Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Evaluating and adjusting fish populations I've got two small ponds and a plan...

I'm a newbie who has a chance to work on two small ( 1/5ac ) ponds on my in-laws property in Bradford TN. I live near Albuquerque and visit there 3 or 4 times a year. It seems to be a very interesting opportunity. So I researched and came up with a plan. I'd love to hear from you folks who actually have done this. The two ponds are very different. One is about 3/4 ringed by a tight band of 20ft tall trees. The other had the trees removed. No idea of the depth, but not a lot. Both ponds exhibit good pond life: frogs, crawdads, turtles, moccasins. My BIL stocked some LMB and BG ten or so years ago. That's it. He hasn't done anything, not even fish them; since then. Another nice benefit? About 15 miles away in Milan is a nice couple who run a fish pond stocking biz. They have 5ac of ponds. So It's less than an hour for me to drive there, pick up my bagged fish, and drive home. Lots of good karma here. As for fish in the two ponds? In the pond surrounded by trees (TP) my BIL and I have yet to get a bite. Though there have to be some fish there. When I was there in late April I saw lots of little minnows along the bank. The pond without trees? It's full of fish (I'll call it the FP). I have to say, I'm amazed at the fish in it. There are well established BG and LMB populations. When I was there two weeks ago, I did a little survey fishing for big bass. Within an hour I caught a 2lber on a segmented shad lure. Then I switched to a frog and a LMB just blew up on it. It had to be at least 3lbs. Dang impressive for an unmanaged, small pond. When I 1st went to fish it in April my SIL said she didn't think there were any fish in it. I've caught LMB from 6in to 3lbs with lots in between. In April I tried a small grasshopper lure with very small treble hooks. As soon as it hit the water a small, 4in, BG hit it. I caught 6 in a row before I stopped. My BIL and I have also caught some larger, spawning size BG. Given this info and some research, I made the following decisions. I'd love to hear what you think. Don't worry I have thick skin. 9/1/25 will be our 35th. Lol.

1. Aim the FP to grow big BG. For that it seems the main requirement is a lot of small and medium sized LMB. Obviously this pond has that.

2. Make the TP the bass pond.

3. Next summer catch and remove the few largest LMB from their pond and put into the TP. Assuming I do this, should I remove the big bass pre or post spawn? How many/ what size should I remove from my BG pond to add to my bass pond?

4. Get the food chain going in the TP. To this end at the end of April I added 2lbs of FHM and 100 BG fingerlings. Along with 2 GC. When I was there 2 weeks ago, my BIL and I focused on catching BG and moving them to the bass pond. We moved about 6 small ones and 2 or 3 breeding sized ones. I clipped the fins on a couple and threw them back in for a little LMB sushi. My SIL said she say tons of minnows in the TP when she mowed so the FHMs seemed to have spawned some.

5. Next spring or summer catch and transfer the big LMB from the FP to the TP.

6. Stocked each pond in late April. FP: 2GC, 2lbs FHM. TP: 2GC, 2lbs FHM, 100 BG fingerlings.

7. Should I stock BG fingerlings in the FP? I'm afraid they'll just make an expensive bass snack.

8. Is the idea to start with big bass wrong? As opposed to starting with small bass and nurturing them for years? My selfish view? I don't know if I have enough rotations around the sun for that to happen.

9. I'll be there in November. Is it worth doing any more stocking?

10. On my last visit I put a few Pondking habitats in the ponds. Both ponds got one nursery and one Grass Bed. The TP got a 2nd Grass Bed. The FB got a Shrub.

11. I'm sure I overlooked all kinds of things so please let me hear from you.

12. Yes I realize I'm being a touch anal compulsive here. But I'm enjoying the heck out of this.

And we're on schedule to have a larger pond (3/4ac) built this fall. I'm looking forward to that.

Thanks!

