Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Pond Lease/Rental Rates

Hi Folks:

Just discovered this forum by blundering onto it through some other site links. I've spent a couple of days here doing a "crash course" on pond health. What a great resource for me as I'm a new Rainbow Trout "Daddy" with a pond which used to be a gravel pit.

The 4 acre pit has been flooded for over 50 years as a result of the business striking a spring and filling it up. It is well populated by freshwater shrimp, caddis and stone flies, cat-tails, etc. There are large sections which are 25 ft deep and most of the pond is about 12 to 15 ft deep. It is approximately 650' x 230' in size.

There are also two other pits which are considerably smaller and somewhat shallower.

The land owned by a another person and I've stocked the trout based on a handshake. I want to formalize the control of this spot and the owner is open to my leasing it for a 5 yr period with a second 5 yr option.

At this time, the venture is for private angling among 6 friends only. Long-term plans are to install a windmill for aeration.

I'm looking to get some feedback on what yearly rate to offer the owner and be fair to both sides. Since this will be "found money" as far as the owner is concerned, I was thinking of $500 per year.

Please give me your thoughts on a reasonable opening offer. Thanks for taking the time to assist.

Can't tell you what peace of mind I get from sitting by the water for 20 minutes watching the 'Bows taking flies and nymphs in the evenings ... just like taking a tranquilizer.

Regards to all,
Lee Smith

Great find for you! If you haven't already noticed, there are a lot of posts concerning windmill aeration. If you search you will find dozens of posts about it.

To me, $500.00 seems like a perfectly valid offer, and maybe a touch on the high side depending on other circumstances.

As you mentioned, this would be "found money" to the current owner, so that is in your favor.

If the current owner does not use the property at all, I think that is in your favor.

If you had a way to see what the taxes were for the plot of land you want to lease, that could be a good target number if the current owner was even aware of how much he/she was paying in taxes for the idle land.

The other thing that could be in your favor is if you were going to be a good steward of the land. For instance, were you going to build a dock/pier? Are you going to do some improvements? Will you keep other trespassers off? and Will you be leaving the fish in the pond when you are done leasing the land? Does the land need cleaning up?

A lot of the things I mentioned take work, and you can use some of the work as "sweat equity" and hopefully reduce the cash outlay.

Good luck.

Lee,

I'll try to respond from a landowners view...the money sounds reasonable, but an even better deal for me (the landowner) would be the stewardship your team exercises over the property. If you would say you would take care of the property just as if it were your own and mean it and follow through, then that would carry a great deal of import to me.

It sounds like a win-win and I hope you are successful. Depending on your mutual trust, you may want to consider a formal leasing arrangement to protect both parties. Good luck!

Thanks for the thoughts guys. Based on your suggestions and some further thought, I've jotted out a rough list of concepts to be included in the lease which will have the language smoothed and be drawn up into a formal lease by a friend who is a lawyer.

Please take a moment to give me your thoughts on anything I missed or to point out something in which I may have gone overboard. Again, the idea is to be as fair to both sides as possible in this.

Here are the "rough jottings" and will place an emphasis on:

-Custody & Control of the ponds (3) goes to us for a 5 year period with a second 5 year period extension possible by re-negotiation.

-That it will be Private Property and "No Trespassing & No Fishing" signs will be posted in the immediate vicinity of the ponds.

-Over the period of the lease, we may be making improvements to the ponds and immediate surrounding area which would be considerd to be the watershed for the ponds. Those site improvements may include such items as a fishing pier or dock, aeration system, small equipment storage shelter, and base a small boat/canoe on site.

-Use of a non-gasoline powered boat will be permitted on the pond.

- With the approval of the lessor, we may apply chemicals to the pond to control underwater vegetation, improve water quality, or treat fish diseases.

-Any fish which remain in the pond at the end of the lease period will become the property of the land owner.

-Land Owner continues to pay any land taxes that are applicable.

