl.com/27fbugn and Gismo: http://www.gizmow.com/home.htm. The Gizmow video sure makes it look almost fun. http://www.gizmow.com/video.htm

That's why I don't want to get close to the edge with my tractor and bush hog. You can get killed doing that.

Get some sheeps, they'll keep your lawn down for free, and in the late autum you eat them, and get some new next year.

Paul, the Texas coyotes would eat the sheep long before autumn.

We had a very similar discussion about this time last year:
Mowing Pond Edge
It had a number of good suggestions.

Actually, I do have sheep.

I was up to about 65 last year, but thinned them down to just three to keep them off the pond during construction. I'll probably add some back after the grass gets established.

We have a few coyotes, but they haven't been a problem. It's the neighborhood sweet little old dogs that have been a bigger problem. Coyotes usually kill for food. Dogs kill for sport.

I had read that thread. Lots of good info there. That was what made me eliminate sickle mowers from my list.

Charles

[/quote]
That's why I don't want to get close to the edge with my tractor and bush hog. You can get killed doing that. [/quote]

Funny how even a 4WD tractor acts on a soft, muddy pond bank. The more you try to steer away from the bank, the more they slip toward the water. Best thing to do when they start acting funny is to STOP and get another vehicle and a chain. Also funny is how it takes only a slight nudge to pull them out.

We don't have coyote here.
However we have wolf, bear, bobcat and eagles that predate on sheep, and dogs beeing the worst predator.
Shepards is not common anymore, but creative farmers use lamas (import from peru) in the sheep herd, they deefend them selves and the rest off the herd.
No match for a predator that really wants to kill, but they totally cnfuse the predator by counter atac so the predator choose another prey.
Those are way to expencive to slaughter in the fall do, but if you have the space available and the time to spare/nurse it you have a good employe.

I use a swisher trail mower and atv...never worry about it anymore.

That wet Deere looks like the loader is in the raised position - sure bet for a disaster on a steep slope

I thought I would bump this to see if anyone has any more thoughts on the possible benefits of the two mowers for slopes. The two I am looking at are the Gizmow Formula: http://www.gizmow.com/home.htm and the Cub Cadet Z Force S: http://tinyurl.com/27fbugn.

Both are Zero Turn, but they do not have the loose caster front wheels typical on ZTRs. They have a steering wheel to control both the rear wheel drives and the front wheels. The Gizmow is promoted as more stable on slopes than normal ZTRs. Their video demo is pretty impressive. http://www.gizmow.com/video.htm. I believe Massey Ferguson has a couple of similar models.

This is a very timely thread as I am starting to work on the landscape around my new pond. I have a JD 2305 (25 HP) with a 60 mower, bucket, blade, and tiller. My concern is where the water level is projected and the slope around the pond. I want to be able to mow it without rolling into the pond, which could be very serious.

Here are some photo's that somewhat show the slope.The flags(white and pink) are suppose to outline the water level.


This is the damn (east side), which I have reduced the slope a bit.


Here is the north side that doesn't look to bad til you get up towards the grass.



Here is the south side, which bothers me a bit.



This is the west side, which really concerns me.

So my question is does the current slopes look acceptable or is the thinking I need to flatten them out as I circle the pond.

Someone will ask: my goal for now is to mow up around the pond and not have a lot of growth. However I may need to for various reasons that will be pointed out to me as people respond.

That really doesn't look that bad. How's the pucker factor driving on it now?

The south side is the worse and maybe you can see the proposed waterline and where I can drive. A big difference in a couple of places. The pictures don't really do it justice, but it is nice to get the feedback.

If it's scarey now, it'll be worse when it's wet. Now's the time to change it if you have any doubts at all. The seed isn't down yet, is it?

Not going to seed till later in august. It's dry and I don't want to waste a lot of money.

Well, after a year or so investigating, I finally bit the bullet yesterday and ordered the 61" Gizmow. They are not being manufactured right now, but I found a dealer who said he can get it. It's supposed to arrive next week.

Last year it was so late by the time I got any grass growing that I decided to keep my Cub Cadet SLT-1554. But the grass came on like gangbusters this spring. The other day I must have cleared the outlet ten times. That was the last straw.

I looked at the Cub Cadet 48" and 60". They seemed OK, but the 60" did not have cruise control, and the foot pedal was stiff enough to be a problem for me. I have my fingers crossed that the Gizmow will fill the bill.

The Gizmow looks intersting. Let us know the result of your purchase, please.

DR markets a zero turn where you can flip the steering stalk back over the seat and walk behind the machine. This might be useful where the slope is a little dicey.

Cutting the slope on the pondside will always cause an adrenaline rush (or wet clothes).

Or soiled shorts.

Mostly.

I reckon I could handle both of those particular issues. It's the broken neck issue and the breathing water issue that worry me.

