I purchased a house last summer, and with it came 10 acres of land, mostly wooded. There are two wetland areas. 1 is a fairly clean pond, looks very shallow. The other appeared to be a swamp, but since it froze we can see it is actually water, but absolutely full of shrubs and even trees. We have cleared a small part of it with a chain saw this winter, creating huge piles of sticks and brush. We stoppped clearing as all we were doing was piling up a new problem, and buying a chipper shredder proved problematic atthis time of year. As soon as we got the shredder, the melt began.
I am going to need a LOT of help with this. Here's hoping you can be as helpful as your reputation implies.

Hi PondsK8r,welcome to the forum.We're glad you found us.Ask away,there are experts here to help with almost any problem you can come up with.Hold on to your hat,and keep your sense of hummer with you,its gonna be a great ride.

Welcome to the forum PondsK8r. Glad you found us... The first pond you mention as being very shallow. Any idea of the maximum depth of this pond? Depth can be very important if you want game fish to survive the brutal winter months Michigan experiences. For most game fish, an absolute minimum depth would be 8 feet and that would probably be with aeration. Many of the pond owners on this forum have ponds in excess of 20 feet... If your pond doesn't have that depth, there are options for renovation if you goals are to grow game fish in it. Often times shallow ponds such as the ones your describing provide excellent habitat for wildlife though.

Toss us a few questions and we'll see what we can do to help.

Welcome to the forum PondsK8r! If you like saving time and money, you'll love this place.

Hello Pondsk8r and welcome to Pond Boss, we're glad you found us. You've already received a welcome from the pond boss, it doesn't get much better than that.




I'm always as helpful as my reputation implies.

Thanks for the welcome guys. I am on my way out to photograph the ponds. The shallow pond will be fine as a wildlife pond - we have seen deer, wild turkeys, skunk, rabbits, heard coyotes, as well as seeing and hearing many different birds (saw a bluebird the other morning) on our land.

The deeper (I think it is deeper) pond is more of a concern as it is better described as a "miasmic swamp" When we first saw it last spring, you could not get close enough to even know if it was a pond or not. But it did have peepers. Later in the year we could verify that it was indeed a pond because we could get close enough to see a thin strip of bright green duckweed.

When fall arrived, we worked hard to clear an infestation of grapevine which allowed us to get much closer to the "pond" from a different angle. And when winter arrived and the "pond" froze, we could see for the first time what the extent of the pond was, and that it truly is a pond. Large by my standards - My previous pond was about the size of a kitchen sink - I will put a yardstick in my photos.

Our goal is not necessarily to have fish (although coachB has plans, I know) but to breed less mosquitos. If that means fish, then I will have fish. I would like to grow marginals and wetland native plants, as well as providing a restful, pleasant environment to spend time. A miasmic swamp does not provide that!

I'll post photos shortly. No matter how difficult that proves to be.

I am really looking forward to the pictures of this place.

I hope you guys are ready for a challenge...It looks even worse today!

grrrr. will post photos.......

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_HwxELamDYHc/S5p9MKxG2lI/AAAAAAAAAak/GT_a188CGPM/s400/HPIM2127.JPG

oops

That's some serious brush. Clearing it out should help immensely, the increased wind and sun will hurt mosquito reproduction and increase the aesthetic appeal. You're probably too shallow for reliable fish over-wintering, but you could stock fast-reproducing minnows each spring to help control mosquitoes.

I realize it probably smells and it's not something you like to look at, but I think it's gorgeous.

Here's another thread regarding mosquito control. Some minnow species to consider. I think you'll find out a lot more about your little BOW when you clean it up a bit and the experts around here will certainly be able to help you get out of exactly what you want. You can look forward to that. I will.

BOW?

Eeek! It's going to smell as well as look bad?

I was wondering whether this counted as an appropriate thread for "controlling unwanted plants" but thought "help" was more appropriate!

Any ideas on how I can clear the brush now the nice sturdy ice platform has melted away? (anyone suggesting a Kayak and a chainsaw will be IGNORED!)

