Im glad I made this thread 2 years ago. I had it in my head that I stocked 4 acres worth of CNB and RES until I read back in this thread to realize that I only stocked 1 acres worth. That could've been a big mistake. Im meeting with Overton Fisheries today to get a quote on the remaining stock needed.
David, I normally don’t post about anything I have no experience with, but I will make an excerption in this case. I only can dream of having a 9 acre virgin lake with a once in a lifetime stocking opportunity, but I do have more than 10 years stocking and managing experience with Texas farm ponds.
Pay attention to what Overton tells you, but I will tell you what I would do with your unique opportunity.
First let me qualify my remarks about Todd Overton and Overton Fisheries. I was his very first customer about 12 years ago when I first found him at TAMU negotiating for purchase of his fish farm. I wanted to stock Hybrid Stripers in our new 2 acre pond, against the advice of TP&W. Todd told me he would find some for me - the rest is history – TP&W now recommends HSB to stock in Texas farm Ponds.
Next step - I participated in early selection of CNBG brood stock, selecting the best of the best brood stock each year. Todd continued to the present date – IMO, he has the very best pure Florida genetics this side of the Mississippi River!
I have NO business interests in Overton Fishieries – just a good satisfied loyal customer!
Given your present opportunity, I would stock numbers of pure Florida CNBG recommended by Overton and let them grow out until pure Florida Camelot Bell LMB were available.
After first spawn of Camelot Bell LMB spawn, I would begin culling each and every one I could catch that did not meet my criteria of fast growth and confirmation. IMO opinion you have an opportunity to create a world-class fishery. CONGRATULATIONS!
George, I appreciate your interest. I had the opportunity to fish at Camelot Bell this past summer and I got to pick Mike Fraziers Brain the entire time I was there. My plan is to stock Camelot Bell Fingerlings this summer. I met with Walt yesterday evening and I think we got a game plan for my pond.
Last March we stocked 900 CNBG 2"-3", 200 RES 2"-3" and 20lbs. FHM (These spawned several times over last summer)
Next Month we will be putting in: 3400 CNBG 3"-5" (Mature ready to Spawn) 850 RES 3"-5" (Mature ready to Spawn) 120lbs. FHM 900 6"-8" Channel Cat
June or July 500 Camelot Bell Florida Bass 30 Triploid Carp(I sent in my application this morning to TPWD)
Ive got some other ideas also but for now I think that this a solid plan to get things off on the right track. Im also locating my fertilizer now so that when water temps are ready I will be also, Walt Overton tested my water and recommended 95lbs. of 12-61-0 to start.
David, great job! Your place looks terrific! What a great setting you have out your back window.
I hope my lake catches up with yours soon. I've got a couple acres of water in mine now. I look forward to a full pool of 10 acres in the next 12-18 months. I hope to start posting pic's soon.
Sounds/looks incredible David! I would probably cut the CC numbers by 2/3, personally, at least in an initial stocking. 100 CC per acre is kinda high, but quite doable. They will also become a huge biomass in short order even if they can't spawn successfully, taking up resources/space the LMB could occupy along with potentially becoming a tough competition for your LMB! CC are cheap and easy to add in higher numbers at any time, but a real bugger to remove if overstocked!!!
Have you already got enough over abundance of aquatic vegetation for the Grass Carp to eat without removing too much wanted vegetation?
Sounds/looks incredible David! I would probably cut the CC numbers by 2/3, personally, at least in an initial stocking. 100 CC per acre is kinda high, but quite doable. They will also become a huge biomass in short order even if they can't spawn successfully, taking up resources/space the LMB could occupy along with potentially becoming a tough competition for your LMB! CC are cheap and easy to add in higher numbers at any time, but a real bugger to remove if overstocked!!!
Have you already got enough over abundance of aquatic vegetation for the Grass Carp to eat without removing too much wanted vegetation?
I question the high stocking rate of CC as well. They are a PITA to remove as they grow older and difficult to remove when becoming hook shy.
