dave thanks for suggestion---i am interested in that from an aspect also for the benefit of getting the tax write-offs that come with a farm/crop---if you have any specific suggestions you can email me [email protected] ---the two people i talked with in different nrcs offices (one was an old friend of mine in another county) both gave the same song and dance so i'm not sure talking with them further would help a lot but i'll give it a shot. i take it nrcs has different rules for different states? thanks again