Brian

Brian:

The focus on the TP pond is to get the forage base established, thriving and diversified size wise. Remember that bass need food to eat that are about 1/4 to 1/3 their body length to grow the fastest. Don't worry about stocking bigger bass in there at the moment, they will grow fast if given enough forage. A 2" bass stocked in May can be 2# by October if there is enough food for them in the pond. The key will be keeping the bass numbers down and NOT fishing for them because they will get hook shy quickly. So I would say wait until next Spring in April or May about a week before the full moon and catch a few female bass from the FP and ONLY stock female bass. no more than 15. Then don't fish for them and let them grow in there.

You will need approximately 1,700 sq. ft of cover for the fish in each of the ponds.... So the cover that you put in there is a good start. Spend your evenings reading about cover in ponds in the archives.

The FP will need bass that are smaller than 14". Any bass that is bigger than that? Remove it. I would feed the fish a good commercial fish food. Endurance Feed is what I recommend. Purina AquaMax is good too, but the fish may develop fatty livers on it and they might not live as long. You could see if you could buy some feed trained bass, fin clip them and put them in the FP. Grow them over the next year until they are sexually mature (14+" or so) and then transfer 15 females to the TP. If you stock both sex bass in the TP, then you will educate them fishing wise as you keep the excess bass harvested out. Then once the bass get to the trophy size you want, they will be hard to catch, and a lot of the forage food that you will grow in there will just be feeding bass that you are removing. To me that is a waste of forage fish.

How deep are the 1/5 ac ponds? Do they have electricity near them? Aerating the ponds if they are deeper than 6-7 feet will really help them hold and grow more fish, and you will need all the forage fish you can grow for the TP pond.

For the new pond that they are building, think about the fishery, create the bottom structure that should be there, and plan/build/place all the cover in the pond before it fills with water..... Maybe have fish species in that one that are different than the other 2 ponds.

Learn to tell the difference between male and female BG. Remove female BG from the FP pond.

esshup is providing good ideas for the TP and FP ponds. IMO your difficult managment activities will be because of the far distance you live from the ponds. Best management is hard to do from a remote location. Lots of things can happen to these ponds while you are not there. This will be a good learning experience for you.

AbqBrian, would you kindly define your goals for each of the ponds in whatever detail you chose? I'm asking this as I understand a BOW as small as 1/5 acre cannot raise more than a couple or few LMB to any size. Depending on your fishery/fishing goals, there may be several other combos than the typical BG/LMB one that could more readily satisfy your fishing itch.
I'm not knocking the traditional BG/LMB pond. It's just that I hope you are aware that once LMB and BG are established in a BOW, it can be difficult to change the makeup of the population to other species perhaps more interesting or suited to your goals.
As an example, our 1/4 acre pond came with LMB, YP, and grass carp. I've added BG and GSF and reduced the plethora of small bass by removing 100+ three years in a row to help the sunfish get established. This year I've seen 1 bass about 18" long; I have 1 about a foot long eating pellets, and then all I see otherwise are fingerlings. I haven't removed a bass for 2 years. Last season there were several in the 10" to 14" size range. They're no longer visible.
I live on the pond, walk around it fishing or throwing food several days a week. I'd see other bass if they were still here. What I'm saying is this experiment has not turned our pond into a bass pond. The YP are nearly gone. The BG, HBG, and GSF are great. All sizes are represented with some pushing the Colorado state records. I find it quite easy to be the primary sunfish predator, keeping numbers down to a reasonable level. The viscera of all sunfish includes quite a bit of white fat.
All this to say managing the small ponds and the soon to be built new one will be very difficult from so far away. That you've caught some decent bass from such a small pond speaks to it not being harvested for all these years. It's hard to imagine more than a handful of 2, 3, 4, or 5 pound bass in there. You'll get to know all of them quickly.
Each trip to Tennessee must be something that you Really, Really anticipate, right?

Yeah, being halfway across the country isn't ideal. However my BIL lives there and is now a lot more interested in his two ponds so they wouldn't be neglected between my visits. He works home construction so I'm hoping those fancy fake habitats will inspire him to make some with the endless construction debris that's out there.

