|
Forums36
Topics42,113
Posts571,668
Members19,115
| |
Most Online13,012
Jun 7th, 2026
|
|
|
1 members (Sunil),
3,628
guests, and
112
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame  Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
What was the consensus on hybrid crappies? Do they grow faster? Are they less fecund? I seem to remember there was someone here that got some through Rex (Rainman) and there was a thread about it? Teejaeh or Shorty? The reason I ask is I plan on catching some broodstock crappies in the spring from a local lake and planting them to spawn in one of my hatchery ponds. My hope is to feed train them, and when I can sex them plant one of the two sexes in my trophy production pond. Was going to use black crappie but I remembered the largest crappies I get in as a taxidermist are natural hybrids including this 21 inch fish from a few years ago.  I should be able t catch both whites and blacks for broodstock. I wonder which sex is preferred of each species, or does it matter? Thoughts?
Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 10/06/15 08:46 PM.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,981 Likes: 18
Ambassador Lunker
|
|
Ambassador Lunker
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,981 Likes: 18 |
I think TJ has hyb crappies.
Hold on there...Cecil are you saying the largest crappies you see are naturally occurring hybrids? Is this consistent?
Last edited by sprkplug; 10/06/15 08:31 PM.
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
I think TJ has hyb crappies.
Hold on there...Cecil are you saying the largest crappies you see are naturally occurring hybrids? Is this consistent? Yes at least 90 percent of the time and mostly from one lake chain. They look more like a black crappie but with less intense spotting (but not the bar pattern of a white crappie), and will only have 6 dorsal and anal spines like a white crappie. I've done a good number of 17 to 18 inch fish like that over the years. Hybrid vigor?
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,981 Likes: 18
Ambassador Lunker
|
|
Ambassador Lunker
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,981 Likes: 18 |
That's what I'm pondering. Do you think the hybrids consistently achieve a larger size than the parents? That kind of runs against the grain, doesn't it?
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
That's what I'm pondering. Do you think the hybrids consistently achieve a larger size than the parents? That kind of runs against the grain, doesn't it? Not if it's hybrid vigor.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080 Likes: 1
|
|
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080 Likes: 1 |
Curious, is it the hybrid achieves a larger size more quickly but the parent actually ends up bigger at the end of the day, like HBG vs BG, or do the hybrid crappie actually reach a larger overall size than the parent at the end of the day?
![[Linked Image]](https://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=11852&filename=I_subscribe_zps2qlyoyn2.gif) Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
Interesting read. http://www.scout.com/outdoors/wired2fish/story/1495658-do-you-know-your-crappieApparently according to another link J.M. Malone and sons use a male black crappie and a female white crappie.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080 Likes: 1
|
|
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080 Likes: 1 |
What was the consensus on hybrid crappies? Do they grow faster? Are they less fecund? I seem to remember there was someone here that got some through Rex (Rainman) and there was a thread about it? Teejaeh or Shorty? The reason I ask is I plan on catching some broodstock crappies in the spring from a local lake and planting them to spawn in one of my hatchery ponds. My hope is to feed train them, and when I can sex them plant one of the two sexes in my trophy production pond. Was going to use black crappie but I remembered the largest crappies I get in as a taxidermist are natural hybrids including this 21 inch fish from a few years ago. I should be able t catch both whites and blacks for broodstock. I wonder which sex is preferred of each species, or does it matter? Thoughts? Cecil. Help me out. If I saw that fish I would just call it a black from the coloring and move on. How can you tell it's a hybrid?
Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,981 Likes: 18
Ambassador Lunker
|
|
Ambassador Lunker
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,981 Likes: 18 |
That's what I'm pondering. Do you think the hybrids consistently achieve a larger size than the parents? That kind of runs against the grain, doesn't it? Not if it's hybrid vigor. So the hybrids have the capability of out performing the parents, where ultimate size potential is concerned? I'm all about hybrid vigor, but was under the impression it did not allow for greater growth than could be achieved by the "pure" parental strain? whoa...looks like Bill beat me to it...
Last edited by sprkplug; 10/06/15 09:36 PM.
