Pond Boss Forums AQUATIC VEGETATION Balance of plants in the environment Lilly Pads

I fish a 3 acre farm pond in N Ga. About 10-12yrs ago all the lily pads/cattails were removed (not by me). The pond fished good and was easily accessible from the bank. Now lily pads have taken root and gone crazy. They grow all the way around the bank, 5-15ft thick. It's pretty much impossible to fish from the bank during the summer, and (other than crappie, which have boomed, some really big crappie plus a TON of little dinks) it doesn't seem to really be helping the fish population much (particularly bluegills). I'm thinking maybe the lilies caused the crappie boom, which has put a hurtin' on the bream,which leaves the cats/bass with less food. Would it be wise to remove some/all of the lilies? What would be the best way? I intend to keep some crappie this spring to "thin the herd". I expect that to help the fish population problems some, but it still doesn't solve the bank fishing situation.

Thanks,
Sam

Hey, Sam, welcome to Pond Boss! Good question and one that some of our resident experts should be able to give you some feedback on before too long. Sit tight and let's see what those in the know have to say. Again, welcome!

Thanks for the warm welcome. I don't have much $ to invest in pong management (high school senior) but I have plenty of time and a strong back to work. I plan to major in environmental science and get a job as a fisheries biologist, so pond management really fascinates me. Needless to say I plan to stick around the forum for a while. It's some very interesting reading.

That's awesome, Sam! Congrats on having a clearly defined plan for your future and being ready to go after it! There are a lot of great people in that field on this site who are usually very willing to give advice and share their experiences, so don't hesitate to ask for guidance. Some of the best fisheries programs in the country are also represented here on the forum, so there may be some opportunities for you to gain great insights into the various schools that could be best suited for your chosen major.

Like I said, stick around for input on your question and definitely stay involved - this place is a great source of info and is a lot of fun as well!

Will spraying round-up have any ill affects on the pond? Will it kill the lily pads?

I don't believe Round-Up is safe for aquatic applications, unless I'm mistaken in my memory. Read the label very carefully - many herbicides for use around the home are absolutely unsafe for aquatic use.

Hey, experts, who can chime in on this one? How about Bill Cody, the man who knows lilies like no other!

Well, the search function is a wonderful thing! Round up is a no-no. I'll call up to the local feed store and see what they have that is safe for aquatic life. It'll give me a chance to price some fish food, while I'm at it.

There are aquatic versions of glyco (roundup).

From Aquaplant
http://aquaplant.tamu.edu/plant-identification/alphabetical-index/white-water-lily/

http://aquaplant.tamu.edu/plant-identifi...can-water-lily/
Rodeo, Aquamaster, Eraser AQ, Touchdown Pro, and AquaNeat are liquid glyphosate formulations and have been effective on white water lily. These are broad spectrum, systemic herbicide. Systemic herbicides are absorbed and move within the plant to the site of action. Systemic herbicides tend to act more slowly than contact herbicides. An aquatically registered surfactant (see the label) will have to be added to the Rodeo solution for good results.

Good answers are slow today.. I got nothing

In addition to ewest's good advice look into Shore-Klear Plus (manufactured by those that make Aquashade) - price shop. So if a place sells Aquashade they can get Shore-Klear Plus. It contains glysophate plus a surfactant all in one jug; sold as a gallon to be mixed diluted. BE careful what you believe from those at feed stores in general, some will sell illegal stuff for ponds. I suggest you find out if the lilies are spatterdock, American lotus, white water lily or some other lily like floating plant. Do a little homework, you never get away from homework.

Based on what you've told us so far, the crappie are way too abundant probably due to too much 'cover' and too few predators. Your work will be 'cut out for you' in trying to remove enough small 'dink' crappie to get the pond back in some sort of decent balance. It will probably take at least 800-1000 removed to make a noticable impact on balance.

I suggest you get some sort of boat, used or homemade to use on the pond for angling. 3 acres of water is plenty big enough for small one man boat. A homemage boat or float device to fish from does not have to be expensive. Several pieces of styrofoam or plastic jugs on a light wooden frame would work for a HS senior. I have plans for a light weight 1/4" plywood boat; basically a big shoe box. Then the weeds are less of a problem and you can easily fish the outside edges where lots of the fish 'hang-out'. IMO a boat is indespensable for fishing in a pond with shorline weeds/string algae.

