Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Creating the food chain Golden Shiners?

Has anyone stocked 250K golden shiners into a new or newly renovated pond? I did so this year after siphoning the pond over the winter. I put the shiners in in mid May and 15lbs. of fhm the next day. I am just curious to see if anyone has put that many shiners into a pond with no predators. I have been hand feeding once a week and see tons of them. They were about 1.5" long within a month but now a month or so later they seem to be about the same size. Should I be seeing more growth? I wonder if there are just too many to get much growth out of the ponds natural production plus feeding once a week. I am trying to squeeze a feeder into the budget because the pond is 80 miles away. The pond is about 1.5 acre. Any thoughts?

My take would be that your guess that there are too many to grow just from the natural food present in the pond, could be pretty accurate. If only half those fish have survived - and probably more than half have, as there are no predators other than birds and possibly a few turtles - and they weigh .25 ounce each, that's still 1,875 pounds of fish in a 1.5 acre pond, or over twice the carrying capacity of a regularly-fertilized pond, which I'm guessing this one is not? At any rate, it's considerably more fish - and possibly drastically more if more than half of them are still in there - than any pond that size will support with any growth at all. Even if you had a feeder feeding multiple times a day, you would still be at serious risk of a fish kill unless there's something I don't know about GSH that small.

I would think you should add predators pronto, or you could risk losing all that forage without a single GSH ever fattening the belly of a LMB.

If you get a feeder, that will certainly help. 1.5" golden shiners (GSH) at this time of year is not unusual growth though. Adirondack Pond another forum member just posted a source for a $40 feeder... For GSH, just plain old koi food or other cheap feed will do them just fine. You'd be amazed at how few of those 250,000 survived though. Even with no fish predation, there are numerous species of predatory water bugs that will prey on fry. I have a forage fish only pond and watch predatory water bugs eat my fry all the time. Back swimmers, water boatman and water scorpions all examples of highly predacious water bugs. Even the FHM you stocked the day after the GSH would have eaten some of your GSH fry... GSH fry are TINY as you saw in the clear bag. A moderately sized adult FHM can easily feed on them. There often is little success in stocking the 250k fry into an established pond, but many have had great success in new ponds like your own. Get a feeder up and you'll be OK.

So CJBS,what is a new pond vs established pond? I am stocking 6-8" LMB(175) and HBS(50) this fall in a predatorless 5 acre pond. Then I was thinking of using the GSH fry and TFS adults next spring as I didn't have any water in the pond prior to May to stock adult GSH when they were available. Is it then a poor choice to use the fry?? du

Just so I make sure I am answering what you want to know. Are you basically asking what is the difference between a new pond and an established ponds? And if you add LMB and HSB in the fall, it is smart to add GSH fry and TFS adults the next spring?

Yes. The answer to the first question may answer the second. My pond has CNBG (2-5") and FHM, both stocked in May, but no bass. But bass going in this fall. By reading your post, I'm not sure if adding the bass this fall "establishes" my pond to the extent that stocking GSH fry next spring is a poor choice over adults. So, 250K fry @ $250.00 or GSH adults @ $10.00/lb along with adult TFS(if available) given my circumstance..Which IYO is the better value?...du

david u I am assuming you want a LMB/HSB pond as your goal based on your stocking #s. If so you can either stock the TFS this fall or early next spring as both methods will work. Adults in either case as I have not seen anyone selling TFS fry only adults (2+ inches). If you want the TFS order now don't wait as they sell out often.

Either GSH approach could work and I would try both at the same time next spring - one box of fry and maybe 3 pounds of adults. Read the prior threads on how to stock GSH fry - you need the right size food (plankton) for them at the critical time.

IMO, if you already have LMB and HSB present, the bigger sized GSH would be a good choice. Say 4"-6" fish. If there are no fish predators present, then the fry would be an option. However, Eric's hybrid idea is also great. Cut the adult numbers in half, say only 5 pounds. Stock the fry 2 weeks before adding the adult GSH...

I have read different ideas on where to stock the fry. A lot of what I have read has said to stock them in open water. I think the theory behind this is that it is away from fish holding cover and this should reduce predation. However, in the wild, GSH spawn in grassy, thick shallow areas... IMO, I would think stocking the fry into shallow, say less than 6" water where aquatic vegetation is THICK would be best if you have that available in your pond. It most closely mimics what a GSH fry would come into the world at. I think very shallow areas in thick vegetation protect the fry the best. I don't think anyone has conclusive results as to which location is better though. Most of what I have read has shown that stocking fry into an already predator filled pond rarely leads to a successful GSH population. I've never messed with GSH fry other than ones I have raised myself by collecting eggs, so I don't have much hands on experience in that field... What ever you ended up doing du, let us know and keep notes. That way we can all learn from you... The stocking of GSH fry is still a fairly new idea and there is still a lot to learn from it.

Thank you all for your ideas on stocking GSH. I'm going to try the mix of fry and adults next spring, along with some TFS, if available...du