Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose Controling BGs with just male LMB

I'm recently wondering if I could control an over population of native Michigan BG (If it developes), in my pond intended to have YP and SMB, with just male LMB? I'm not sure how I would Identify Male LMB but assuming that is possable then wouldn't it be possable to acheive a once a year stocking of male LMB in small numbers which would reduce BGs W/O taking over the SMB population?

I'm sure this is not an original thought. Has anyone tried this?

I don't know if the LMB would cross with the SMB. The other problem is getting same sex LMB. I don't know of any hatchery that sells them, and the fishing season in MI. might not allow you to harvest any LMB while they are spawning.

"I don't know if the LMB would cross with the SMB."

A possibility. It may happen.

See this recent thread on LMB vs SMB and sexing fish.

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=197965&fpart=1

esshup summed it up... Finding a source for male only LMB would be a trick and many states and it sounds like yours is one of them doesn't allow the harvesting of bass during the spawn when amateurs have the highest % chance of correctly sexing bass... You may be able to call up a hatchery, explain what you are looking for and see if they can hand select male LMB for you. I suspect that would come at a high price tag though. LMB and SMB will cross, how common that is I really don't know. They are commonly known as "meanmouth" bass. I don't know for sure, but I am guessing the odds of male LMB crossing with female SMB would be lower than female LMB crossing with male SMB. If you could source male only LMB, stocking several a year could certainly help you in controlling your BG.

I'm not too concerned about finding 5 or 6 male LMB each year one way or the other, but you and others bring up a concern about the cross breading. I wonder what the consequences are if the LMB do cross With the SMB? What kind of fish is a resulting "meanmouth"? Could this be the best of both or maybe the worst?

Meanmouths are very good game fish... If I recall correctly I believe they are sterile, so no worry of them crossing back.

OK CJBS, Sound like this could be OK then. A couple more question if you don't mind.

1) Is there any significance to the name "Meanmouth"?

2) Do you think Meanmouth (MMB) bass would also eat BG like the LMB? Or, are they more like the SMB relitive to BG consumption?

3) Lets say after 5 years of stocking 5 LMB/year I end up with 100 MMB in addition to my 25 LMB. Are MMB aggressive and likely to croud out the SMB?

I realize this is asking a lot considering the MMB must be a fairly uncommon spices. I appreciate your help.

It's one thing for them to cross (mostly unlikely), and it's another for survival to be high enough to even worry about, and then if the few offspring that do survive are sterile...

Personally if it was me I wouldn't even worry about any hybridization.

I would not bet on that.

North American Journal of Aquaculture 2004; 66: 133-136
doi: 10.1577/A03-021.1

Ploidy of Backcross Hybrids of Largemouth Bass and Smallmouth Bass

Boris Gomelsky*
Aquaculture Research Center, Kentucky State University, Frankfort, Kentucky 40601, USA

Konrad Dabrowski and Mary Ann Garcia-Abiado
School of Natural Resources, Ohio State University, Columbus, Ohio 43210, USA

William Stilwell, James H. Tidwell, and Shawn D. Coyle
Aquaculture Research Center, Kentucky State University, Frankfort, Kentucky 40601, USA



The results of our study will be used in the evaluation of F1 hybrids of largemouth bass and smallmouth bass as potential candidates for aquaculture. It is known that rearing of fertile distant hybrids may result in genetic contamination of parental species, since escaped hybrids may cross with fish from natural populations. If F1 females produced diploid eggs, the Fb progeny would have been represented by sterile triploids. However, the diploidy of backcross hybrids of largemouth bass and smallmouth bass revealed in the present study indicates that these fish will be fertile, and therefore the rearing of F1 hybrids may have negative genetic consequences.Transactions of the American Fisheries Society 1991; 120: 283-289
doi: 10.1577/1548-8659(1991)120<0283:MHANAI>2.3.CO;2



Multispecies Hybridization among Native and Introduced Centrarchid Basses in Central Texas

DONALD C. MORIZOT, STUART W. CALHOUN, LISA L. CLEPPER, and MAUREEN E. SCHMIDT
The University of Texas, M. D. Anderson Cancer Center, Science Park, Research Division, Post Office Box 389, Smithville, Texas 78957, USA

J. HOLT WILLIAMSON
U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, Denver Federal Center, Post Office Box 25486, Denver, Colorado 80225, USA

GARY J. CARMICHAEL
U.S. Department of Agriculture, Agricultural Research Service, Catfish Genetics Research Unit, Post Office Box 38, Stoneville, Mississippi 38776, USA



Allele-frequency differences at 11 polymorphic protein loci provided discrete genetic markers with which to estimate the extent of hybridization among native and introduced centrarchid basses in central Texas streams. Native Guadalupe bass Micropterus treculi and northern largemouth bass M. salmoides salmoides now coexist with introduced Florida largemouth bass M. s. floridanus and smallmouth bass M. dolomieui in these streams. Interspecific hybridization was detected in three of four populations from the Blanco and San Marcos rivers, hybrids making up at least 31.8% of the individuals sampled. Complex hybridization patterns were evident, because F1, F2, and backcross hybrids were detected. At least one individual exhibited genetic markers of largemouth, smallmouth, and Guadalupe bass. Extensive multispecies hybridization threatens the survival of the endemic Guadalupe bass.