Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Dock Supports

First let me say, what a great source for small lake information. I wish I had found this months ago. I'll fill you in on what we have going before I ask my question.

We just finished the dam construction for our lake in mid October. The damm is 25' high (above The original ground level) and 660 feet long and the lake should be approximatly 13 acres. There is a hole 30 feet deep and 200 feet wide in front of the dam. We have cleared approximatly 75% of the lake leaving tree cover in both shallow and deep water areas. We have tried to clear a recreational area for wakeboarding/jet sking and still leave plenty of fish structure.

I bought a dozer and have been finishing the clearing and clean-up myself. We removed all the tree's, cleaned up all the trash (limbs/roots) that would float and pushed about 40 24" red cedars out into the deep water areas. Cut chanels, built humps and a nice island with the dozer.

I had a friend give me some telephone poles to use for piers to build the dock with and we saved 80 or so of the big cedars to saw up for lumber to build a pavillion and dock structures from.

It started raining just after we completed the damn, but not untill two weeks ago did we start to worry. Everyone said figure on two years to fill it up so I thought at least I had all winter to get my stuff done. We've had almost 20" of rain since mid October. Yesterday we still had 10' 4" to go to reach the spillway. Tuesday Night we had all the poles cut, spots marked and had a pole truck come out to set the poles. We had a little 0.2" rain that afternoon and the driver was afraid he'd get stuck so he said he would bring a track drill out TOMARROW and set them for us. Last night we got another 6.5" rain and when I went out to the lake today it had risen another 5'. 4 of the 8 pole locations are now underwater so there goes my well laid plans for a supported dock.

I have done several searches regarding floating vs supported structures. We don't get any ice to speak of here so that method is out. Let me bounce this plan off you and tell me if it sounds plausable.

My original plan called for 8 posts. An 8 x 30' dock with 4 posts down each side. I think I still me be able to set 4 of the 8 sites since I still plan to have the track drill out to set the cedar poles for the pavillion. My original construction was going to be all natural cedar above the telephone poles. I can build the first section like planned and then rig up a temporary support to hold the next section up during construction. Build 2 metal plates with a pipe that a piece of drill stem will slip through and bolt one to each side of the end of that section. Slip the drill stem through the pipe and do the best I can to hammer it into the ground. The run a bolt through the pipe and drill stem to hold it in place. Then repeat it all with the next section. Has anyone ever attempted anything like that or am I reaching too far? I could always fix the end and float the other hinged, but I'd prefer to go fixed and level.

I don't have much time to make my decision before my 4th hole will dissapear so I appreciate and ideas you guys might have. I had 2 30' poles that were supposed to go on the end of the dock to run a zip line off of for the kids, I can set the pole on the bank now but it just won't be the same. Just run the line over the end of the dock











The pic's should be there now

A big welcome to AEH!

Hey, you're pictures aren't showing. What kind of account is hosting the images?

Thanks Bruce. They should be up now.

Do you have a water control system where you can let water out. If so drop the water level a few feet and do the work.

WOW, the dirt work and dam looks amazing!!!

Eddie

ewest.

I read so much about people having long term problems with thru-pipes that we opted for double spillways. We tried to cut the original spillway through rock on the back side but were not able to get it wide enough without blasting and that worried me too so we have a second higher spillway on the front side of the damm. So no right now we have no drain. I have plans for an above ground siphon system but I'm a long way from getting it put in.

Hi Ark, welcome to Pond Boss! I can't answer your question so I won't but I'm sure of the expert members will chime in. Sounds like you have put quite a lot of thought into this project. I like your double spillway idea.

Wow a 13 acre pond, dang that it one nice size pond! How much total acreage do you have?

The lake sits on 171 acres. As soon as I can get it where I can leave it alone I'll start on my shop. Then the house: First things first you know.

Here is a structure drawing I did in Autocad showing the layout of the lake. I diddn't take the time to map the cuts and humps i put in with the dozer. Just the main structure. The small drawing in the corner is the lake relative to the property and the surrounding topography.

Upper crust effort with awesome results, ArkEH. What a super project...mega-congrats. Great to have ya here; hope you don't mind the rest of us hitchhikers.
8 telephone type poles to support 8' x 30' of dock makes my overkill engineering look like tinker toys. I can't argue; it's a nearly unbeatable trump card for that size project. The only heavier engineering that I recall on this forum (or anywhere, for that matter) was someone's pic of a poured concrete pier.
How deep will normal pool be at the end of the 30' pier length?
Forgive me if you have already visited the Building a Pier thread, or the Using footers or sinking posts thread. These are a couple that may provide some brain food.
I think that ultimately your options are somewhat limited, but then there really aren't alot even when the water line is lower than the support zone. Bob Lusk promotes use of drill rod or tubing in your post-water zone. As I recall, his engineering is pretty much the same as you have noted. The only other practical option that I foresee is a hybrid. Poles for the first half, and floating for the second. Actually, this hybrid may turn out to be a hidden blessing if you should go through weather conditions where the water level would drop. That would turn out to be a certifiable brainstorm if the last section was on hinges and would follow the water level. A pond your size and depth can lose 2 or 3 feet of water depth and still be totally usable for the motorized water toys. It would suck if the pier access was 5 or 6 feet above the water level. If you could provide enough bouancy near the end of the pier so that it would support the last section if the water level dropped, a set of very stout galv or SS strap type hinges might complete the structure. If you provided some buoyancy at the hinge end of this cantilever section AND if the pins could be removed from the hinges, the entire pier section could be floated off the end and back to shore or elsewhere for maint or mitigation of extreme low water level.

Brettski,

The Poles were free and the original plan called for the deepest two to be 30'. With 6' in the ground and 7' of water that left 17' above water. I have 200' of 3/8 steel braid cable (also donated) and planned to run a zip line from the top of the poles to the water near the dam. Thats the part that upsets me the most. That would have made a really slick set-up and as close to safe as you can get with something like that. Now I'll have to set the zip line poles on the bank and run the cable over the end of the dock. Then build a free standing platform ladder for them to climb up and launch from. Sure would have been cleaner and neater the original way.

Option two will probably be just what you suggest. Fixed section on the dock and a double hinged section in the middle with a third floating section. I can still get the first 4 poles set.

What an absolutely cool, classic backed up mega-draw. Man, that is one nice presentation!
If you are only into 7 ft of water at the end of the pier, you definitely have the pounded pier support option available. I believe, tho, that the embedded pole option is gone with the water level over this zone. I am now like you...I want to know for sure.
C'mon you dirt guys....is there any tricks for setting a tele pole in a few feet of water?
I will say this. Short term patience and good upfront maneuvering can provide many long term years of satisfaction. The zip line/pole idea is pretty deluxe. If you HAD to drop the water to do it, it might be worth it to do it now. If you have that much drainage, you are good with refilling quickly and bad with the scare that it might deluge while you're trying to sneak the water line down. Hmmmm. Rangersedge, an occasional poster from Illinois, just rigged and operated a temporary siphon for a lake about your size. EWEST....WHERE IS THAT LINK?

ArkansasElkHunter - Wow, a great looking project!

Nature tends to intervene in our best laid plans.

AutoCAD may be a little beyond us etch-a-sketch guys.