Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Building a dam New Pond Plans, Need Input

OK guys, I met with an NRCS agent on Friday and we surveyed my new property for a lake. I like him and he seems knowledgeable with 25+ years of experience. For an overview, take a look at the following topo and aerial photos:


Large Topo showing drainage area. This lake will be the last stop for water before reaching a floodprone creek bottom region.


Topo zoomed in showing property lines and future site of lake.


Aerial photo showing same. The pond will probably be 2.5 acres, maybe a little less.


This is a view from the damsite on the North side of the lake looking south into the Eastern draw of the lake. I'm calling the land between the two draws the middle point for future reference. We will be building a house in the future on the middle point.


This is the a view from the same area except down the Western draw of the lake.


This is a view standing on the eastern edge of the damsite looking West down the future dam. As you can see the dam will be fairly tall at 25 ft.


This is a view from the western part of the dam, where the western ridge drops off, into the northern part of the property. It is flooded now due to unseasonable rain. Everything is flooded right now. At least I have an idea of what the woods will look like come duck season.


This is a view of a shale pit pond on the western edge of the property. This pond is relatively deep at 12 ft. The emergency spillway will empty into this pond after crossing the western ridge.



I know you guys have a lot of experience and would appreciate any insight you have. I've been reading this site like a madman for the past month and have learned a great deal, so thank you. This is my first time building a lake and I want it to be done right. So any comments or criticism is more than welcome.

My next step will be trying to decide if I want a standpipe for overflow or something like the syphon system. I'm going to need some help with this. Thanks in advance!

A couple more pics.

From middle point looking into east draw.


From middle point looking into west draw.

It looks like a very nice pond site welcome to PB

Thanks rockytopper. Do you think the dam will be too tall or the lake too deep? I'm kinda limited by the topography of the place.

Welcome to pond boss forum!

IMHO, building an embankment (dam) too tall or too deep is like building a storage shed or barn to big - they are never big enough.
Build the structure as tall and the pond as deep as is legal and possible for the site. Keeping your budget in mind of coarse.

Just my opinion.
Ed

CM are you aware of this tool?
http://www.acme.com/planimeter/

It will help you figure acreage of your pond and or water shed. Based on your topo you may want to consider making a smaller pond like one acre. Your land based on the topo appears to drop 20 feet in 200 ft. Thats a lot of dirt to raise. To create a 2.5 acre pond would run you in the 50 to 60k neigborhood. a one acre based on a rough calulation is going to run around 12 to 15 k. It appears that you have good soil based on all the ponds in your area. Good luck I'd be glad to help if I can.

Thanks for the input guys. That is a neat tool rockytopper. It looks like the pond will be roughly 1.8-2 acres in size. I know that's a lot of dirt to move. Once I get some figures back from the NRCS I'm going to ask some reputable dirt movers in the area who have built ponds before to bid it out. We'll see if it's in the budget or not. If not, we may have to wait a few years because I want to build it as big as possible.

Well, it's been a year and the pond is officially started. I was able to get a good bid despite the high diesel cost. The pond dam will be about 30 ft tall. The next step is trying to figure out how to build the syphon system. What size pipe? What valves do I need? Where do I find trash guards? How deep do I bury the pipe? I have a ton of questions so before I post them all I would like to know if this issue has been discussed before. I have searched the board but I find no specific details about how to build one. And I will try to post pictures along the way.

Welcome to the site. That info is on here some where and someone will tell you where soon..
OTTO

Bump for siphon system info.

The NCRS has a program that will calculate flow and siphon matters . If they have looked at your location they will have the data and can run the calculations. Go look at the Pond-Dam Piping systems web site.

http://www.ponddampiping.com/index.html see on left side of page - 1 conventional and 2 siphon systems

Selected PB threads on the matter - a lot there.

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=5397&fpart=1

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=5208&fpart=1

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthread...=true#Post63367

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthread...true#Post108919

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthread...=true#Post41053

The last link has this :

burgermeister
Lunker
Member # 1766

posted July 23, 2005 11:23 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is a guideline for siphon sizing with formulas. http://cotton.pi.csiro.au/Assets/PDFFiles/WATERpak/WPAp9_11.pdf

Ewest,
Thanks for the links. For some reason, I can't get the link to siphon pipe sizing to work. Anyway, I'll contact the NRCS office and see what they say.
Does anyone have any pictures of the siphon system that Pond Dam Piping uses? Has anyone used this company for their systems? I tried emailing them last week but haven't heard from them. I figure I have about one more week until it's needed.

