Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose Blue Cats

I am considering stocking blue cats in my new pond. I have access to blue cats through the wholesale bait shop I help out at. I am located in south central PA.
What is the consensus of the experts---Is stocking blue cats in a northern pond (1/3 acre) a good idea or not? I will be stocking BG, FH's and shiners this fall and LMB next spring. I would like to stock catfish next spring as well.
I have built structure for cats in the pond already and I am willing to supplemental feed all of the fish.
Any input would be appreciated. Thanks !!

Shaef

Proud Member of the Thin Blue Line

I would be a little concerned about the blue cats eating everything in the pond. I'm not sure that any of the fish would be safe. It would probably end up being a blue cat pond with 1 or 2 huge fish. I'm not too sure though, as I am not an expert and don't have experience with blues.

Shaef: A pond can only carry (hold) a certain number (pounds) of fish. If you aerate, feed and pay close attention to water quality, you can have 500# of fish in an acre, but I'd be more comfortable with a maximum of 300 to 400 pounds per acre as a maximum. That's all fish; baitfish, etc.

Blues can get very large, and eat some pretty good sized fish. In your pond, you could comfortably hold 100 to at the most 150 pounds of fish if you aerate and feed.

Do the math on the fish that you want in your pond, and the pounds of fish that it'll equate to. It's all about balance and what your goals are for the pond.

Shaef, I think the general consensus of a potentially large predator like an adult blue catfish is that it is simply too much for a small pond to handle. Every pond is allotted only a certain amount of pounds per fish and an adult blue catfish, especially if you're unable to catch it and it grows large, can take up an awful lot of room and leave you with it and not much else. You said you have catfish spawning habitat? Are you able to frequently visit the pond to keep their population in check? I know you're probably looking for something big to tussle with on occasion, but for a pond this size I think CC would be a better option. They too can get quite large, obviously, and will need to be aggressively managed if you do provide them the proper habitat to multiply. There are quite a few unfortunate stories of overpopulating and difficult to catch catfish on these boards. Be careful.

What size were we thinking of stocking?

I think if you are putting the smaller Blues in like 6"-10" I think you could put a few in.

They tend to grow pretty slow and I think if I had the option of purchasing them I would have over the CC but my only option is to catch wild fish and I am trying my best not to do that at this point.

You will get many opinions on this I am sure so the decision will be up to you as what to do.

Just keep us posted.

Personally I wouldn't stock Blues in a pond. I have seen what they have done to two of mine. Basically when I took over control of the ponds, all they had in them where a few big Blues and some GSF. The big ones get harder and harder to catch as time goes by, and they are ferocious eaters. I would stick to CC and manage aggressively. Avoid the temptation to stock at "suggested" rates and be more conservative.

Thank you all for the input, I can go with CC's- no problem- just thought I would ask to see what the consensus was and I am glad that I did.
I guess my other option would be to stick to baitfish, BG's and LMB in the new pond and maybe manage the older pond for cats for something big to reel in every now and then.
Thanks again to all for the input, I keep learning something each day I take the time to read the responses in the forums- what a great resource.

Shaef

Proud Member of the Thin Blue Line

Shaef, how many ponds do you have and what's in them right now? I apologize if you have answered this previously. If you have the luxury of an "experimental" pond, where a "mistake" like a behemouth swimming around all alone in a small pond has little to no ramifications than by all means, give it a shot. I think most of our answers were with the idea that this was going to be an established fish pond that you wanted consistent production from, like all of us have. However, if you have a smaller pond that you can "play with", that won't effect your main pond or cause you too much work and effort in the future, I say have at it. I agree, it would be a lot of fun to fight a big cat in a small pond.

I would recommend stocking a mix of blues and channels in that pond. I get irritated when folks discourage the stocking of blues in these circumstances, just because they can grow large and eat other fish. That's what you are stocking the forage fish for, right? I have a 2 acre broodfish/recreational pond with blues and channels, along with threadfin and gizzard shad, bluegill, hybrid stripers, and few largemouth bass. I also supplement with feed. I have blues up to around 50lbs, channels up to 15lbs, and all sizes down from that. Sometimes blues bite well, sometimes channels bite well, sometimes they have different preferences for bait. Blues fight incredibly hard and have stolen a great deal of fishing tackle. This keeps it exciting, interesting, and more productive from an angling standpoint.

If you want a quality catfish pond then don't be afraid to stock blues or a mix. Since when is growing large shark-like catfish considered a negative?

Omaha- we have one established pond of app 1/2 acre which is 35 years old as well as the pond I just had dug. The new pond is 1/3 acre and currently has 3' of water in it.
The older pond has LMB, BG,a few BCP, blue cats, CC's, a few large koi and I am battling to keep a population of FH's and shiners.
What I am looking for in the new pond is to stock the max # of fish that I can keep well fed and healthy. My main goal in building the new pond was for fishing enjoyment for my dad and my kids as well as a few friends ( we pretty much let anyone fish in the old pond as long as they stop by and ask permission).

Shaef

Proud Member of the Thin Blue Line

Ok, so nevermind then.

Don't want your family pond being a wildcard.