Environmental biology is a good field if you like the subject. There are some good colleges in the south for the field. Get good grades in HS, they will help you in college academics.

I just did some research, definitely watershield. I have a canoe I fish out of, but my younger brother and some of his friends fish from the bank on occasion. I'd like to be able to clear out a 20-30ft length of bank for them. I wonder if spreading some gravel would stop them. Only problem is a 30ft gravel bed is going to get costly. What if I pulled them out by the roots and put a 5ft wide rock "buffer" on either end? I know I can get more than enough rocks to do that.

Aquatic plants will grow in soil, gravel, even in the crevices between rocks. All they need is something to anchor themselves. They derive their nutrients from the water column. Gravel will not help and over time it will be filled with organics. Hand pulling may or may not work. Some plants propagate readily from pieces of root. I do not know if Water Shield is one. Any pieces of root left may sprout.
Someone else will probably post a better response and solution.

One option is after pulling out all you can then cover the area with black plastic sheeting and weight it down with bricks or rocks. That will suppress growth (no light) in the limited 30 ft area.

For other mgt options see

http://aquaplant.tamu.edu/management-options/water-shield/

For clearing small areas 20 - 50 ft, look into using a Y shaped weed cutter. It is sharp as a razor and a little costly ($100-120) plus shipping, but works well for cutting lilies, lily-like plants and numerous types of submerged near shore vegetation. Cutting for control will involve probably monthly cuttings?. I have a Y cutter and would not be without it for natural weed management. The gelatinous coating on the watershield leaves helps them survive herbicide treatments. Before investing in more expensive glysophate products, I would test a small 5ft area with just Round-up to see if it is effective. A systemic acting herbicide will provide the best long term control for small areas.

As mentioned, forget the gravel-rocks idea.

I've never had any success on watershield with glyphosate herbicides (ie RODEO, AQUAMASTER, AQUANEAT, ERASER, or other "Roundup-type" products). Traditionally, only NAVIGATE/AQUAKLEAN (granular 2,4-Ds) were effective for treating this very hardy and tenacious specie. But, when imazapyr received its aquatic registration, the "silver bullet" was discovered through some subsequent field-trials.
A 1/2% to 3/4% solution of POLARIS or HABITAT combined with a 1/4% solution of a good methylated seed-oil surfactant, applied topically, mid-summer, yields excellent (but slow) control of watershield - and even allows spot-treatments of boat-lanes and other specific sites while leaving other areas for "cover" (if desired). Use a hand-held pump-up, backpack or ATV-type 12-v sprayer for applications.

Fishinbub - for herbicides take Kelly's advice - he for sure knows weeds and treatment.

I second that !!!

I third. Motion carried and passed.

Thanks for the help. As soon as the lily pads start to grow, I'll hit em hard and heavy in that one section. Everywhere else I'll leave em be.

Don't get in a big hurry. If you treat too early ("as soon as the lily pads start to grow"), the plants aren't overly receptive to the herbicide's mode of action. Plus, there will likely be more plants in the same area whose pads haven't yet reached the surface (and will be unaffected by the initial topical treatment).
June/July is as early as I'd suggest for your first treatment. It will likely take two treatments the first year (in the same areas) to keep the plants in check - and maybe less in subsequent years.

dont pull them out by roots. wife & son tried that on a windy day on her small 30 ft gravel beach & by the time winter set in , what was just a patch on the southeast corner turned into a total lakeshore disaster on my 5acre pond.it was covered from shore to 10 -20 feet out

however i did find glyphosate in high concentrate (35% from local mfa) did have major impact on it. but only pads that were above surface .i would spray early in day & cover all of pad. i'm now on my 2nd year of treating & now is just spot treating pads that are coming up.

i did not notice any impact on my fish population dut did lose all vegataion in or near the pads. however i would recommend if it is a small pond that you treat it in small sections at a time. i did it all at once but then my 5 acre pond had a larger surface area & because it was so thick i dont think any made it in the water anyhow except on the edges of the deeper water

shore grass is starting to come back ive notice & now considering planting corkscrew eelgrass in several spots, after reading bill codys post ive researched it. low growing, not sure how it will hold up to winters in central mo

good luck