I have some pictures of the project so far. The first is about two weeks ago when they started on the dam.


The wife and kids having fun playing in the dirt.


This is looking at the two giant oak trees in the bottom and the small pond. I hate to see big trees like this go, but I have to build a pond.


It's amazing to see the DC8 knock over these trees with ease.


I'll post some more later.

You'll have to go back and look at the photos I posted at the start of this thread to compare to the recent photos because I don't know how to put them side-by-side.
This first is from the main point looking North to the dam.


This will be a boat lane that will oneday have a covered area and electricity.


Most of this area had a very thick layer of clay but the builders did hit rock when digging out the boat lane.


I knew the main drainage had a spring because it stays wet year round. As we have found out, it has several springs like this one.


This is on the west ridge looking down the dam. I'm standing right next to the emergency spillway area. The trackhoe is placing dirt to try and widen the dam up top. Because this dam is 30 feet tall the builders ran out of dirt.


We knew this would happen from the NRCS projections, so they are getting clay from the adjacent pasture. As a bonus, the bumpy pasture will now be flat.


From the east side looking down the dam.


Finally, looking at the hump in the middle. I wanted this for the fish because of the depth in this area. There's probably 10 feet of water in the bottom of the pond right now. I know it's deep but we were limited by the topography. As a plus, I will be able use the water in the fall to flood the bottomland for ducks.


That's all I have for now. If someone has pictures of their siphon pipe installation or contact information for Pond Dam Piping it would be greatly appreciated.

Take a look at the resource guide on the PB home page. Go to piping or something like that. Pond Dam Piping is an advertiser here.

it would have been nice to leave the big oaks in the pond for habitat and cover, did you make any rock piles or pallet houses, pvc xmas trees will work good too!

Dave,
Thanks for heading me in the right direction. I'll give them a call.
I will be placing many rock piles and brushpiles in the pond. Those big oaks are pushed into a pile on the backside of the dam. Right now, I'm trying to stay out of the builders way and let them get everything up to grade. The next big project is the siphon pipe.

At one point you called this a little pond This thing does not look little to me..The guy running the equipment should know something about the pipe.

Great pictures especially the ones with the family.

Otto

Otto,
I guess little is a relative term. It will be a decent sized pond with a lot of depth. Again, I hope I didn't overdo it when it came to the depth of the pond but having it 12 feet deep would have resulted in only about 1 surface acre due to the topography. Like I said, I will be able to use the water for other things so I decided to make it deep. Do you think having submerged grass in a pond like this would be a problem?

I used PondDamPiping for my two 12" siphons. They were very helpful in sizing the system and with advice along the way. They even offered to buy back any pipe I didn't use, but I did use it all. Looking back, because of the huge, gentle slope of the land all around my pond, I could have gotten by with one 12" siphon, but we haven't had a hurricane go by here since the pond was built. And it would be a bit of a problem to get up one day and find water over the emergency spillway, which happens to be my neighbors driveway.

1 It is very had to say for sure that water will never go over the emergency spillway. NO MATTER HOW MUCH PIPE YOU USE OR HOW MUCH MONEY YOU SPEND. The emergency spillway is named that for a reason.

The grass that is left in the pond will not hurt anything. actually it will help hold the ground until the water fills and stabilizes the ground....

Some one will probably debate this.

Otto

Otto,
I should have been more specific when I stated 'submerged grass'. I'm thinking of planting milfoil or hydrilla or coontail moss to the fish have some more cover. I don't know anything other than a biolist told me not to. But every 'Great' bass fishery I've been to has some sort of submerged grass. With my pond being deep, I could just draw it down 5-6 feet if the grass ever became a problem and kill it. What do you think?

I know you directed this question for Otto but if it were me I would not under any circumstances plant hydrilla. Hydrilla is HIGHLY invasive and spreads easily and very quickly.

I would go to the vegetation section and search for more pond friendly plants.

Thanks just my two cents worth.

Wow, that is one heckuva dam, man. Great project!

YOU BETTER LISTEN TO JEFFHASPOND

YOU WILL NOT EVER HAVE A PROBLEM GETTING ALL THE AQUATIC PLANTS YOU WANT.


OTTO

cmfulmer,

If you want some weeds come on over to Russellville. We can go out on Lake Dardanelle and get you all different kinds.

American pondweed is good for fishing from what I have heard. It has a slender stalk and a small leaf that floats on the surface.