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 733
|
|
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 733 |
That all sounds fact to me. Waiting for tj and Rex to comment. Tj's didn't seem to have a good start but has seen little to no recruitment if memory serves me. And Rainman can get his hands in them. Ciecil think you'll just call Rex if you can't get yours to horizontal mombmo?
Water is the basis of all life, by design!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
What was the consensus on hybrid crappies? Do they grow faster? Are they less fecund? I seem to remember there was someone here that got some through Rex (Rainman) and there was a thread about it? Teejaeh or Shorty? The reason I ask is I plan on catching some broodstock crappies in the spring from a local lake and planting them to spawn in one of my hatchery ponds. My hope is to feed train them, and when I can sex them plant one of the two sexes in my trophy production pond. Was going to use black crappie but I remembered the largest crappies I get in as a taxidermist are natural hybrids including this 21 inch fish from a few years ago. I should be able t catch both whites and blacks for broodstock. I wonder which sex is preferred of each species, or does it matter? Thoughts? Cecil. Help me out. If I saw that fish I would just call it a black from the coloring and move on. How can you tell it's a hybrid? Mainly it has only 6 dorsal and anal spines of a white but lacks the distinct vertical bar pattern of a white crappie. The markings are more of that of a black crappie (scattered) but not as numerous as that of a pure black crappie. Kind of in between the two.
Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 10/06/15 10:21 PM.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080 Likes: 1
|
|
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 6,080 Likes: 1 |
Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
That's what I'm pondering. Do you think the hybrids consistently achieve a larger size than the parents? That kind of runs against the grain, doesn't it? Not if it's hybrid vigor. So the hybrids have the capability of out performing the parents, where ultimate size potential is concerned? I'm all about hybrid vigor, but was under the impression it did not allow for greater growth than could be achieved by the "pure" parental strain? whoa...looks like Bill beat me to it... I thought hybrids could outgrow their parent species? I've never seen a 3 pound regular strain bluegill but took in 3 pound hybrid once.
Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 10/06/15 10:28 PM.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
Curious, is it the hybrid achieves a larger size more quickly but the parent actually ends up bigger at the end of the day, like HBG vs BG, or do the hybrid crappie actually reach a larger overall size than the parent at the end of the day? Don't know for sure. Just know the largest crappies I take in are usually natural hybrids.
Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 10/06/15 10:29 PM.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
That all sounds fact to me. Waiting for tj and Rex to comment. Tj's didn't seem to have a good start but has seen little to no recruitment if memory serves me. And Rainman can get his hands in them. Ciecil think you'll just call Rex if you can't get yours to horizontal mombmo? Link above says successful recruitment is low although they are not sterile. Would prefer to produce my own. Looks like the white crappie broodstock will have to come from a reservoir and the black from a local natural lake.
Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 10/06/15 10:41 PM.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,883 Likes: 117
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent Lunker
|
|
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent Lunker
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,883 Likes: 117 |
I've caught HBCP in my pond up to 16" - I'm sure there may be some larger - I don't fish my pond very often except through the ice - less than 20 times annually.
There is recruitment - I can't definitively state F2 grow slower or are more likely to be preyed upon which is what some literature states. To date, I do not have a population management issue. I wonder if they should truly be used like a triploid - put and take? They have only been present in the main pond fishery for 5 years, certainly not long enough for any solid science to be established. However, so far, they've been a successful addition to my fishery, and have provided several meals and good times on the ice.
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau ![[Linked Image from i1261.photobucket.com]](http://i1261.photobucket.com/albums/ii582/teehjaeh57/I_subscribe_zps69249d43.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,103 Likes: 24
Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
|
|
Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,103 Likes: 24 |
Cecil, I have heard zilch on whether or not HBCP have hybrid vigor and out pace the parents. That makes me think that the F1 HBCP are similar in size and growth to that of the parents.
The only reason the sole producer of HBCP does it, is the inferior offspring that allows LMB and other apex predators to maintain population controls on offspring.