Overton,


I have to agree here, if I had the option to get some blues I would but have not found anyone here that has them.

By the way since you are managing them maybe you can tell us how long it takes to get one of these up to 10-15 pounds and beyond. I am sure if you feed etc in your pond it will help but around here they limit the number of big ones you can keep do to the fact it takes so long for them to reach that size.

Also what would you say the minimum water depth would need to be to raise these or a mixture of them with CC or maybe even a flathead or 2 if you are doing a catfish pond?

This may be an option for an older pond if they do not require much.

Also what would be the best forage base for these Catfish and how long should they have to get established before stocking all the cats?

I know bullheads are a pain but if you were to have a catfish pond would it hurt to add these later as a forage bass, I here they are great forage for flatheads but not sure if blues or CC will eat them or not?

Thanks

Omaha- not sure I am following you-

Todd -- I love it. What a great answer.

I'm actually experimenting with going the other way since I found that I unknowingly stocked some white catfish from a large local hatchery. (They also recently caused another PB regular to drain his pond due to a bullhead overpopulation instead of a few channel cats.)

Don't get me wrong. I love the excitement of hooking a monster catfish while fishing for bluegill. But, my channel cats have caused me a lot of issues over the years. I'm hoping the whites won't get as big and obnoxious the channel catfish. It appears the whites are reproducing, but hopefully won't overpopulate like bullhead. So far, the largest has been about 16 inches in length and of bulldozer shape and strength.

Enough,
Ken

Blue cat growth rates are similar to that of channels early in life, 1-3lbs per year is acceptable range of growth. Once blue cats reach a size that permits them to consume available forage they have been documented to grow 5lbs per year. A lot depends on stocking density, water quality, forage abundance. Minimum water depth would be 4-5 feet, similar to that of our farm ponds, but we have available water source to keep ponds full. The best forage for blues is shad, threadfin and gizzard. But to start them off I would recommend the typical fatheads, shiners, bluegill, etc. Not sure about the bullheads, but I'm sure they would be forage as well.

Cool, Ken, I would surf that bluecat wave and see what happens...

Could you also supplement Tilapia in the spring or would the cats not be able to keep up with them?

Plus when we say blues are they the same as what many call Mississippi Whites?

Mississippi Whites?

In all my years of fishing, I had never heard of a white catfish until I posted a photo of one. I thought is was a pale channel cat. CJBS (Travis) identified it. As Travis explained, they are from the tidal rivers of the east coast. I would certainly think they could have somehow made it around Florida to the Mississippi. The ones in the link above look like the ones from my pond. White Catfish

Sorry Shaef, didn't mean to confuse either of us.

I was curious what your status was with your ponds, how flexible you were with the fish you wanted to stock. Seems I've read enough threads about poor experiences from pond owners with large, difficult to catch catfish they just want to be rid of, and I wouldn't want to add you to that list. However, if Todd Overton deems it a possibility, far be it for me to suggest otherwise. If you do end up stocking some blues, document and take pictures. Interested to see how a potentially very large fish is raised in a small pond.

There is a lot to be said about how stocking density will play a role in the growth rates and growth potential of blue cats in small ponds.

Assuming your pond to have 300lbs carrying capacity and you want to grow your blues to 3lbs avg, stock about 100 fish. Try to keep about 100 blue cats in the system at any one time. Restock for what you harvest. Supplement with pellets as you see fit. If you don't want to grow giants, then remove the larger fish as they are caught. Restock to keep density fixed, if possible.

I can't imagine how you'd grow giant blues (assuming you don't want to) if you keep you stocking density high enough and manage your pond.

I may have found my answer yesterday. I stopped at the bait shop I help out at..I picked up a pound or so of older medium shiners (they were not in good enough shape to sell).
App. 2 dozen went in the new pond with the rest going in the older pond which has blue cats in it.
I threw 20 or so dead shiners into the pond and put a live one under a bobber while I worked a lure with another rod.
I caught 5 bass on the first 6 casts with the lure and then stopped before I lost the lure (I want to take it to a tackle shop and get a few more of these).
As I was reeling in the line with the bobber, a very large fish began coming up and taking the dead shiners off the top. I stopped my bait near the last spoil and within 10 seconds or so I had a big fish hooked. Turned out to be a blue cat- 25" and probably 4-5 lbs.
The fight that cat put up was great, as good as any bass I have hooked so far this year.
After reading posts on this site I know that I need to harvest a few of these cats to keep the pond in balance which I feel is a small payoff to keep a great fishing water.
These blue cats were put in the pond at 8-10" maybe three or 4 years ago. We are still catching bluegill as a friend of mine had his boys down at the pond three weeks ago and caught app 50 BG's in two hours.
I will be putting a few blue cats in the new pond when the time is right. Thanks for all the great info.

Shaef

Proud Member of the Thin Blue Line

Just wondering if the Blue Cats are as hook shy as the CC?

I read through this thread and got lost. Nothing new for me. At first the original question is about stocking blue cats. That there was access for them through a bait shop. Then the blue cats have previously been stocked, and are being caught. Kinda fishy to me.

His old pond has blue cats. He's wondering about putting them in the new one.