Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Evaluating and adjusting fish populations Evaluating New Pond and New Fish

Great update. Thanks for sharing.

Welcome back Boon.

Great report. All above 100% RW so doing very good.

I'd be shocked if they have not spawned yet.

I'm a year ahead of you but I'm seeing at least 3 different size classes of LMB

Thanks Learnin! I was a little surprised on the lack of spawn too. I can only assume they didn’t as we didn’t catch a single fish that was in the less than 12” range.

Working on setting up another fall forage bump now. Really like how it played out last year. Pretty likely we drop another 50lbs of Golden shiners in shortly.

I'd try using a small (1.5" or so) crankbait or small 1/16 oz. spinner or a small 1/16 oz jig head and a 1.5"-2" white curly tail grub to try and target smaller fish.

This was the bait of choice while we were on site. Should be easy for a small LMB to hit it. Was the same thing the BG’s were hooked up on.

I've caught several small LMB on baits that size.
Considering you did not catch any I would think that they have not spawned either.

If you really want to know if they spawned perhaps try a trap or seining.

Cody Note - LMB will very rarely enter a fish trap.

I decided to sample my small LMB and BG with a 2 inch Crappie jig. Between me and the 2 year old grandson we caught 21 fish in about 45 minutes. We were using a 1/32 jig head so it falls very slow. Added some small live grasshoppers for an extra attraction to catch some of them.

Results were
6 LMB from 4" to 10"
12 HBG from 4" to 9" Largest was .5 pounds
1 BG
2 GSF

Wow Learnin!

Good thing you had such an excellent "designated pond sampler" available to help you.

That looks like it was a great day on the water Learnin. Had the family out at our place this afternoon/evening. Saw everything from Beetlespins, spinners, live worms on bobbers.

I think we saw 10 LMB today that ranged in size from 13-15" and at least 30 BG that ranged from 4-9.5"

BG's were running 120%+
LMB were running 112-122% (shorter fish had higher RW's)

I wish I had enough time to sample them all, but overall all the fish looked healthy and the family had a great time.

I did catch one bruiser of a Golden Shiner at nearly 8". I did slightly trim it's tail before returning it to the water. High hopes one of the LMB decide to invite that guy over for supper.

Still no small LMB sub 12" noted.

Spent the entire day today out at the property. Finished up seeding canola around 3 PM ran into town to drop the seeder off and grabbed a bit to eat while the temps started to fall off the 90 degree mark. After the late lunch back to the property to play with the fish a bit.

LMB were very active. Several were crashing the bluegill and shiners out in front of the feeder before it went off - damn fun to watch the eruptions in the water.

My fall forage bump has started. I've dropped 2-3 lbs of Crays from the local creek that have ranged in size from small 2" to larger 6" in the past couple of days. All are likely in range for the current LMB in the pond. Will be an ongoing effort through the fall. Would love to get a total of 20-25lbs of crays added in.

Bait of choice tonight was the dreaded Ned Rig - Peanut Butter and Jelly. Fishing along the rock piles near the peninsula.

LMB 12-3/4" @ 1.1lbs 102% RW - will be culled to grease shortly.
LMB 13-3/4" @ 1.6lbs 116% RW - Tie of previous pond record and was returned to the pond
LMB 13-3/4" @ 1.7lbs 124% RW - This was a new pond record and was returned to the pond
LMB 14" @ 1.875lbs 128% RW - Broke the previous pond record on length and weight. Returned to the pond.
LMB 14" @ 1.5lbs 103% RW - will be culled to grease shortly.

BG 8.5" @ .75lbs 144% RW - Female I think. Put in the cooler and will be a great eater.

Wifey did join me at the property for a little fishing too. Was nice to enjoy the fish and the property together.


Looking forward to breaking the 2lb mark - Perhaps this fall.

Boon, Have you caught the girl with the black splotches again? Was she your larger fish above? If not, there's is a pretty good chance that she is over 2 lbs right now. The model projects your Female Northern Strain LMB have the potential to gain daily 2.1 g on average for the period 9.12.25 to 10.19.25. Some could grow more daily while others less. Of course the daily increment is greater now than it will be then .... but this should give you a sense of potential increments for the fish you listed above over that span of time.

Boon, great report!

Happy belated Birthday. Sounds like it was a good one.

Fish above is the current title holder. I haven’t see the fish with black splotches again yet.