I did look at the DR mower Sniper mentioned. The DR mower can serve as an ordinary ZTR, but can convert to a walk-behind by flipping the handle over the mower. It looks pretty cool. http://www.drpower.com/z-mower.aspx
At my age, trying to walk behind a mower on a slope would be problematic, but it might be an option for some.

I once rode a riding lawnmower (with blades spinning) off a very steep bank down about 4' to the water. (The brakes were fixed on the mower the next day). It's amazing how many thoughts can go thru your mind in such a short amount of time.
It want something like this:
OH SH..!
Maybe I can stick my foot out and stop it.
No, the mower deck is running and I might cut my foot off.
What if I just hold on as it hits the pond?
And catch the steering wheel in the groin? How stupid are you?
O.K. What about the spinning blades?
I can jump out into the pond right as it hits the water, getting clear of it if it turns over.

That's what I did. Other than me getting wet and muddy, it was up and running less than an hour after dragging it out of the pond with no issues. The slope was 1:1 or a bit steeper. The frnt wheels just went over the edge and the rest of the machine (and me) followed in slow motion, ending up in about 3' to 4' of water.

I picked up the Gizmow today. Here she is:

This afternoon, in a couple of hours I manages to cut the approximately 4 acres surrounding the pond and my house. Those of you who followed my irrigation thread last year know that I have about 15 PVC irrigation pipes radiating out from the pond, which makes for lots of turning. The Gizmow made this a lot faster than with my old Cub Cadet SLT-1554. I was a little surprised that it really does do a zero turn. When I reaced the end of a pipe, I easily turned 180 degrees to cut along the other side. The mower is very fast, but when you make a sharp turn, it slows down just enough to feel comfortable with the turn. And the electric deck lift makes it easy to raise it a little while cutting parallel to a pipe, with the edge of the deck sticking slightly over the pipe. The one thing I did not like was that it stops VERY quickly when the cruise control disengages--feels like I ran into a stump. And sometimes it did disengage for no apparent reason--almost throwing me into the steering wheel.

So far I haven't worked up the nerve to try the back slope of the dam. But I did cut both sides of a ditch that runs in front of the house. As advertised, it held steady while mowing across the slope, which is about 10 degrees. It did not want to turn up the slope, but it never felt unstable.

I sure wonder why this brand was not successful. I have never used another traditional ZTR to compare with it, but I feel sure the Gizmow would compare favorably.

Today I finally worked up the nerve to mow part of the back side of the dam. Here is what it looks like:

The uncut area in the back of the image is the very steep section that I did not cut. My techniques was to mow straight down the slope, make a wide pass to the end of the dam, then back across the dam to mow downhill on the next section. I never felt any instability at all. It would probably handle the steepest sections as well, but not with me on board. And I have no intention of mowing the slope on the water side.

I'm not about others but I can see your pictures Farmer.

While we were enjoying our Saturday morning coffee, a friend came by and dropped this off for me to try around the pond.



It is basically a weed whacker on wheels -- with a 22-inch cut and a 6 HP engine. The great thing is that the mower part can be offset to cut well beyond the left or right wheel, allowing me to stay safe on the pond edge, while it cuts.

Offset Adjustment:


I know it may be hard to see from this photo, but the cutting portion is offset by several inches from the wheels.

That doesn't look bad. Is your tractor 4WD? You could just back into the parts that worry you instead of driving across the face.

If that big string trimmer came with an operator, I might give it a try.
Since my last post I have mowed the back side of the dam twice, and even worked up the nerve to cut the steeper portions. And I found the adjustment to increase the reverse power, so I can now mow straight down the slope and then reverse back up the slope. That works on all except the very steepest portions. On those I still mow down, circle across the dam, and then mow the next row.

I would feel perfectly safe mowing across slopes as much as 15 degrees (unlike a regular ZTR), and I would bet some younger and more foolhardy fellows would mow the whole dam sideways.

I have not yet tried mowing the water side of the dam; the reverse works well, but I would not trust it there.

Another fellow on a lawn mower forum purchased a Cub Cadet that is similar to my Gizmo.
http://www.lawnmowerforum.com/general-mower-discussion/1775-anyone-else-have-gizmow-3.html
That might be an option for those who are afraid to buy a discontinued model. Maybe next year I'll get back in the sheep business, but for now, the Gizmow sure made my life easier.

Mark -- my tractor is 4WD. But, more than once, I've had to use a winch to keep it from sinking too far into the pond.


Just last week I was mowing with my Cub Cadet lawn/garden tractor, which mows about six inches outside the tire lines. Since you are just down the road, you know we've had a little rain lately. The mud was pretty slippery. I slid more than a foot sideways to the the pond edge, with the left side well entrenched in the the mud. The friend who dropped off the machine in the photos above, just happened to be coming in my driveway at the time, and saw me. My wife was watching from the kitchen window (all very embarrassing). We dragged the Cub Cadet out, and I stayed at least 18 inches from the pond edge for the rest of my mowing experience that day.

