Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations bags-o-fatheads

Here are 25,000+ oxygenated healthy 2.5 inch fatheads ready to spawn and turn Bremer Pond into a food factory for the incoming game fish.



The bags are a thing to wrestle that makes salt bags seem like fun. They are heavier and with the water and fatheads sloshing around, it is a load! It didn�t help that it was again the windiest day of the year, here in Minnesota.

I put the bags in the water to acclimate the fatheads to pond temperature. Temperature readings after the bags drifted to the other end of the pond were pond water 54 degrees and the bags-o-fatheads 57 degrees. That seemed about right so I let them go one bag at a time and they happily scattered in every direction.

I would think their happiness was a result of leaving the bright light of the clear plastic bag.

I fear that happiness will be relatively short lived.

Nice to see someone is doing it right! Fatheads first allowed to spawn and then the gamefish. This fall or next spring?

I too wrestle with the oxygen airbags when I put newbies into my pond. It's a fun challenge if you're a pond geek

Resist the urge to stock the incoming game fish too soon...sit back and enjoy the fatheads. Forage fish need all the time you can give them. You can learn a lesson now or later...the key to every successful pond is patience. This may be your only chance to fully achieve the potential of your forage base. What else do you have in there ?

I think Dwight has existing fish in his pond.

Not sure about that Sunil. He said, "incoming gamefish."

Cecil Baird1 � Eastland � Sunil

The existing fish in the pond have been removed or escaped into the river before the pond was closed off from the river.

I imagine there would be a few Bullheads or Carp stragglers, but no game fish have been caught or netted for the past 8 months. My fingers are crossed!!!!!

I plan on checking my Fatheads with minnow traps, to keep tabs on their reproduction. If they spawn and there are multiple size classes, then I figure I have had some success.

I hope to add Bluegill later this year and let them spawn next summer before adding Bass. If any of you have any recommendations, I am willing to listen and learn. I am currently thinking 2500 Bluegill and then 500 Bass.

From "Managing Michigan Ponds for Sport Fishing":

Largemouth bass and bluegills
BEWARE of this combination! It's a favorite in the South, where it can work, but it has been oversold in the North. Bass are supposed to control bluegills by predation, but it doesn't work that way in or climate The bluegills overpopulate the pond, and then both bass and bluegill have stunted growth. If you want bass and bluegills anyway, give the bass 1-2 years head start in growth and spawning. Then they may have an effect on the bluegill.

Which is why they recommend HBG over bluegill if you want to fish the bluegill.

In fact if your in southern MN, you might try RE instead of bluegill.

I'd think that would be more Pumpkinseed territory - it's kind of far North for RES.

RE's are doing well in Southern MI, that's why I thought it might work in Southern MN. It wouldn't be the first nor the last time I've been wrong though.

But southern Michigan seems to be their northern limit and that is in natural lakes where they have deeper water and less temperatur flucuations in winter vs. ponds where the temps are less stable. Many times in the northern part of their range they just disappear from ponds.


As far as Bass and bluegills in Michigan not working well I respectfully disagree. I believe with the proper management you can do it. I believe this advice comes from the MDNR -- the same people that say grass carp won't work and won't allow them? :rolleyes:

I would like to first point out that I have read or reviewed many state level pond management books by DNR type agencies. They are a good basic tool for entry level pond management. Like a 10th grade text. There is info here and else where on the post graduate college text level. There is no doubt in my mind that most PB forum members could take both sets of info and manage most situations at the cutting edge with success. It would take work but it could be done in most cases. The state level texts are intended for basics not cutting edge or even advanced pond management nor should they be.

I would bet that Dwight could handle a LMB/BG pond easily with our help. I would suggest he read the article in the current PB mag on forage fish up north as a good start. Realizing the potential for BG stunting up north he could change his stocking schedule as needed and put in an additional cool water predator like YP (documented to crop down BG in cold winter water). I am sure the northern PB's like CB1 ,Theo, Bruce , Bill , Dave Willis and many others have more tricks of the trade to add.

I don't see a problem with attaining BG/LMB balance in MN either. IF one tried to apply deep South stocking ratios and schedules in Minnesota, it could perhaps get a pond out of balance due to the differences in time required for LMB to reach size. But with relatively small adjustments, Homer Swingle's work is valid up North too.

I like the idea of adding some YP, I've seen to many ponds and lakes with stunted BG. It would be alot more work without them.

I need to throw in my 2 cents about the climate difference between southern Michigan and southern Minnesota.

Southern Minnesota is a considerably colder climate than southern Michigan.

Southern Minnesota is about even north-south with Big Rapids, Michigan, not, southern Michigan. Also, Michigan is surrounded by the Great Lakes which moderate winter temperatures significantly as compared to southern Minnesota.

This significant climatic differential could help settle the discussion about REs.

I love passionate discussions!

My stocking thoughts:

Wait until the Fatheads are fully in control of the pond with multiple size classes.

Then add 2500 current year Bluegill.

Then add 500 4-6 inch Bass.

The timing would depend on monitoring the residents of the pond, rather then some artificial time table.

Am I too flexible? Am I way off track?

Dwight :

Have you read the article in the current PB on northern pond forage ? I would consider some YP also. I can round up some info . Email Dave Willis he knows more about ponds in your area than probably anyone alive.

Hmmm... I guess that's why Indiana's DNR nixed my potential state record yellow perch (said it wasn't fair it was on a feeding program), but the Indiana Pond Management Booklet says feeding fish is a waste of time!

More than one says that wrt feeding. :rolleyes: Some are better than others . Some describe feeding as good. They are all dated (old info) but some of the info is still as valid as the day Homer S. first described it. I still think some guy at Indiana's DNR had the existing record and they were helping him out.

Actually I've made waves with them and it was pay back time.

Given your comparison of SMN vs SMI climates, I'd definitely say forget about the RES. The Great Lakes are very important to RES in Southern MI; IIRC a map of the areas in the LP where Redears do OK is U-shaped, hugging Lakes Huron and Michigan significantly farther North than in mid-state.

I think your 1st iteration stocking plan is a very good outline (I would be happy using it with no improvement - but you can do better with help from PB). We have had several threads on YP in Northern BG/LMB ponds which I am guilty of not paying as much attention to as I could have. A search for YP should turn up some good info.

I have read the PB article on establishing a forage base prior to introducing any game fish. Actually have read it a few times.


Now that I have the Fatheads in, I am considering shiners.

Will the golden shiner survive and reproduce in a pit type pond in Southern MN? I was under the impression that they wouldn't. Could that be an old wives tale?