Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations What posts/anchorings for a dock?

I would guess this topic has been covered before, forgive me if I am duplicating previous threads... All direct help, thread links, etc are welcome!!

I have a small (1/3 acre), protected (bottom of a hill, trees on 3 sides) pond in Wisconsin. Being that we live "up nort", we will get a fair amount of winter ice on the pond... However, being that its a small pond and fairly protected, I'm hoping/thinking that the ice won't shift or move enough to cause much damage to docks/posts/anchor points. I just had the pond dug last summer and we had very little runoff this spring, so my pond is maybe half full right now --- its about 5-6 feet deep, with 5-6 feet to go until full pool...

I want to put a small permanent dock in (I do not wish to remove it over the winter), and with the low water levels, I have full access to work with the post to ground contact points out of the water. I am free to dig holes in the dirt instead of mess with sinking wood or metal below the waterline.

Sooo.... Wood or metal? Concrete or none? Lots of options here... Here are my thoughts so far...

Menards has Playstar brand dock components... So my main option there is using 1 5/8" galvanized pipe... I could set those 3 foot into the soil and concrete them into place... Will the metal poles shift much (or bend??) due to winter ice? Any other downsides to working with the pipe? If I do go this route this, I assume I should indeed use concrete to anchor?

Otherwise, I could use PT 4x4 or 6x6 and sink them 3 feet or so into the soil. I had also thought about using 6 inch concrete tube forms (for 4x4 posts) and make a concrete piling that extends from below the soil to above the water line, with the 4x4 sticking up above the concrete/ above the waterline. (dumb idea or not??) - I don't have much experience working with concrete for underwater applications... Not sure how fast the 4x' or 6's will rot out in submerged applications... Menards only carries one grade of PT as far as I know... If PT would be the strongest/cheapest/easiest and would last 20+ years, that would be great... But if it might rot out in 5, I want to go a different route.

One more option... Dig a hole for a 6 or 8 inch piece of PVC... Put some rebar the length of it and fill with concrete... Strong and stable??? or will I run into problems here?

This is a small pond and I don't want to go overboard (and am trying to find the cheapest workable alternative), but I do want to do it right... Any help would be appreciated, especially those of you who have experience with these materials and freeze-up in the north...

Thanks!!

Menards has PT rated for underwater/in ground use, but it's special order.

We have a pier that has been in place since 1977 using 2" galvanized pipe for uprights, pounded into the lake bottom. It's never been taken out for the winter. The pier is on the SW side of the lake, and has seen ice 3' thick.

If you can figure out where the water level will be at full pool, and the water level will stay pretty constant, then I'd look into the metal pipe system.

If the water will fluctuate, then I'd look into a floating dock.

Sounds good.. I'm thinking of put in a smaller permanent dock and later adding a floating section... Something I can both tether to the permanent dock to make more room and also move out deep to act as a raft.

Full pool mark should be easy enough to figure out, I'm look at putting the dock somewhat near to the spillway... The bank is fairly steep at that point. Should be able to figure it out pretty close to good 'nuf...

.6 retention is plenty fine for freshwater underwater applications. Most all (if not all) of Menards AC2 is .6 The special order .8 would be great, but overkill and is more designed for saltwater app's.
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We used .6 and added a feature that would allow replacement if it was ever necessary

I was just thinking to myself that I'm probably over thinking this.. Just go with PT 6x6 and be done with it.

Bigger is always better. I would do concrete footers that extend above the pond bottom with a bracket that connects the 6x6 to the footer.

I saw tonight that Menards has some clearance priced 2 5/8" galvanized dock pipe... 12'.. Might work out... If I go this route, I could probably just dig/pound it in, but I might as well dig a bigger hole and pour some concrete to anchor... Could use some 8" concrete tube forms... Figure I'll space the two posts at just under 4', that way I could run either a 4' or 5' wide dock and anchor to the dock frame with pipe sleeves.. With the pipe and pipe sleeves I should have some leeway to adjust the dock level based on water level (if needed) or even convert it to have the end float and have the sleeves slide freely up/down on the pipe..... I'll think on this a little more and see what happens...

I went to my local rural electric company. They sell used telephone poles for $10 for a 45 foot pole. I took my chain saw and cut them to the length I needed. Some of the poles where probably 10-12 inches in diameter. It was probably overkill but I shouldn't have to worry about the poles rotting for a long time.

Electric poles would be great... I have an electric coop just down the road, I'll check it out...

I could hardly sleep last night, kept going back and forth between lumber or pipe. Funny, but I woke up multiple times last night and found myself calculating volumes/bags of concrete needed for 8" vs 12" forms accounting for displacement of the pipe vs 6x6's... (First in my head, which was darn close... Then on paper).. LOL. Real life examples for the future when my boys ask me why they have to do their homework "'cause they'll never use that stuff again..."

Might be tipping in favor of 6x6's (or electric poles?) due to ease of working with as far as bracing, decking, etc... No special pipe sleeves needed.. Plus, its cheaper and I think will look much nicer than the pipe. Pluses and minuses to each, I suppose. I think I will opt out of using footers/brackets, I'll just sink the lumber right in the concrete... Should suffice for my purposes, but I did read most of the threads in links you guys posted and others I found on this site... Quite a lot of info!!!

I'm appreciating all of your replies!

We didn't use concrete for the pipes, just used a garden hose to "wash" them down into the sand. Just pounded them down the last couple of feet. We found that if we didn't do that, it'd sink down a couple inches over time. The clamps made adjusting the height of the pier easy. We had to adjust one corner after the pier was built.

We installed the pipes in the middle of the winter by standing on the ice. Easy to measure for the same height too, just measure from the water level in the lake, use pipe cutter to cut to length after installation.