Point taken Sunil, but consider this. Other than the recipe for the GG, has anyone before now ever asked for the proof? If you read a thread I made under another post, I explained that in the first several years of the development of the GG the research was documented and photographed. But this was in the 70's. After the fish proved itself time and again on the farm and in customer's ponds, Ken moved on to other "inventions". This documentation is in a basement in Jason's house on the other side of the farm. Not to mention buried with 40 years of other research. I hate to fall back on the "time has not been available" thing, but that is the sincere truth. Ken has never been the most organized person (just ask Duggan about Ken's desk since he is the only one who has visited the farm), so it will take quite some time to dig everything up. But I can do that in time.
I honestly believe there is a line in between your two points, and this is where Ken has been sitting for years. He shares what he has learned with his fish and techniques, has allowed studies such as that done in Virginia and now Ohio, and has accepted guidance and suggestions from others in this field. But he will not reveal “trade secrets” like the lineage of the GG.
As for the statement:
“It just seems apparent that this experiment, especially on the forum here, is at variance to the prior modus operandus of Holyoak.” No disrespect, but who ever actually asked to do this before. When I was contacted to join this forum, I had never known of the PB existence. Maybe I am wrong since my time here has been limited, but has anyone on this site ever picked up the phone and asked us to do such an experiment. I think years of reading hearsay in regards to our company have programmed a lot of brains in a negative light. Now I am here to defend what was said before, so it is an automatic assumption that I may be “coasting under Ken’s radar.” I am not. Ken is fully aware of what I am doing/learning. As I stated in the previous post I do not condone deception. I won’t deceive our customers or this group, and I will not stay with an employer who deceives me.
Chris I also see your point. We added to the catalog last year, but did not remove or revamp anything and from your post above that was a mistake on our part. Duly noted, and yet another project to work on (but it needs to be done). On the fish sales, I have not seen anything sold but the GG in the 2 years I have been here (save for maybe some bluegill for bass forage only). Even though we carry the others (very limited supply), the hybrids are what sell. On subject line three underline the word major instead of the word ever and see if it reads different. Last red arrow about biting with consistency refers to winter months I believe. ML wants to stock GG and HSB, not other bluegill if I am correct. Also these above are comparisons from our ponds. I am not saying you are wrong and in fact see good points in what you have brought out, but mistakes are not a true sign of deception. I can pull several dated articles (and threads from this forum) that state the GG is without a doubt a BG x GS mix. Now the consensus is changing if ever so slightly. But again I understand your point of perceived deception through verbiage, and you are correct. But I also believe that if Ken was a "liar" as you put it, he would not have held up in this industry for 40 years. Different people read different ways. For example you will note in the catalog where Ken recommends the use of ag lime (page 76), but to hear Greg say it (no slam on Greg here just an example) Ken is dead set against ag lime. Do you see my point? Again I am not saying the selection you scanned above is correct on our part (I agree it needs to be rewritten), but look at the whole not just the parts. Thanks for bringing this out!
Food for thought: Hank Williams Jr. has been a loyal GG customer for several years. He is a PROUD believer in the fish. I'll try to contact his crew and see if one of them will post.
Deb
Let me note that it should go without saying that changes need to be made in different areas. We joke to Ken all the time that he is stuck in a mid 20th century rut. Technology, advertising, and written expression are not his strong points. Guess that is another reason for me to be here!