But I respect David’s plan – he may love CC for food and fun - they are a blast to catch, just don’t ever release them. We stocked CC heavily in our original pond – everyone wanted catfish and they did serve a useful purpose – they controlled over population of LMB and we grew some of our largest CNBG!
Not knowing the long range plan for Camelot Bell LMB – there may be a strategy for the numbers of CC – far be it to question David’s stocking plan based on professional advice obtained. I say go for it – exciting program! George
N.E. Texas 2 acre and 1/4 acre ponds Original george #173 (22 June 2002)
George, I had very similar thoughts on the strategy behind the CC...especially since only 500 Camelot's are going in...a fairly low number there suggestive of wanting big Bass as a goal.
I want big Bass!! But I also want something in there that's fun for my kids and family to have fun catching. That's the reason for the #'s. I may back off of those numbers on the cc a little since it seems like every one here thinks its to many.
Rainman The grass isn't bad at all that's why we are only putting 30 in, hoping that they can keep it that way.
David, it is your pond, and I love catfishing! I commented on the "high" number off CC because of what I stated above....they are relatively cheap to stock at advanced sizes if more are wanted, but damn hard to remove once stocked. I presumed with the plan listed you wanted big Bass, so a double whammy could be with lower LMB numbers to control CC offspring, you could get a significant CC recruitment from spawns.
Young GC will eat a lot, and aquatic plants give great cover for plentiful forage fish growth to raise those big bass. You may also want to delay your GC stocking till you near problem plant coverage. The GC MAY prevent WANTED growth.
Not much in a pond happens quickly, and most of us get anxious and impatient. Trying to guess what your pond will do ahead of it happening, like stocking GC as a preventative, could wind up becoming an even more difficult management issue. Like with CC, GC can be stocked if and when needed/wanted, in advanced sizes at reasonable prices.
I'd just hate to see you here posting about a problem created that was originally intended to be a cure. EVERY part of the pond's ecosystem, natural or man introduced must balance....ANY change has profound impacts thoughout the entire system.
As embarrassing as it is, my first pond, before finding this site, was documented by an NRCS agent for in-house training on how NOT to have a pond built! Almost everything that could be done wrong, was....right down to a "dirt pusher" burying 3 complete oak trees in the CORE of the dam as filler material. Fortunately, it was discovered in the repair work as it would not hold water above the original ground level.
A couple of thoughts. FIH has found that Lusk was right about pond vegetation. When you eliminate one type, another is going to take it's place and you might have more problems with the newer one. That goes to Rex's point about vegetation that you really don't want. I've heard and agree that about 20% vegetation is about ideal. Some of it, like duckweed can become a show stopper.
I have very seldom seen a successful CC reproduction in Texas when bass and big bluegill are present. They may pull off a spawn but the young get eaten before they can grow. I think I can identify one from my original stockers 12 to 15 years ago. And, they dang sure get hook shy.
It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.
Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.
Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
Dave ain't kidding! I learned early and often that you need to have a good recognition of aquatic weeds in your pond. I've never seen shallow clear water around here stay clear of weeds very long.
In my pond it has been very tough to establish vegetation due to steep sides, cold spring water, sandy soil, and I suspect I may have stocked the wrong crayfish. I would wait on grass carp as they do a very effective job of controlling vegetation and can get the job done in relatively short order so there is no reason to put them in before any vegetation is established.
In the absence of vegetation would the GC feed on other fish?
Hey David, we agree with the majority of the forum members on the catfish stocking numbers. Need to cut that down some. Also we recommend to hold off on any catfish stocking initially. Baitfish only to start with, but can add catfish at same time as the Camelot Bell bass, or later in the fall. Also don't forget about hybrid stripers. Could stock those in fall 2014.
Will Carp help out with this type of algae? I just got my permit for my Carp and ordered them today.
David, check with Todd on numbers of tilapia to control filamenteous algae - they do an outstanding job and will provide excellent forage for your Camelot Bell LMB. Water temps will soon be optimum to avoid morts - we'll be picking ours up in a couple of weeks. You have an exciting program - I enjoy your posts. George
N.E. Texas 2 acre and 1/4 acre ponds Original george #173 (22 June 2002)