Pond Boss Forums Thread Like Summary - How do i pivot from LMB lake to RBT

Hi All, since building my lake things have changed a bit, ie. it's turned out to be a better quality water body than I thought that supports trout very well and we love ice fishing them. I built the lake with the intention of creating a great LMB fishing spot but only put about 3 in last summer at about the 4-6 inch size (chances are good that the eagles/otters/turtles bagged them already. But I did put thousands of Pumpkinseed sunfish in and they've reproduced very well - they spawned from the end of june to about the end of august and there are now zillions of them. So it's ready to put LMB in but...I also put some RBT and BRT (brook trout?) in as an experiment and they are doing very well. So I'd like to pivot from LMB to trout - can i do that practically with so many sunfish in there now?

The lake is 6 acres, averages 6-8 feet with 10-12 foot deep spots. Current stocking is FHM, dace, pumkinseeds, 3 bass, 1500-2000 trout, some suckers.

The RBT (14-16 inches and bigger) we are catching that were stocked last spring are full of small sunfish, the brookies are full of bugs and maybe will switch to sunfish as well when they get a little bigger?

So, instead of putting LMB in that will eat the sunfish ...and my trout, would SMB control the sunfish numbers as well as fishing and trapping them? For stocking I only have access to SMB, LMB, trout species, no walleye or others.

For trout stocking I now put in 8-10 inch brookies and the RBT are 1.5 to 2 pounds and bigger. I did put 500 3-5 inch brookies in last year but that was most likely a waste of money, from now on they would all be as big as I can get them.

Anyway that's my conundrum, I know pivoting isn't good and it's easier to start from new but I dont feel like killing off everything - we eat the sunfish too... Will the SMB and RBT, predators control the sunfish?

I should mention that the lake shouldn't support SMB reproduction.

Cheers.

Louie

TL ; I have a Clay pond in Western Oklahoma , Summer days 110F , No rock , I put down 3 12' X 20' areas of road way gravel separated enough to prevent SMB from seeing each other spawn , and SMB are spawning ( Geo textile under gravel to prevent sinking into silt and clay ) . No creek or stream incoming . Seems majority of creatures with Hormones ,find a way . Especially the Sunfishes. Now, to increase fry survival and maybe number of nests , adding large basket ball size rocks will help. Also read Dr. Cody's five part series on SMB , I have to google search to find them , everyone who loves SMB should read this series. Also pictures of nests for SMB , made by Teejaeh57 , find his posts on SMB , and you'll learn much. Hoping the 3 LMB are all same sex , or dead . Last comment , just my opinion , no expert , but my experience , SMB will have a very difficult time controlling BG . When fish seller sold me RES , he decided I needed BG too. 80% BG and 20% RES , a disaster , been fighting BG ever since . Good Luck , May God Bless You and Yours .

I think if your main goal is to be a "trout lake", then LMB will work against that goal since they love to eat some large, tasty trout!

That probably leaves overpopulating sunfish as your most likely big problem?

In that case, your best solution may be to work hard to establish a good population of SMB.

There are several excellent threads on Pond Boss about creating spawning habitat for SMB. I am used to seeing BG and LMB on nests that they have fanned out of pretty small-sized sand grains. All of the SMB experts on the forum showed pretty significantly sized rocks on their spawning beds.

I think your water is pretty clear in the spring? You could put some rocks in tubs/kiddie pools/etc. where you might be able to observe spawning behavior to see which depths and rock configurations your SMB prefer.

You could then put down some landscape fabric and cover with rocks for more expansive spawning beds the next time you draw down your water level a little.

I look forward to reading about your successful efforts, since I haven't been able to fish much lately up in Canada.

(I am definitely NOT an expert on ponds in Canada, since I have mostly fished on bigger waters. Hopefully, some of our actual experts will add to your thread.)

Tiny,

Sorry about the confusion. As posts get more responses, they sometimes generate some confusion - especially regarding terminology! There are frequently new posters that refer to bluegill as a pond full of "sunfish", without any more information. I realize that does not apply to your posts, since you have said you have pumpkinseeds.

All of the sunfish species belong to Family Centrarchidae. This includes what most people call "sunfish" from Canada to S. Texas, but also includes all of the black bass (LMB, SMB, spotted), and even crappie!

The experts on the forum may refer to Genus Lepomis, which are sometimes called the "true sunfish". That covers bluegill, pumpkinseeds, red-ear sunfish, green sunfish, and most of the other less common sunfish.

If you call them "pumpkinseeds", or even PS, in your future posts, then everyone will be on the same page as you.

Now, after all of my long-winded typing, do you have any other Lepomis species of sunfish in your pond that came in through your marshes or other water connections? Or do you only have the PS that you introduced?

That information will definitely help people give good advice on your management plans.

So, just to be clear, Tinylake, the "bluegill" that you have are actually pumpkinseeds?

My pond's snails get eaten by my yellow perch YP, and by my rainbow trout. I don't have any RES, have few snails, and have not seen a grub in any of my fish, LMB, YP, GSF, HBG, BG, trout, BCP, in the 15 years I've been eating them.

The very large gape of tiger trout TT and their brown trout/brook trout parentage lends me to think that this hybrid species will consume many sunfish. A possible added bonus is the TT are not reproducing predators, so you can easily control their numbers. They are beautiful fish, much more so than internet photos can show. If you can source TT. I'd highly recommend your trying some of them. My 20+ inch TT will thrash and swallow filleted carcasses of any sized GSF and BG right off the dock. That's a thrilling sight.

That you have 9" PS for the table seems to me that things are going well at this point. I'd like to have any sized PS!

The late Dave Willis had ponds in I believe North Dakota that overpopulated and stunted with PS and SMB. That may not be a bad thing with the RBT because the PS will stay smaller and be food for the RBT. The SMB spawn at a lower water temp than LMB, and the SMB spawning temp is within the range that RBT will live so I think you can have the best of both worlds. SMB don't "have to have" clear flowing water and rocky areas, but they DO need rocky areas between pea gravel and golf ball/tennis ball sizes to pull off a successful spawn that are in 1'-4' water depth (possibly deeper depending on water clarity).