BOW = Body of Water

Wait until June and drain the pond. With the heat of summer it should dry out the pond enough to get a dozer in there and push everything out. At the same time you could make it deeper

But a kayak and chainsaw sounds so fun!

I was in a dozer's bucket with a chainsaw high up in the air this past summer.

Actually, the kayak and chainsaw sounds less daunting than draining the pond and using a dozer.........

If I recall correctly, Michigan has some strict laws relating to wetland areas. If you did decide to go the bulldozer route, you would almost certainly have to obtain a permit to do so. I am not sure what your goals are, but it seems like your property is a very unique ecosystem. I bet the flora and fauna is quite diverse. Habitat like that with mixed woodlands and swamps is often full of many species of birds. Someone like Brettski and particularly his wife would have a field day bird watching there...

Purchasing just a few dozen fathead minnows from the local bait shop each spring would be all you'd need to control the mosquito population if that is your concern. A couple native species which are more adapted to conditions like that may do well, but wouldn't be available from a baitshop or fish farm. The central mudminnow could probably survive year round in your bigger pond and if your smaller pond maintains at least a little bit of water year round, it too... They can actually breath air and in times of low water will burry themselves in the mud!

Central Mudminnow

I was going to chime in earlier, but wanted to see where it was going. MI "IS" really STRICT on wetlands. If this is classified as a "Wetland" , "LEAVE IT ALONE" Until you have a plan and have PERMITS, and that is a process in itself. I know someone that it took around two years to get a permit that was on a wetland for a small pond. Don't cut any trees or clear brush or scrub. I also know someone who spent ten's of thousands of dollars, in defense, for making a minnow pond, and after they were charged with Wetland Violations. He won, but probably would not want to see another minnow in his life.

Anyway, all the existing ponds around the State have been re-classified as "Wetlands" in the past couple years.

Welcome to MICHIGAN!

I took a quick look at the dnre website document, and clearing vegetation is not regulated. Thanks for the heads up though. Dozing is!

PondsK8r, I don't have experience with Tilapia, but if their legal they could be stocked every year to help keep the pond clear.
You can build a floating dock and use it to move around the pond, giving you a stable platform to clear brush.

PS. Remember nothing is illegal unless you get caught , just kidding.

As long as you know what you are doing!

No, JKB, I don't know what I am doing, and I will tread (or bush whack) with caution. However, I am relatively sure that a shrub swamp, although providing wonderful eco-environments for wildlife, can do even better with a little clear water... should help to encourage waterfowl and humans. Anyway - I will need a little access to dump in the minnows. Can't really throw them for 10 feet back and assume they will fall in the pond rather than get caught in the branches.

I will be looking up the wetland consultants listed on the website I found, and we never intended to clear the whole swamp.....

+1

There's not much to add, most of the bases have been covered. I'd toss in some Fathead Minnows asap, in both BOW's. They're really cheap, and you can get them from a local bait store. If you want to put in more than a couple dozen, there might be a fish truck coming to a TSC or grain elevator near you in the near future.

What town is close to you? There might be a fish supplier near you that you are unfamiliar with.

I'm near Ann Arbor. I would be completely unfamiliar with all fish suppliers apart from Meijer. Does local bait store include all the gas stations that advertise crawlers?

This cracked me up.

Hey sk8r

Good posts, and welcome to the forum. Yes, those baitshops certainly are a good place to start on your search for fatheads.

If my friends knew I was googling "bait shop"........


.....some of them would be over with the beers!

These guys will be at the Farm Council Grounds in Ann Arbor on May 8th. FHM $46/gallon

Jones will deliver free in your area, but they have a $200.00 minimum order to bypass the delivery charge.

All in all, I think your best bet is to let you fingers do the walking and buy a couple dozen FH's for each pond for now.

I don't know if all the gas stations will have a bait tank for live minnows. It's easier to throw some worms in a small refigerator than take care of live fish.

A couple dozen FHM's should control your mosquito issues if you stock them shortly after water warms up after ice out. By fall you'll have hundreds of mosquito larvae eating machines.

Does it work like plants? Don't put them out before Mothers day?