Thanks so much for that detailed input! Let me try to focus more.

1. What should I do with those 2 or 3 big bass? The obvious option is out, my in-laws don't eat fish. Yeah, I know. I guess I could have a fish fry and see if I can tempt them.

2. I can buy 1" to 3" bass from that local vendor. Should I do that to intro LMB to the TP? If so, when should I intro them and how many?

3. What about all the small BG in the FP? Should I basically remove them all? If so, is releasing them into the TP the thing to do to build the BG food chain.

4. What about forage quantity in the TP? There were pre-existing minnows (species unknown); plus the 2lbs of FHMs and 100 BG minnows I released in late April. Is that enough or should I stock more? On my last trip (2wks ago) we added 5 or 6 small BGs and 3 of spawning size (didn't do a sex check). I'll be there in November. Should I add anymore BG minnows or FHM?

I guess that's enough for this round, my old brain can only absorb so much. Thanks.

Eat the bass that you are culling from the FP pond.

If they don't eat fish, then there might be an issue harvesting enough and the correct amount of fish from the ponds. The other option is see if any of the neighbors would like the fish to eat, or feed the 'coons.

Stocking 3" bass next July is an option, but you cannot sex them at that size. SO, you will have the issue of having to harvest bass from BOTH ponds every year, and in the process you will educate the bass in the TP pond NOT to bite a lure.......... While you might have big bass in there after 3-4 years, catching them might be a different story. You want to end up with no more than 15 bass in the TP pond to grow to trophy size.

If you are absolutely sure that they are BG and not GSF, then catch small BG from the FP and throw them in the TP. If you have ANY doubts on what type of fish it is, feed it to the coons. You don't want GSF in there (for now).

Research carrying capacity. The gist is a certain size body of water can only hold "X" pounds of fish at one time if it is not aerated and the fish are not supplementally fed. Add aeration and it can hold more fish. Add fish food and it can hold even more fish.

A single bass needs to eat 10# of fish to gain one pound of weight, and it needs another couple of pounds of fish per year just to survive and not grow. The bigger the bass gets, the more fish it needs to eat to survive, and STILL needs 10# of fish to gain a pound.

For forage in the TP, hopefully the large BG that you stocked will pull off a spawn this year yet. No need to add forage fish yet, just see how things are sitting next Spring.

Some ideas. Always dangerous for me. Lol. So I could obviously use some input. To recap.
1. I have a 1/5ac pond that doesn't seem to have any large fish. So I'm aiming this pond to grow a few big bass. I stocked 2 GC, 2lbs FHM, and 100 BG minnows in April. They seem to have done well as there are large minnow schools according to my SIL. I will be there in a few days. Should I add more FHMs and/or BG? It's trivial for me to pick them up locally and add them. Or do I just wait for them to spawn in the Spring?
2. I have any easy source for F1 LMB (2 to 4in). So I'm thinking of adding them to this pond to provide the LMB. How many should I stock in that small of pond? I'm thinking 10 to 12.
Thanks.

A 1/5th acre pond is pretty small for large F1 bass. Like you, I also like unconventional, potentially "dangerous" plans. Potential plan of that type below:

One plan would be to put the F1 bass initially in your main pond. Any you catch during a subsequent spring spawn that are OBVIOUSLY females could be moved over to the small pond. A small number of bass with zero population reproduction might work fine in a pond of that size.

P.S. Have you seen any of your stocked BG this fall? If you can estimate the size and numbers, then some of the "fishery balance" experts on the forum might be able to give you some good advice for your next step.

Thanks for those good ideas. I realize the pond is small. However, the other pond the same size produced a 3lber. My thought was that F1 LMB would be more likely to grow bigger. As I mentioned, the larger pond won't be done for a while. I'll be on site in a week or so and will look at the BGs in the pond.