I am picking up HBCP Tomorrow, winding my way around Arkansas, Kansas, Iowa, Illinois, Indiana, Ohio, Tennessee then Finally to CMM before heading home. Walleye, HBCP, SMB, HSB and HBG are the current fish on the menu.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,668 Likes: 60
|
|
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,668 Likes: 60 |
tj, Rainman, got a question for you and for anyone else that want to chime in. My son would like to have some crappie in our 3.5 acre pond but as you both know this is a no no. But here in your discussion, I understand that hybrid crappie might be a possibility?? Like many here, I am attempting to grow some large catchable CBLMB and I am thinking these HBCP might replace the TP that will die out in Nov if not before and will leave the pond with fewer forage to feed the CBLMB(provided by Overton's). Would these HBCP be useful to the CBLMB and give my son some Crappie? And plans are to restock the TP again this April.
Thanks
Tracy
Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.
Tracy
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 29,788 Likes: 1295
Moderator Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
|
|
Moderator Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 29,788 Likes: 1295 |
Crappies eat fish for food, Tilapia eat algae (mostly). The crappie will be taking food away from the LMB (YOY that will grow to be larger food).
IF the goal is to grow large CBLMB, then I wouldn't stock another predator that competes with them.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1
Hall of Fame Lunker
|
Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 20,043 Likes: 1 |
Sent an email out to two great state biologists I know asking what lakes would be best to find white crappies to cross with the easier to find blacks. ( I have 100 lakes just in my county). Anyway turns out a lake just up the road has whites and blacks and it's no coincidence both he and I have seen large examples of the hybrids from that lake.
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,668 Likes: 60
|
|
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,668 Likes: 60 |
Crappies eat fish for food, Tilapia eat algae (mostly). The crappie will be taking food away from the LMB (YOY that will grow to be larger food).
IF the goal is to grow large CBLMB, then I wouldn't stock another predator that competes with them. Thanks esshup for responding to my question, I did not think about th crappie eating the forage fish, I was thinking the CBLMB would eat the crappie, my bad  Tracy
Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.
Tracy
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,883 Likes: 117
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent Lunker
|
|
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent Lunker
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,883 Likes: 117 |
Tracy - if you want crappies, I strongly advise going with the hybrids. So far they've been a good addition to my fishery...I recommend harvesting everything you catch and supplementally stocking like you would with CC or RBT.
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,103 Likes: 24
Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
|
|
Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,103 Likes: 24 |
TGW1, I agree with what was said about the HBCP being a competitor, but ONLY the F1 stocked. Almost all offspring will become snacks, but there may be a low number recruited. Rainbow trout in winter with Tilapia in the warmer months is proving to be an awesome combo in creating double digit bass, fast.
I think you could stock 300 HBCP without adversely affecting your CBLMB growth.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,103 Likes: 24
Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
|
|
Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,103 Likes: 24 |
I'm sitting in SW Kansas with a few hundred HBCP right now,,,,
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,869 Likes: 303
|
|
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,869 Likes: 303 |
TGW1, I agree with what was said about the HBCP being a competitor, but ONLY the F1 stocked. Almost all offspring will become snacks, but there may be a low number recruited. Rainbow trout in winter with Tilapia in the warmer months is proving to be an awesome combo in creating double digit bass, fast.
I think you could stock 300 HBCP without adversely affecting your CBLMB growth. I have a question re Tilapia. Are they really much of a forage fish for bass? I get where they eat unwanted vegetation and generally don't compete with LMB for forage. And maybe LMB will eat some smaller tilapia from time to time, and even some larger ones when temps cool. But is it really true that tilapia, where fairly common, constitute a major part of a LMB diet throughout the summer?
7ac 2015 CNBG RES FHM 2016 TP FLMB 2017 NLMB GSH L 2018 TP & 70 HSB PK 2019 TP RBT 2020 TFS TP 25 HSB 250 F1,L,RBT -206 2021 TFS TP GSH L,-312 2022 GSH TP CR TFS RBT -234, 2023 BG TP TFS NLMB, -160
|
|
|
Moderated by Bill Cody, Bruce Condello, catmandoo, Chris Steelman, Dave Davidson1, esshup, ewest, FireIsHot, Omaha, Sunil, teehjaeh57 |
|
![[Linked Image from lh6.ggpht.com]](https://lh6.ggpht.com/_6_-SgakQ9co/S3Nx1jGAJWI/AAAAAAAABKU/DJIy4ZnF1t0/s800/I_subscribe.jpg)
