Hello folks, call me an idiot or what you will, but I have a relatively small pond that cattails are slowly taking over. I have a few fish and alot of frogs in the pond that I do not want damaged as I enjoy frog gigging as well as the post gig feast of legs. This being said I am not crazy about using roundup. Which brings forth the question that I pose to you: What is the best thing that I can use to kill cattails without harming my frogs and fish?

Thanks for your time
Wes

Wes, Do you have the ability to alter your water levels? How big and how deep is the pond?

Wes :

See the post under Quest. and Observ. under "Attn: Bill Cody" dated 5-11-05 where the product "Habitat" is discussed. This may help.

wes - I'll copy and put below Kelly Duffie's discussion about the herbicide called Habitat so you and others do not have to search for it. It reads:

Information posted By K Duffie and questions by others...

There is (we have) a 1-gal. aquatic & turf labeled glyphosate product called GLYPHOMATE 41 (as in 41% a.i.) in 1-gal containers, and it already contains a surfactant (mfgr is PBI Gordon).
However, I have become a quick convert to BASF's newly registered HABITAT Herbicide (imazapyr) for treating rooted emergent species; especially lilies (if irrigation and potable uses are not an issue; otherwise glphosate is your only option).
HABITAT has demonstrated exceptional root-control on species that are rooted in the hydrosoil. Glyphosate frequently has difficulty providing "great" root control on rooted-emersed plants that grow in water-depths that exceed a few inches. KD

Questions -
1. DO YOU JUST SRAY THIS ON THE LEAVES THAT FLOAT ON THE WATER? THANKS FOR THE INFO?.

2. can this new product "habitat" be effectively used on cattails before the catkin forms?? If so, when?

3. I'm also assuming that this product can "smoke" American lotus. I'm sure the answers are out there, but I haven't been able to visit the site for quite some time.

Kelly Duffie's Reply -
Basically, Yes, Yes & Yes.
HABITAT is an AHAS inhibiting herbicide (for the technically-interested); somewhat similar in mode of action to ROUNDUP (glyphosate), though active on an different enzyme production-site.
Its primary entry-point is through the leaf-surface, although it is also soil-active if applied to terrestrial sites (avoid doing this anywhere near desirable trees). But, when applied directly into aquatic sites, it photo-degrades fairly rapidly.
Although I compared it to glyphosate, it appears to be much more capable at controlling emergent rooted plants - particularly cattails, even prior to catkin formation - and lotus.
As with all herbicides, obtain and read the label instructions (and water-use restrictions) before making any purchases.
Lastly, HABITAT will soon be available in quarts; which are well suited to small pond environments. I expect the quarts (a new container-size) to hit the dock around mid-May 2005.

Hey guys thanks for all the speedy replies. First off for Bruce, I do not have the ability to alter the water level of my pond, it is probably a 1/4 acre and 10 ft deep at the dam. Now Bill, is this HABITAT stuff on store shelves and if not, how do I get my hands on it. It sounds like just what I need. I did go back and read the whole conversation and found it very helpful. You guys really know your stuff and I would just like to thank you for sharing that information with me.

Wes

Wes - for locating the herbicide Habitat, I would start by contacting your local University extension office and ask for the name of a chemical dealer in your area. Got to the dealer and ask if they can get this chemical for you. Tell them it is made by BASF. They should be able to find out about obtaining it for you.

Kelly says it should be on the shelves of well stocked pond supply companies by June. It may take some stores a lot longer to start stocking the chemical.

Bill - unfortunately, my previous info was flawed on the product's ETA. However, I did find out that our product (at least) shipped out of GA on Monday - and I expect it to arrive today. I would expect other distributors (who have ordered the product) to receive it this week.
I was told that HABITAT is packaged outside of the US, and import logistics caused the unexpected delay. KD

Hey Kelly,

How is Habitat different than Arsenal, Chopper, and Assault? They all have Imazapyr as the active ingredient and have been around (registered) in one form or another since 1984.

Seems like the other product names might be more readily available.

Thanks

J.W.

JW - I know what you're fishin' for, but you're not getting any bites from me.

Just read the labels for those products. If they're not labeled for aquatic sites, that means they're "not labeled for aquatic sites" - period!

Kelly,

Since you are much more knowledgeable in this area than I am and since you likely have better access to the labeling/use information I was only looking for an answer to my question.

Are you saying that these other products are not labeled for the use that Wes intended (aquatic sites?) If that is the major difference, then that is all I was looking for.

I would never use a herbicide for a purpose that it was not intended(labeled) for and would never suggest that anyone else do it either.

I can also understand that BASF would want to introduce Habitat as a new product that is registered for aquatic use (among other uses) instead of just updating similar formulated product registrations. This would avoid confusion since the other products have been out so long, to make sure there is a differentiation.

Thanks,

JW

I have been involved with several enviornmental studies for EPA registration of several new chemical products. EPA registration of a chemical for use in aquatic or terrestrial environments is a very lenghty and involved process which includes chemical, biological and environmental testing. Tests involve analyses of the various impacts from drift, runoff, and direct application and how the various components the aquatic food chain are affected. They (producer and regulatory agency) try to consider many of the possible fates including degredation products that the chemical formulation might have once it is introduced into the ecosystem. Slightly different formulations of basically the same chemical could easily "behave" differently in the widely different biological communities living in a pond. Chemical half life and its bioaccumulative nature are other very important aspects that are usually currrently tested for each product registration.

Thus, using apparently the same herbicide- pesticide outside of its intended use can be playing enviornmental roulette. I personally would not do that if I was eating the fish from that water body. Since many ponds are occassionally used for swimming, playing in this water and exposing delicate and permable mucous or body tissue membranes to water randomly laced with herbicides or pesticides that have been applied outside of label recommendations is not my idea of good common sense.

Well said Bill.

This is exactly why Kelly's notes about following product labels and also his (Sonar) note about using the experienced resources of the retailers, authorized distributors, and licensed applicators is so important as well.

Use of Herbicides and pesticides is serious business. Ultimately the more knowledgable we as pond owners become, the better choices we can make.

POND BOSS is a big part of that education

Thanks Bill,

JW

Hey guys, thanks for all your help. It's great that a green horn as myself can get information like this from people like you. I will get in touch with Va Tech (go HOKIES) and find out about this product and let you guys know where my search leads me.