No, put the fatheads in as soon as the ice is gone

We seem to have about 6 inches of water over a layer of ice. Is this good enough for the minnows or do I wait until all the ice is gone?

I would wait till the ice is gone

You crack me up also Walt's crawlers are in about every gas station and general store in MI. Make sure you open the package, and a quick whiff will tell you if they are compost.

Registered fish farms in MI. For 2010:

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/mda/mda_aquaculture_192478_7.pdf

hello all Ive been snooping around this forum for years,been pond boss suscriber for couple years also. I have 3 ponds on my property here in s.mich .

sK8r I purchased some minnows at the washtenaw farm grounds from hennerita hills last spring they have a fish day their coming up check their web site for info.

Welcome joe c. Glad you decided to join in posting. How did your ponds do this winter ?

ice just came off today no floaters but heres the scoop on fish day
its may 8th http://www.harriettahills.com is the web site.
I did the fat heads last year my LGB went nuts.

Welcome joe c. Glad you could join in.

I believe that is Harrietta Hills: http://www.harriettahills.com/

Stony Creek started the fish day event a while back. http://stoneycreekequip.com/. The MAA works together, nice group of people.

Here is a 2010 list of MI fish farms: http://www.michigan.gov/documents/mda/mda_aquaculture_192478_7.pdf

They will all, pretty much accommodate your needs. If they have it. Just check it out, if you will.

That's interesting. Some of the producers have some interesting fish. PSK, creek chubs, some different daces, etc.

You have all been incredibly helpful. I have located two possible sources of fathead minnows on my normal weekly driving routes, fired off an email to a wetland expert, and yesterday morning (in the pouring rain) we cleared about 4 foot of shoreline by posting sticks and brush into the chipper/shredder. The woods are full of movement- mostly squirrels this morning. Saw a bluebird sitting on the fencepost this morning, and I THINK I saw a red-wing-blackbird yesterday. I am imagining the soon to take place transformation outside my bedroom window as the trees turn from sticks to lush vegetation. From my bathroom window I can see a BOW, rather than just a thicket. It is pale green, and probably will, indeed, smell as soon as the temperature goes up a little, but it is my pond, and my heart swells with pride to be a pond owner.
I'm probably going to lurk here for a while, but hope to be able to post my progress later in the year.
Many thanks to all who responded. Your kindness, wisdom, generosity and good humor is much appreciated.

spring not far away the sandhill cranes have been back for about 10 days along with my favorite spring sound the redwing blackbird.
bluebirds have also been here along with killdeer,belted kingfisher.Fertilized all my fruit trees this morning,bluebird boxes are all cleaned out .

Definitely stick around and keep us updated sk8ter. Look forward to seeing the season's progressions.

My favorite has to be an old tom turkey. Sends chivvers down my spine just thinking at it. Wish I was at the farm they are most likely already going at it. Only 1 month to openning day of turkey season.

Hi PondsK8r,

I live really close to you. If you need help let me know. Glad to see you on Pond Boss. I will be getting FHM soon if you want to ride with me!

(I am not a stalker, PondsK8r is a friend of mine!)

Just noticed some yellow perch in my pond have no idea where they came from,maybe they were mixed in with the fathead minnows from last years fish day.

Oka-leee!

Hey Joe - I bought 10 lbs of FHM last year from Ye Olde Fish Truck [Arkansas Pond Stockers] and I sorted a few rogue CSBG. I feel it's vital to handsort anything, especially forage, that is headed to the pond. In my case I check my minnows twice - but I really enjoy handling my future pond inhabitants. The CSBG wouldn't have damaged my fishery at all, but carp or bullhead could have. I was pretty impressed overall with the performance of APS considering it was the fish truck, but want to encourage anyone stocking forage to hand sort at least once, if not twice, prior to releasing into your BOW. It's a couple fun hours well spent to prevent a potentially fishery threatening mistake!

Thanks for the offer of a FHM shopping trip CoachB. I will take you up on that. And we will make sure we handsort 'em.
I can hear frogs in the pond, and saw Red winged Blackbirds there today.

TJ good idea sorting,the perch wont hurt but others might good advice.