We did only fish a small section of the pond last night. Goal was to pull a few of the lower preforming fish in the way of the LMB and record a little data along the way.




Mission accomplished!

Thanks Learnin! It was a pretty good birthday with lots of farm stuff involved - which is a great thing in my book.

Bet that was some good eating

jpsdad - Is this weight gain based on an annual 365day gain or is it based on a period of growth for water over 50F or 60F temperatures or is it for just the period of Sept 12 - Oct 19 ?

Bill, it is dependent on the temperature that I anticipate Boon's water to be between those two dates. The daily gain is estimated daily and the maximum average daily gain is greater in the beginning and lesser at the end (because the anticipated temperature is higher on 9.12.25 than on 10.19.25). The "2.1 g/day" is an average of the anticipated maximum average gain over the entire 37 day span. I use "maximum" in describing the gain as "maximum average" because I am assuming each fish would be consuming all it needs to gain its "individual maximum potential". I expect variation about the "maximum average" metric because fast growing fish will have greater daily gain than the average and because slower growing fish will have lesser daily gain than the average. 2.1 g/day average over the period assumes there is plenty of optimum prey. In cases where forage is limiting, the realized average daily gain will be less than the "maximum average" daily gain. When realized average gains are less than the model, then either the forage was limited or the fish did not have the potential to grow as modeled. For example, if I were use the model for F1s to estimate NLMB, the NLMB would fall well below the model. The appropriate explanation is that NLMB don't have the average potential of F1s (as opposed to the forage was limited)

Made it out to the property today and managed to have a little time to do some more sampling of the LMB. Three caught all returned.

LMB 1 - 13" @ 1.25lbs 109% RW
While a couple of inches shorter than the other fish below the body shape, condition of the fish, and pretty acrobatic fight with multiple jumps out of the water earned this one a return trip to play another day.

LMB 2 - 15" @ 1.97lbs 108%RW
I had to laugh when I put this one on the scale. 1lb 15.8 ounce. I mean.....

LMB 3 - 15" @ 2.06lbs 113% RW
I cheered when I saw the numbers on this one. Broke the 2lb marker at 1yr 3-1/2 Months.

Now for the fun part. I still haven't seen evidence of a LMB spawn this year. Have tried multiple small baits from Crappie Jigs, Spinners, Ned Rigs. No doubt the LMB will spawn in 2026. Trying to form a plan for 2026 on culling. Any thoughts on:

Numbers of LMB < 12" that would need to come out?
Numbers of LMB > 15" that would need to come out?

Our pond goals include a Semi-Trophy scope. I'd love to find a way to push the fish on growth.

Data on the pond. 1.5 acres with a max depth of 10-11'. We stocked 50 LMB on May 31, 2024.

Boon,

Whatever you settle on for cull numbers ... consider getting started on this now. Perhaps concentrate on those that have lagged the average growth the most. These should be mostly male fish and having fewer LMB nests may help you get through another year without recruitment of LMB.

FWIW, your growth is very good. You were averaging around .70 lbs last October 19th. The model predicts an average weight for females at 2.23 lbs on 9.21.25 for your average climate. So there are a number of possibilities:

1 There are larger females that have not yet sampled.
2 The model overestimates growth for the climate.
3. Forage availability was just marginally less than optimal
4. The climate was marginally cooler than average.

The difference over 11 months is marginal. And in IMO, the samples do not indicate underperformance. So what I am saying, IS, you should focus on maintaining this average growth that you are observing. It is very good.

Next year's growth will be around 70% of body mass if they grow maximally. You should not need to remove more than ~30% of the standing population to maintain 1.67 lbs of average annual growth. This assumes 10% annual natural mortality and that the pond produces the same weight of consumable forage that it did this year.

[Off topic observation]


Boondoggle,

Those bass have almost zero coloring on their bodies.

What were the water conditions in your pond on the day you caught them? Are the LMB in your pond typically light-colored?

I've noticed that too Rod. Nearly all spring the water was pretty stained due to the repeated rain keeping it stirred up. Fish have not had much color on them from what I've seen early spring or this fall (I have no info from summer).

I have been noting fish location they were caught. The just shy of 2lb was out on the deep rockline. And the 2lb+ was caught in shallow water by a submerged tree.

I have not checked with a secchi, but I'd guess the water is in the 18" range. with a brownish tint vs olive green.

