Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations tractors

i was wondering if any of you guys had purchased one of these grey market tractors. i need a tractor but dont really want to pay 15,000 for one i want one with about 28-30 hp, front end loader. i had someone tell me these grey market tractors were about half the price of the john deere and kubota tractors and just as good. i cant seem to find any info on them in my area does antbody have any info about these tractors?

wickedinhere,

I haven't purchased one myself and would not do so either unless there was a nearby known parts supplier.

A great forum for tractor, equipment, and rural lifestyle discussions is located on the following link. I've seen grey market tractors discussed there and the concern is almost always on parts availability and costs.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/index.php

see the discussion group called "grey tractors"

great site thanks, gotta be able to get parts

What the heck is a grey market tractor?

PJ,

Generally that's a tractor that has been made in a foreign country, intended for sale in that foreign country, and brought here to this country for re-sale. A grey market machine is a machine that was not intended for the U.S. marketplace. I'm told the difference can be as simple as warning stickers and instrument differences to major design differences such as pumps and different bearing sizes on components....which is why parts are of utmost concern.

Wicked,
I'm looking for about the same size tractor. There are a lot of tractors with names on them I've never heard of before. Most of them seem to originate in China. I've also seen crate tractors that are fairly cheap. But you have to put them together. Joseph Tractors out of Dallas has some of them in your are interested. They will even assemble them for you. I agree on the parts availability, cause it's gonna break down eventually.

These guys have some good discount tractors in our area:

http://www.rcotractor.com/about.html

In my experience you save alot on the tractor but you need that savings to afford the parts. Generally the parts prices are really inflated and you sometimes get stuck with paying freight. I would pay alittle more for a name brand where you know you can get service and parts forever. Another thing to look at is resale value if you think you may upgrade in the future.

i saw those crate tractors but i am getting more and more worried about parts. the more i research it the more people say that parts are the biggest problem with these tractors.

I dont know. These tractors seem to be pretty simple machines. What seems to be the biggest fear in parts needed? If heavy use, it maybe worth considering.

I've had very good luck with buying/owning/operating used tractors...and in fact have three of them. Today's diesel engines are very reliable and good for hundreds and hundreds of hours. However, alternators, water pumps, hydraulic pumps, etc. do fail and can make the tractor unusable for the time you can't get parts.

With parts availability assured and good quality used tractors, I wouldn't even consider buying a new tractor myself,

In my tractor experience there is excellent parts availability for used Deeres (all equipment, not just tractors), Fords, and to a slightly lesser extent, Massey-Fergusons.

I talked to a guy who got a highway mowing contract with the State of Texas. He bought 4 Russian made tractors. When they broke down, there were neither parts nor competent mechanics to service them.

If I ever buy another tractor, it certainly won't be one with a fiberglass hood and fenders. The hood on my 4 year old JD is developing some cracks. I've been fiberglassing. It's gonna cost me about $450-500 to replace the hood, decals, etc. This means I will be buying older models next time.

Wickedinhere
Which tractors are you looking at that are considered Grey market? Alot of tractors have a grey market twin but only a little different or maybe the safety equipent doesnt meet us standards like roll over protection. I Have spent alot of time on tractorbynet, in fact it use to be my first go to site of the evening before I found pond boss, I got a great deal on a Yanmar tractor model 226D which is a diesel 22hp and 4x4 local, I had been watching it for awhile and finally stopped in and asked the guy and he said sure he would sell it. Yanmar actually makes some John Deere compacts if I remember right but they arent cross over for parts list. Sometimes you pay for the name, just tonight I was up at a Onan dealer in town buying a 4 dollar part that the local JD dealer wanted 16 dollars for and had me on back order for 2 weeks, Same part!

Dave, the problem I see with a Deere is they make it so you cant get anything aftermarket. My bro-in-law has a large Deere riding mower and has to go to them for a blade and pay 3 prices. Our 1950 farmall tractor may not be pretty, but has stood the test of time. 6 volt system, now has an 8 volt battery. It cranks up pretty quick.

In my experience, Russian metallurgy is far inferior to ours, and Russian tractors are a testament to that fact. Thinking I had found a great buy, I had the misfortune of buying a Belarus 400A and although the parts are available from Beshears, the tractor is junk.

I believe that JD and many other tractors are of foreign manufacture; only some of the assembly is done here. I finally bit the bullet and bought a new Kubota. Parts are readily available, and service is supposed to be. We'll see.

If you are in a position to use the cost of a tractor as a business deduction, why risk buying used equipment? Of course, if you are competent in evaluating mechanical condition, buying used equipment would certainly be tempting.

http://www2.northerntool.com/cat-12/88%2B479973/12.htm

Above is a link to a good utility tractor. It, like most utility tractors on the market, is made by a Chinese company called Jimna. They have been making tractors for "American" companies for years. You are getting basically the same tractor buying a "grey market", just alot cheaper. Most of the "grey market" actually have more features than the brand names such as 3 speed PTO to match American,European and Asian implements. "Grey markets" are usually produced to cover all markets.

Dudley, Belarus tractors are what put the guy I mentioned out of business.

Burger, I was raised on a Farmall M and Ford 8N. I don't ever recall a serious breakdown. I bought a Ford 8 N about 15 years ago and it is still running OK. I seldom use it but it's not for sale.

I own the 40 HP JD because I got old enough to need a front end loader. That means you had better have 4WD. It still has less than 300 hrs because I'm a weekender and just can't/don't use it that much. I don't see how I got along without it.

