Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Evaluating and adjusting fish populations bass not growing

I stocked a new 1 1/2 acre pond last Oct. Its a great pond with good structure and rockpiles. Went to Fenders and got what he wanted me to have. About 200 4-6inch bass 250 billgills, some shellcrackers, some hybreds bluegills, some perch, and channel cats. I also put in 3000 fatheads and 2000 more fatheads this spring. The fatheads are reproducing and had alot of tadpoles. I feed fish food almost everyday. Everything is growing great. Big bluegills and hybreds, the perch are growing a little. Have not caught any cats yet. The problem is almost a year later the bass that I see and catch are only about 7 inches long. How big should they be? I talked to a hatchery over in PA called Zetts. They said that something is wrong and I need to come get some of their bass. What do you think>

Fender often does not provide enough forage items for growing large bass fast. His main goal is stocking for a balanced pond. Fathead minnows are good for jump starting bass growth to 6" maybe 8" long. After that fatheads are about useless for putting weight & length on larger bass.

Two year old northern bass (which yours are)with proper food should be 12"-14" long; some can be as big as 15"-16" during their 3rd summer. You have a forage fish problem, plus you stocked too many different predator species (cats, perch, & bass) of fish to grow primarily big bass fast. Cats perch and hybrids are competing with bass for the smaller fish items. Bass are coming up short in your stocking combination. The highest numbers of big & largest bass grow in ponds with the proper numbers of bass,, with bass as the only predator and plenty of PROPER numbers and sizes of forage items.

Hybrid bgill was another mistake in a pond for big bass.

Do a search here for:: growing large bass or try:: thin bass. Thin bass search will tell you why bass are thin and or small.

If growing big bass is your goal you need toread Bob Lusk's booklet - Growing Trophy Bass available on this website. Even Florida bass in Florida would not grow well due to your stocking combination and SEQUENCE.

Tom, You stocked at least 100 extra bass and need around 1000 2 to 3 inch bluegill immediately. You also said some perch and some cats. How many? Both are top line predators, compete with the bass, and everything is trying to make a living off fatheads and the few baby bluegills that survive past fry stage. The energy gained per meal is not equal to the energy expended to get it. Thus, no weight gain. We call that anorexia in humans. When I stand sideways and look in the mirror, I can tell whether my calories consumed versus expended are in balance and I ain't having the same problem your bass are. You are feeding pre teen and teenager fish. At that age, just like humans, they are eating machines and need a lot of groceries. You have too many voracious hogs feeding at the trough.

Reread everything Bill Cody said. Read a bunch of the stuff here and you will see the problem(s). Toss a hundred or so bass over your shoulder or eliminate other predators. Get rid of the hybrids totally. Hybrids don't give, they just take. Add 1,000 bluegill while you can buy small forage breeding machines instead of larger ones ($$$$$).

Bill also mentions proper stocking SEQUENCE. He means timing. Fenders should have told you to stock fatheads and bluegill, let them spawn, and then later add predators. Its about like putting a coyote in a field with only some baby rabbits or stocking cows while you are planting grass. Lousy timing. The fish farm didn't do you any favors.

It is possible that you might have other problems. Have you checked your water quality? However, starvation is the immediate problem.

Dave,

I've got the same "defective" mirrors in my house. They should outlaw those things or attach a tag that says for fish use only. . That would solve Tom's bass size problem.

Russ

Thanks guys. I put in exactly what Fenders told me to do. I did not ask for anything. He seems like such a nice guy and seems to know what he is talking about.I am going to start catching and eating the hybreds. I have read that they were a mistake. He also put shelcrackers in there. You are right. Just not enough food. Have I stunted these bass or will they grow with more food? I think that I will go back to Fenders and get a bunch more of the smallest bluegills that I can. Maybe even somemore fatheads. Should I try anything else, like crawdads? Thanks again.

go with 3 or 4 hundred big bluegill ( buck a pc). and get rid of the hybrids and give away or kill bunch of bass. i had same problem , the fish people would rather make one trip , get their cash and your on your own. of 100 bass i put in , i have about 20 left. spring i put in 100 6" regular bluegills and i have bluegill fry everywhere and fathead fry. i'm sure the pallets helped the fatheads. the hatchery got you off to bad start.

Tom - Thanks to Dave D. for clarifying some of my comments.

Fender is a real nice guy; I know him well. If you mention all this to him he will call all us "NUTS" at this website. He will say he has been doing this stuff longer than any of us. He is "OLD" and been raising fish since the 1950's. His stocking philosophy is for a all -around-general fishing pond with diveristy. If you told him you wanted to primarily grow big bass fast then he may have given you different advice. He is knowledgable, but needs to know what your main goal is/was. Maybe your goal changed or became refined after your got your fish?

Fender, as with most hatcheries, push for the one time stocking plan; add all fish at once. It just takes longer to get large fish that way. This way they get all your business. This way works,, but it is not the best way to quickly grow fish to large sizes.

The shellcrackers (redears) will not cause you any problems but they will not produce very many offspring to feed bass compared to bgills. Unless your are a really good fisherman, you will probably catch very few of them with hook and line and rarely ever see them; maybe even wonder if they survived.

Hyb bgill's offspring is "trash" and rarely grow very big after many generations. The first few spawns can result in some decent sized HBG. Fish as many of them out as possible and do not restock hybrids. The adults get big pretty fast and they eat lots of bass & perch fry and 1" bass, plus compete with young bass for food.

Fender's bluegills when managed properly will grow to 9" & 10" long. Fenders bass are quality northern bass.

Fender does sell crayfish but they are a mixture of papershell crayfish and rusty crayfish. The rusty crayfish will eventually outcompete the papershells and become dominate crayfish in your pond. Bass will eat both but they prefer papershell. You could stock several hundred if you have rock piles for cover.

If you are not feeding your fish pellets the catfish are eating small fish and bottom critters to survive. I would remove them when ever you catch them. Each catfish takes the place of one bass. Remove a catfish and you will gain a bass. Fender taught me that a 5 lb cat eats more than a 5 lb bass. As him about this. Also remember to ask Fender about what Zetts said to you about his bass.

To get best growth out of your bass you should have stocked fewer of them and stocked 30,000 fatheads instead of the initial 3000 and left out hybrids and cats. Perch will thrive in your pond about 4 or 5 yrs then they will gradually disappear as the bass grow to 15"&16"+. A 16" bass eats 7" & 8" perch. Perch eat bass fry and young bass similar to hyb bgill.