It's a small number but we've pulled (3) of the (50) originally stock to date, and they have all been on the low end of the growth scale with the last cull having an odd shape as well. I questioned myself on not culling the short fish yesterday, but he got Ceasar's blessing with thumbs up after, shape of the body, tugging on the line and showing off acrobatics at jumps and tail walking across the water. I'm not sure those traits are able to be passed down, but just in case....Still hopeful that we can pull at least 5-7 more fish this year taking us to approx 20%. Most of the focus has been on finding the short fish but I think low that we are seeing some nearly 2lb or 2lb+ fish showing we could find some of the avg fish in there as well.

So you are thinking we pull another (8) fish on the > 15" side of things for 2026
I haven't figured out where we need to be on < 12" for 2026

If the pond goals are more trophy related and avg culling annually is 15-20lbs per year I'd guess the trophy style culling is higher than the avg to ensure forage remains high. (8) fish > 15" and 100% RW would be nearly 15lbs on it's own. Would I be looking to cull approx the same weight in < 12" fish?

Boon,

You've harvested 3. Were you able to determine sex when cleaning them?

As for the number. I actually didn't recommend a number. It does depend on how many are there. They should be right about balanced with forage production in this moment. IOWs the standing weight should be in the neighborhood of what the pond can carry. So of the original 50, how many survived before removing 3?

Survival is variable and especially so for the first year of life. I'm trying to remember where I heard/read this but for stocking 2" fingerlings ... IIRC ... 70% survival is considered good for the first year. So for you that was 5.31.25. That would have been 35 fingerlings surviving their first year. At 10% annual mortality, that number would be 34 remaining now almost 4 months later. 30% of that is 10 fish. You've removed 3 fish already ... sooooo ... 7 more fish would achieve the harvest. But again, how many LMB survived the original 50 LMB stocking? Taking a total of 10 fish would put you at 24 LMB using our assumptions of natural mortality. At their current sizes, this density should lead to close to maximum growth. But if we are wrong about the number the growth could be a bit slower (albeit it should still be good). So imagine there are 10 more fish than we think are in there. In that case we miss the harvest target by just 3 fish.

Keep in mind, if there are more fish than the estimate from assumptions of natural mortality, then the pond supported a higher standing weight than the assumptions would imply. Failing to remove 3 fish will have less negative effect on growth than if we failed to remove 3 fish and the assumptions were correct. Let's suppose there really are 10 more fish than we assumed and we missed the harvest goal by 3 fish. We have 34 fish but should have only 31 had we harvested those additional three. We just divide 31 by 34 and estimate the downward bias (for not harvesting those 3 fish) to be -9% to the average of weights one year from now. So not a great big adjustment.

As for LMB less than 12", I doubt there are any presently less than this length from the original stocking. Fish of those lengths in 2026 presumes that there is recruitment next year and that they would reach sizes that you would be inclined to harvest. I will make no estimate for this.

I am definitely not saying to harvest fish > 15" in any particular number. IMHO, you need to focus harvest on those fish that are performing at the lowest apparent potentials. I judge potential by annual weight gain. Where it is evident that a fish is significantly underperforming ... I think that fish can always come out. If you believe a fish needs to be there in its place ... then a sexed female replacement can be purchased to replace that fish.

I didn't sex the fish when I pulled them out. All three had an absence of Milt or Eggs but probably to be expected this time of year. All three of the fish were also in the 12-1/2 to 12-3/4" range near the 100% RW mark so clearly underperforming their counterparts in the pond. One of them, Egor, was not a pretty fish. I assume that this was more that the genetic traits just didn't align than anything else.

Egor didn't go to waste though....he was great in fish taco's the wifey prepared last night :P

Maybe I have it wrong. I assumed there would need to be some removal/cull of the new recruits going after the first spawn as they are going to hammer the bottom of the food chain. It probably wouldn't happen until later in the year and my guess is we would be targeting 7-10" fish next fall (sub 12") Any thoughts, opinions, experience on this?

Boon, it would be very unusual for recruited YOY to grow at the rates observed of the initial stocking. Much different environment than a new pond. Round here, I commonly see LMB YOY up to 6" in October. Most are larger than 4". In some years, I see a sprinkling less than 4" in October. Usually, they have grown to be around 8" by the end of March the following year. This is normal for new recruits here.