-We are guaranteed free access to the ponds across his land for the period of the agreement.

-The owner will not apply agricultural chemicals within in the immediate vicinity of the ponds which would drain into and contaminate the ponds.

- We have the authorization to discharge firearms on site to control predators.

-Use of the ponds will be limited to private angling, no commercial operations will take place.

-We will hold the owner harmless should an accident or injury happen on the property.

Thanks again for the look at this.

Regards,
Lee Smith

I'd buy an Umbrella Policy

Lee,

A couple of things jumped out at me, a landowner. First, the chemicals. If you address that in the agreement, I think as landowner, I would want veto power over any chemicals prior to their use in the ponds. Also(as landowner), I would agree to not harm the pond in any way, but would reserve the right to treat my property with chemicals as needed for my purposes.

The other item was firearms...may not be a problem, depending on landowner, but I would not permit firearms as a landowner myself. My ponds are too close to my house.

Just my thoughts. I think you are doing the right thing by writing it down; you won't be sorry.

Ditto ML's last line. If you get it all down in writing agreeable to both parties it will work out best.

Hopefully forum residents can help think of items which need discussed/agreed on. Your final lease agreement could be useful for someone else in the future.

I have two thoughts: 1) electricity availability, and who pays the bill? 2) boating permitted?

ML Thanks for your take on things from an owner's perspective. I'll take your comment regarding the chemicals to heart and rework that part a little after some more discussion with the owner.

Regarding shooting of vermin (if required after other methods fail) ... the nearest building is about 2 miles away so accidently whipping a round through someone's picture window isn't as much of a problem at my site as it might be at your location. The surrounding fields (several sections in size) are all seeded to grain or oil seed crops year after year with some left in summer fallow. No livestock have been in the area for decades and if it were contemplated, the selected area would have to be fenced, as none exist now. I think I may add another point with respect to watering of livestock being prohibited. That should cut off that possible threat to pond health.

I have a call in to my insurance company to see about adding a rider to my present third-party liability policy to include potential perils at the pond. Will know more on that soon.

There is no electrical service to the site. Nearest power line is about 1/2 mile away so there are no bills to pay and it would be prohibitive to run power into the ponds. The aeration system will be wind or solar powered. Wind is most likely the choice I'd go with.

I'll add the ability to operate boats as another clause.

Keep 'em coming, and thanks for the opportunity to pick your brains and tap into your experience. This thread might just be helpful to someone else in the future.

I'll keep amending the list of thoughts above until I've incoporated all suggestions which are relevant to my situation.

Lee

Good thread, Lee.

As a newbie, glad to be able to make a small contribution that may also help someone else in the future.

Lee

Good thread and good suggestions! Sounds like a great opportunity. Also as a landowner... I would insist on the liability policy protecting me. I would worry about trash being left. I would worry about any damages (i.e. water polluted, trees shot, ruts in my field, etc.). Finally, as a fisherman, I'd probably want to reserve access for myself and immediate family members or something. If he hasn't stocked it or fished it in 50 years though, he probably isn't worried about that. Lots of quarries around here are party headquarters. Is it gated off or would you have liability too if someone trespassed and dove off the deck to a rock?

Hi Ranger:

Thanks for the reply to add to the thread.

The "Hold Harmless" clause of the insurance would look after the liability portion things and it would be both he & I named on the insurance.

The owner has an interest in fish, but limited to a few goldfish in his pond at home. His dad stocked trout in the pond about 30 years ago and made him eat too much trout as a kid ... so he thinks I'm sort of weird to want to catch and eat them .. LOL.

I got the first fish on Sunday using a small garden worm. Size was a little over 9 inches. Beautifully healthy and great color. No taste of "mustiness" Stomach was crammed with Backswimmers and Water Boatman bugs.

If I could figure how to add a picture, I'd post it but requires posting to a URL first and there 'ya loose me.

Lee Smith