Pond Boss Forums Thread Like Summary - Stocking advice for shad & carp control

Our pond which is 26 acres has some issues. We have gizzard shad and common carp and buffalo carp, we are trying to keep them in check. Due to the gizzard shad and over population of catfish our bluegill numbers are just ok with no upper size class as biggest sampled was 7” and few in the 1-3” range. LMB population is relatively low with few in the under 8” size range but good size in upper size classes by length. Relative weights could be better. Crappie are doing well and catfish are all over. The company who shocked recommends to help control carp and shad with stocking walleye or hybrid striped bass in any combination of up to 10 per acre per year and possibly stocking some tiger musky 1-2 per acre. My personal thoughts are the HSB may be more useful than walleye for controlling the shad and small carp but would like to have an opinion from more experienced pond mnagers. Also I think 2 dozen tiger Muskie would also benefit as when they get bigger they can predate on the larger shad. Both the Muskie and HSB should help control crappie as well. He also recommended possibly stocking more small LMB due to low numbers of that size but have no quantity recommendation. Anyone have any thoughts on which fish would be most benefitial and in what quantities for that size of lake. Not much structure or vegetation on this Old sandpit as it’s surrounded by houses. Advice/thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks

We experience this fishery type in sandpits near rivers in NE which have historically flooded. HSB and BC are our most effective tools to help manage Gshd. BC will actively pursue Gshd schools and their gape allows them to target adults. HSB will also hammer schools but due to more limited gape will focus on smaller fish. I would recommend 10-15/ac on HSB annual ladder stocking and 5/ac for BC. TM are ambush predators I believe they’d serve as a less effective management tool and would also inhabit similar habitat as your BG and LMB - both species you’d likely prefer not to be diminished through predation.

I agree that gill netting as many adult invasive species is a great strategy - no predator present is going to take down a 15# Buffalo, carp, or gar. If you employ periodic gill netting in addition to supplemental stocking of specific predators I think you can experience a level of management and add a couple fun species for angling. It’s essential to record WR of both species in order to determine stocking strategy in the future. IE: if all HSB exhibit WR 110+ you could elect to bump your annual stocking qty - inverse is likewise applicable of course.

I would also spend some time focusing on adding some structure to the lake to enable your BG and LMB populations to benefit. Groups of 4-5 cedars weighted with a cinder block in 3-6’ is cheap and easy. Ping me if you want to talk sometime as I have experience with these sandpit HOAs all over Nebraska along Platte, Elkhorn and Missouri River.

EDIT: I researched TM a bit more and found some studies stating Gshd are a preferred, soft rayed forage item for TM, so TM recommendation seems to be accurate. I still wonder if TM will be midlake chasing schools of Gshd, but one should defer to the scientific study not my gut instinct. Studies also stated TM prefer forage 30-35% their body length. Once TM enter the 30 - 40" range they would be capable of handling Gshd up to 10-14" but this still may leave largest adult Gshd invulnerable to TM predation. That's where the BC seem to play an important role preying upon larger adults and Carp, Buffalo and Gar. 3/AC seems a prudent stocking strategy. Colorado is using TM to control White Sucker populations in their reservoirs and have reported reducing WS biomass by 50% and TM are growing fast...obviously.

My recommendation would be HSB to focus on age 0, TM to focus on age 1+, and BC to focus on larger adults. Scott and Eric's gill net strategy should also be employed to periodically remove significant biomass of the adult fish largely invulnerable to predation. This combo strategy seems to offer the highest chance of success to manage the invasive species population. If you choose to harvest those collected fish via nets I know guys who could use frozen fillets to feed their apex predators...myself included. Feel free to reach out anytime!

My brother tried something similar for poor villagers in Central America, only this involved planting mahogany and, in another area, coffee trees. Sadly, it failed due to lack of enforceable private property rights, as squatters simply took over & govt did little.

Basic economic tenet: Growth is difficult without private property rights.

See red! . Not so fast my friend! I think your gut instinct is better in this case. In the studies you would have to examine just what the lake conditions were - the TM may not have had any option but to chase GShad. Also the population dynamics - the study lakes likely had a very large portion of available forage in GShad. Did the studies have the same situation as a pond/lake in question? My guess is the TM would go for the energetically best option first (BG &, LMB etc. ) . Then they would chase GShad in open water next.


Diets of Muskellunge in Northern Wisconsin Lakes
Michael A. Bozek
,
Thomas M. Burri
&
Richard V. Frie



Abstract
The muskellunge Esox masquinongy is an important sport fish in Wisconsin and elsewhere, but more information about its diet is needed to better understand its role in aquatic systems and its effects on other fish. Stomach contents were examined for 1,092 muskellunge (226–1,180 mm total length, TL) captured in the littoral zone from 34 Wisconsin water bodies from Jul 1991 to Oct 1994. Food occurred in 34.3% (N = 375) of the stomachs, with most (74%) containing a single item. Overall, the proportion of muskellunge with food differed significantly among seasons, with the greatest proportion occurring in fall (69.0%), followed by summer (53.5%) and then spring (25.4%). Prey items consisted of 547 fish, representing 12 families and 31 species, along with 35 nonfish items; fish composed 98% of the diet. Relative importance values of diet items varied by taxa, season, and water body, but the main food items eaten by muskellunge in each season were yellow perch Perca flavescens and white sucker Catostomous commersoni. Black basses Micropterus spp., northern pike Esox lucius, walleye Stizostedion vitreum, cyprinids, and other taxa were less common in the diet. Prey fish ranged in size from 6% to 47% of muskellunge total length and prey length increased significantly as muskellunge size increased. Yet the size of prey in proportion to muskellunge size remained the same for all sizes of muskellunge. The results of this study indicate that, if readily available, yellow perch and catostomids will compose a large proportion of the muskellunge diet. Additional studies assessing muskellunge diet among lakes having different prey community types and assessing diet in deeper offshore areas of lakes are needed to better understand the role that muskellunge play in aquatic communities.

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/wishful thinking mode off

I have a BIL that did a stint in the Peace Corps in the Central African Republic.

The project was to use Tilapia to add protein to the diet of subsistence farmers. The Peace Corps helped make shallow ponds suitable for Tilapia that were located between the villages and the crop fields.

The villagers were supposed to throw in some vegetation on their way to the fields, and then again on the way home to feed the Tilapia.

Unfortunately, the projects failed.

With the problems people here are having trying to source Blue Cats, I think you are much better off stocking the Hybrid Striped Bass and more Largemouth Bass along with the Tiger Muskies.

Since it's an old sandpit, how much spawning habitat is there for the Bass and Bluegills?

The easiest way to help control the numbers of rough fish and fish that you don't want to have in there would be a combination of gill nets and hoop/fyke nets. The gill nets could be run 2x daily and you'd get a LOT of carp/gizzard shad out, and you could turn loose any other fish that you didn't want to remove. The hoop/fyke nets do a great job on catfish.

The HSB would do well in there because they'd be occupying the same habitat as the Gizzard Shad. They aren't that expensive to stock, you could stock a bunch of 4" ones and they would grow fast. If you were here, it'd cost around $25-$30 to stock 10 Hybrid Striped Bass/acre.

If you wanted to target the carp and grow the BG bigger, put a Texas Hunter Fish Feeder on the dock and feed the fish. The Carp will get accustomed to the food and you can either bow fish them out or catch them on rod and reel. The Bluegill in the lake will also find the feeder and start feeding. The Largemouth (and HSB if you stock them) will also find the feeder. The HSB will eat some of the food, the LMB will eat the smaller fish that are coming to eat the food.