Hey Cat. How have you been? That reply was for Boosone on the mowing as the pics he posted didn't really show that much grade to mow safely. Who knows though, pics can be deceiving.

It's good you were able to brake your tractor before it got sucked in! You're right about the rain. I have had problems keeping my pond full and now with all the rain and the rework we did it is overfull! Believe it or not the overflow gets clogged with debris and algae and the pond rises 3-4" OVER it. If I ever do this again I will pay for an engineer and spare no expense in construction. I am way north of 6 figures on this project.

Went to my first homeowners association meeting for where we're building our new house next to a pond. The association owns the pond. During the meeting I learned that the same lawn service guy had put his mower into the pond three times. I have two questions.

1) how many times does the average person need to drown a mower before learning the slope is too steep?

2) should I give the lawn guy the nickname "Structure?" The fish like him and his mower.

When I first bought this place the previous owners left a 13 hp craftsman riding mower. They said it didn't work. I replaced the fuse going to the ignition and everything was fine.

Until I was mowing around the pond that is. I dipped the front tires over the bank and away I went. (They didn't tell me that the brakes didn't work either.....) The bank there was 1:1 or even steeper.

It's amazing how many thoughts can go thru your mind in a split second. First was Oh Sh..!! Followed by "If I jump off now, the blades are still going and can I jump far enough to be clear of the machine when it hits the water? Nope. I'll just hang on here until the front end hits the water then I'll jump as far as I can." From the top of the bank to the water level was about 4 feet, and the water was about 3' deep at that spot.

After clearing the mower, I climbed out of the pond, grabbed my dad (who happened to be over at the house), a tow strap and the Suburban. After putting fresh gas and oil in it, it was back running about a half an hour later.

I never put it in the water again after that first time!

I dumped this sprayer setup two days ago into a ditch that I made to drain a field into a small wetland. I was going through high Bison grass and forgot about the ditch, and the brakes were useless as I slid down the 45 degrees bank before I knew it. I nearly went head over heels but managed to stay with the mower. Naturally the spray tank was full and heavy but I pulled it out with my old trusty Ford Ferguson tractor.

John, I also have one of the old Fords. It's an 8N and I guess about a 49 model. I think they run forever.

Careful Bassbuster. Some of us never learn.

I have been involved in the repair of outdoor power equipment for 15 years now. I have seen the results of mowing too close to the pond, or the ditch. Usually, it's minor, except perhaps for some body panel damage. (On both the operator, and the machine.) But, about 5 years ago, a woman I knew drowned in 8" of water when the riding mower she was on rolled over in a ditch and pinned her beneath it. She had no broken bones or damaged internal organs. She just couldn't push the mower off. Drowned in a ditch.

A piece of equipment will break free, and slide sideways in a heartbeat. They seldom just roll over, they slide first, hit an obstruction, and then roll over with surprising speed.

Excuse my bluntness, but if you're on one buttcheek and riding the fender while mowing the slope sideways, it's time to grab the weedeater or a pushmower. It's not worth it.

Also, mowing up and down the dam or bank is no guarantee the equipment won't slide free. Flipping sideways or over backwards can ruin your day.

Remember, if the equipment has a ROPS, then use a seatbelt. If it doesn't, then do not use a seatbelt.

Here you go.

I was out mowing the top of the dam on the Gizmow today contemplating whether I wanted to take on the slope of the back side. All of a sudden six shadows crossed my path at high speed. I looked up, and there was a flock of six pure white doves flying over the pond in formation. A minute or so later they flew back across in the opposite direction. When they made their third pass I decided this must be a sign from above that today is not the day to take on the slope.

Seriously, I have never seen birds like those before. Wonder if they were native birds or perhaps some captive pigeons that got away.

Dave I love my little Ford Ferguson, almost like an 8N, and bought it used in 1975. It has a bucket and grader I keep on it all the time. I also have a two bottom plow, disk, bush hog and I used to have a vertical hydraulic wood splitter. Kind of like a Swiss army knife, it has almost everything.

I used to mow around the pond with a DR electric start stinger on wheels but later I decided just to have a natural pond. So now I mow one walking strip around the pond. That takes about two minutes and makes my life a lot easier. But I used to mow around every young tree I planted in the 5½ acres surrounding the pond with a riding mower, and I mulched each and every young tree with semi truck loads of tree mulching my tree surgeon neighbor would give me. As I think back now I have no idea how I could have done all that work.

Amen to that. Even here in NE Texas, and during a drought, the greenery just keeps on growing.

A nice growth of duckweed, et al is good around the pond. I notice it catches some of the leaves and debris that would ultimately end up in the pond.

That's my story...and, you know,..