Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Raising Forage and Bait Conflicting rule of thumb

There are a couple of generalizations that I have heard repeatedly during the relative short time I've been involved in this forum. I would like to state what I presume to be the general rules of thumb and then raise the question that the rules seem to be at odds in at least one way. Perhaps I am just misunderstanding the rules. I would like to know the experts thoughts. Or maybe "it just depends".

Rule of thumb #1. The initial stocking of BG (or could be other fish also but will use BG as an example) has an out-sized chance of producing the biggest and best the pond will ever have to offer. Later generations will struggle to perform as well as the initial stocking. Explanation: This makes sense to me that a new pond with lots of resources for a limited number of fish would offer these fish the chance to outperform. As spawning takes place there will be lots more fish in competition and it will be difficult to provide the environment that the original stocking fish had.

Rule of thumb #2. Leave the biggest and best BG in the pond. One reason is to provide the Best genetics for later generations. But another reason is the large dominant males and females will keep subsequent generations from gonad development early causing them to put their energy into growth (to compete with the larger fish for spawning sites) rather than their reproduction organs. If all the large BG are harvested it will lead to an overall smaller population of fish since the fish will put energy into reproduction early rather than growth.

Does anyone besides me see the conflict in the above two generalizations that I have heard numerous times on this forum? Let me elaborate. The initial BG we stock in early spring will likely spawn once or maybe more in that very first year. At three or four inches in length. So if these original stocking fish develop reproductive organs early and put energy into reproduction early, how is it they become the best fish ever for the pond?

Wouldn't it make sense to stock a small number of large adult BG along with the normal stocking numbers so the original stockers would delay development of sexual organs if a person was managing for a trophy BG pond? Would a person not want these fish to exhibit growth rather than gonads? And how come the first fish are a hard act to follow is they developed sex organs early rather than growth because of the lack of large adults to suppress sexual organ development?

Now my head hurts. The Legacy Bass thread got me to thinking about this but I have wondered about it before.

I'm not an expert, but I never bought into rule #1. At least not in a pond scenario where emphasis is placed on maximizing BG growth. Do follow rule #2 though.

I did the normal stocking of 1" to 2" CNBG and RES last September, when the pond was less than 1/3 full. With feeding, they were 2" to 3" by December. In December, I stocked about 20- 6" to 8" adult BG and about 10- 4" to 5" BG. When I observed them nesting this spring, 10 or so large males dominated the nests I saw and were breeding with both large females I stocked along with them, and also with the CNBG females from the initial stocking, which were about 3.5" by late April. I only saw a couple 4" male BG on nests. I am hoping to get native BG genetics into the offspring in case we get a bad winter. CNBG are the only ones offered for sale around here. I caught the bigger stockers from a friend's local pond and transferred them a few at a time. His original BG stock was northern strain.
Hopefully, my big males kept some of the smaller CNBG males from nesting.

If the goal is to grow large BG, then rule #2 applies. Just like in deer hunting, you will never shoot a 10 pt if you keep shooting 4 and 6 points.

How does setting slot limits and total harvest fit into the equation? I am limiting BG harvest to 50-60 fish per year in my 1+ acre BG/LMB pond. BG seem plentiful and healthy but LMB numbers are still low after a fish kill several years ago. My goal is trophy LMB and plentiful keeper BG (my neighbor likes to eat them). Few LMB are caught, and all released right now.

I think you've chosen a tough row to hoe, RAH. Trophy LMB (especially in numbers that allow repeat catchability), plentiful keeper BG ( suppose that might depend upon the definition of keeper), all in a one acre pond is tough. Back to that knife edge balancing act again in my opinion. The pond will tend to favor one or the other....trophy LMB might equal tons of stunted, reproducing bluegills, while larger bluegills scenario may involve hordes of smaller, skinny bass cruising the shallows.

Not saying it can't be done, just that it will probably epitomize the constant "hands-on" management style we often discuss here on the forum.

I think this is a good question and I wish I would have seen it. I have no idea. "NOW" what is best to do?

I have gone more towards the Idea, if one is not going to tag fish, then throw back the largest for breeder the first 4 to 5 yrs then they need to hit the grease to make way for the younger crop. I have read CNBG have a life cycle of 5 to 6 years before they start to die.

As I pull out the largest at year 5 or so, I would restock with Jumbo CNBG (My preference Overton Select) and cull the biggest and some smaller (under the stocker size) until I had THE/MY Balance the way I like it.

I would like to prevent/control the gonad development, to foster growth, but it seems to be a difficult issue to monitor and control in my mind.

Last year it it looked like I had 3 spawns and this year I have had 2 for sure already and fish are back on the beds again so I have no idea what is in store other than the bass and CC will have plenty to eat and I had better catch a lot of fish. I told the grand kids they will have a fishy summer, at least. Kinda off subject, but number of spawns a year I would think influence gonad development too?!

I only fish once or twice a year. My neighbor maybe fishes 4 or 5 times a year to pull out the 50 to 60 nice size (mostly fat 7-9") BG. I really want the large bass so visiting kids might occasionally hook into something that gives them a real thrill.