I went with a new, name brand, tractor for one reason. When I need it, I want something to work with, not work on. The new JD has mostly met that criteria. It is my personal observation that JD, New Holland, Massey and Kubota are all OK. The biggest criteria, for me, would be who has the closest dealership for parts and service.

i have been looking at the kubota twins and the jimna tractors. when i started working on my land i borrowed my dads john deere 28 horse with front loader and it was just the right size. everytime he has to buy parts for it he always complains how expensive it is. i really didnt think i would need a tractor all of the time but seems like now i just have to have one.i could just borrow my dads but he cant live without it for very long hehehe. i am gonna do some calling around to see what i can find.
i guess if i run out of stuff to do with the tractor
i can sit on it by the pond and fish off of it.

Very good point. And it's not just how close they are, but also how good they are to deal with. A good parts man at a tractor dealership who can identify and order what you need can save you a huge amount of equipment down time, especially if you have the parts book for the machinery and can ID and order over the phone.

The closest Massey dealer is only 5 miles from me, but they are such a pain to deal with we go 20-25 miles to a different one instead. And we're lucky that the JD dealer and the Ford/New Holland dealer, while 25 miles away, are only 1/2 miles apart.

The JD tractor dealer will have parts shipped direct to me if they need to order them from the next level of distribution. This is a good time saver. IIRC any JD dealer will do it; perhaps other brands as well - it's worth asking about.

Dudley,

For me, I guess its just a question of how I can make best use of money. I have three excellent tractors that can cover a wide spectrum of needs on my property and I have less money tied up in the three in total than I would have in one new tractor. Plus, I can sell each one today for about the same as I paid for them 10 to 20 years ago. That's hard to beat, especially considering tax benefits.

They are so reliable, it just isn't an issue...if only used bull dozers were as reliable.

Kubota is excellent in terms of reliability and parts availability.

I want to warn anyone with a tractor that sits during the week to check under the hood before running the tractor each time it is used. I recently went to start mowing at my farm when after about thirty minutes the engine caught on fire. I had a fire extinguisher nearby and had it put out in about five minutes so it could have been worse. I found out a mouse had built a nest on the manifold and when it got hot it caught it on fire. I took it in to the John Deere house and they told me they had another tractor in that had burned almost to the ground because a bird had built a nest in it. I also would recommend keeping a fire extinguisher handy. My bill was 2000 dollars that could have been prevented.

I want to add that a couple of years ago I bought a used john deere at an auction. I paid 18 grand for a tractor that new would have been over a hundred. I did have to pay for some new hydraulic hoses after the first year but that was about it. I brought a john deere mechanic with me to the auction which cost me about 500 dollars but not knowing anything about tractors I think it was worth it. I sold the tractor after about three years for what I paid for it.

Ok, Here�s my 2 cents and I have been around tractors all my life. The grey market tractors came about in the late 70�s. When the American Company�s started outsourcing the manufacturing of their tractors to foreign countries to utilize their cheap labor and resources. They started build the tractors for American Tractor Companies so they could make a higher profit on their tractors. This movement has been just like the TV and electronics movement of the same error. I challenge you to try to buy a American made TV. I bet you can�t! This business move put most all American Tractor Manufactures out of business because the companies that started building the tractors for them started selling them direct to consumers under different names cutting out the middleman (American tractor Manufactures). Kubota was one of the first grey market tractors to get tractors over here back in the 70�s. They have since dominated the market (IMHO). Kubota has built a network of dealers and part suppliers, which is good because if you�re going to sell it here at least support it here! Mahindria Tractors pretty much has done the same thing but they are not on the same level as Kubota. These two manufactures have just about become as common as Ford or GMC in comparison to automobiles. There are a lot of other tractor manufactures that are trying to do the same or claim that they are, some of these that come to mind are Mitsubishi, Sato, Hinimoto, Jimma just to name a few. But they are all gray market tractors shipped over here without the support of true dealer networks or parts network. Most of these tractors from Japan (not China) sent over here are not New anyway, they are what they call remanufactured (painted pretty on the outside but a wore out underneath). I am aware that people selling these tractors all claim that they can get the parts and repair them. But have you actually been there eye to eye trying to get a part to get you back up in operation ? In the mid 80�s my father bought a Hinimoto tractor from a big dealer in Houston (Southerland Tractors) we had the tractor about a year and the transmission went out. The dealer had since gone out of business and we could not find parts for it. The tractor is still setting split in the middle to this day because of it. I can tell you from my own personal experience with my 1994 Mahindia 575 DI tractor that getting parts for it can be a challenge sometimes because they are not made to they American standards and they do not support the older tractors like their newer ones. My advice would be to buy a Kubota, John Deere, Massy Ferguson, or Case were the dealer networks are deep rooted in the USA but that�s my opinion.

This is just another example of how the American people have sold themselves out to a foreign country!!! Is there anything still made in the USA from start to finish?

ok ok i went tractor shopping in person. 1st stop farmtrac dealer 30 horse 4x4 with loader 16,200 plus tax WOW no way. second stop a new holland dealer 30 horse 4x4 with loader 15,500 plus tax. next stop john deere dealer uhhhhhhhh out of business i guess there prices were way tooooo high. ok last stop kubota dealer 28 horse 4x4 with loader 14,400 and it looked better overall to me . i started getting blinded by all the shiny paint and bam the next thing i know i am approved for financing that happened way too fast. now of course the model i want is out of stock but they are looking for one as we speak if they cant find one i will probably upgrade to the 34 horsepower its only 1000.00 more as the salesman said. the guy that owns the property next to me has the same kubota that i am looking at and he let me borrow it once
so you could say i have tested it out and i liked it alot more than my dads john deere.
the grey market tractors are good deals but i will be using this tractor for bushogging also (for hire) so i have to make sure i can get it serviced and repaired.i have a lawn service and i have been wanting to get a tractor to expand my business and well i guess i just have.thanks for all the help and info i will post pics when i get it