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#489036 - 04/23/18 10:49 AM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: snrub]
ewest Offline
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Registered: 03/08/05
Posts: 19377
Loc: Miss.
That should work well. See pic for proof.



Attachments
fathedsinpipe.jpg (865 downloads)



Edited by ewest (04/23/18 10:50 AM)
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#489039 - 04/23/18 11:17 AM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: ewest]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
That is a lot of FHM in one pipe!

When we first built our main pond and stocked it, the wife set up an aquarium in our living room. We put I think 4 short pipes about the same size as the one in your picture in the bottom and put a dozen or so FHM in. It was funny to watch them dart from pipe to pipe, the more dominant ones chasing out the others positioning and creating their "pecking order".

We did not keep them long enough for them to spawn in the aquarium but we did see some pre spawning behavior in the pipes with dominant males staking out their territories.
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#489042 - 04/23/18 12:05 PM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: snrub]
canyoncreek Offline


Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 1783
Loc: West Michigan
What size pvc pipe is in the condo in the pond? Are the multiple drilled holes in the PVC pipe important or can the hole on each end of the pipe be sufficient?

Ewest, what size pvc pipe is in your picture you attached?

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#490334 - 05/19/18 08:49 PM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: canyoncreek]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Sorry for the tardy reply. Been busy and missed reading some posts for a few days. The pipe is mostly 2" because that is what scrap I had laying around. Had one piece of 3" in there too.

The holes were drilled with a step drill and drilled to a size I thought was "about right". They are all different sizes. I doubt if they are "important" but my line of thinking was to allow more water flow for better O2 levels and to give the FHM escape routes from predators. It is probably more about my imagination than anything really useful.

I did try to point the pipes in directions so the competing males would have some privacy and be less likely spending their time fighting for turf from other males. The 2x4 up the middle blocks the view of tubes on the other side row.

In reality I suspect the FHM will use the rock piles more than the condo but I likely will never know for sure. I have spotted one male protecting a nest in one of the rock piles.

They are successfully spawning because I have noted lots of 1/4 to 1/2" FHM fry in small pools around the edge of the pond.


Edited by snrub (05/19/18 11:09 PM)
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#490335 - 05/19/18 08:54 PM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: snrub]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Good news on the SMB in this pond. I had concerns a flock of cormorants had wiped them and the RES out.

Fished for about a half hour trying to sample the RES and caught no RES. But I did catch two SMB both in very good condition. Those fish have some spunk! So much so that one fought its way out of my hand and flopped on the ground unfortunately. Then is when I decided best to leave them alone and quit fishing for them.

Both were about the same size, 9-10". One is pictured below.


Attachments
20180519_135113.jpg (85 downloads)
Description: SMB from my RES pond. Original stocked fish some were 4-6" and some 6-9.


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#490788 - 05/27/18 03:40 PM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: snrub]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Did a little more fishing in this pond to try and sample the RES to see their progress. Still no RES but I did catch another SMB, this one right at 10" and seemed fat and healthy other than quite a few of the parasites that look like black pepper flakes (forget the name). Can not see them too well in the picture but if you look at the pectoral fin they show up as black dots.

Appear to have good FHM recruitment. At least I think they are FHM. They could be gambusia fry as I did have some gams in this pond last year but I have not seen anything of the adults this year and have seen a number of the adult FHM, so hopefully they are FHM fry. When I put rock around this pond the bank was soft near the water edge and the loader tractor front tires sank in and made some places that held shallow water a number of places around the edge. In every one of these shallow water areas the fry pictured are there. One day I found the fry, the next day went back and found bird tracks (likely Killdeer) and no fry, now they are filled with fry again.

Maybe if I remember when I feed will try to get an aquarium dip net and net some of them. Put them in a glass jar and see if you all can identify them.


Attachments
20180526_163635.jpg (77 downloads)
Description: 10" SMB from RES dedicated pond

20180526_162432.jpg (66 downloads)
Description: What I presume to be FHM fry.


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#490792 - 05/27/18 09:35 PM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: snrub]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5580
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Hey John,

You know I'm not a pro but it looks like black spot disease to me which IIRC is part of a flat worm life cycle. As you haven't had the SMB that long and have RES for snail control, I suspect it came in with your SMB stockers. I had it on a small YP I caught a couple years ago in my pond. My PS must be doing the job on snail control because I haven't seen a fish with it since. As long as you have a healthy RES population, IMO it is nothing to worry about.

Bill D.
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#490913 - 05/30/18 12:25 AM Re: A pond dedicated to Redear Sunfish [Re: Bill D.]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Lots and lots of snails in this pond. I actually inoculated it with snails specifically to feed the RES. But so far I have not been able to catch a RES by hook and line. I'm a little concerned they survived the winter but not terribly concerned. I have taken a few RES from my forage pond and put them in this pond "just in case" I lost a lot over winter.

I need to try the cast net in this pond and see if I can pull some RES fingerlings out. Then I will know I've had a spawn. I guess seeing a lot of snails adds to my concern of having all the RES I originally stocked. There is lots of algae on the rocks and FA on the bottom though so ideal conditions for snail production.
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#491578 - 06/10/18 03:02 PM Fish ID [Re: snrub]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Tried the cast net in this pond today at high noon with almost no results. I get lots better results near sundown with the cast net.

But I did actually drag one very small fish ashore (it actually fell through the cast net mesh on the way out of the water) that I would very much like an ID on. If it is what I think it is, it will be a great surprise.

The fish stocked in this pond are RES. FHM and SMB with some gambusia that likely came from some plants I transplanted although I have not seen any of the gams this year. I hope the fish in the pictures is at least one of those stocked and my guess is a SMB. If that is the case I already have SMB recruitment which is a big surprise. I did not figure there would be any before next year. I have caught some SMB in this pond at 10" though.

I wish I had taken time to spread its dorsal and tail fins out for a better picture. If it is not a SMB it also is not a RES or FHM so I have something in there I don't want.


Attachments
20180610_112927.jpg (64 downloads)
Description: Is this a SMB fingerling?

20180610_112941.jpg (65 downloads)
Description: Same fish different picture


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#491579 - 06/10/18 03:36 PM Re: Fish ID [Re: snrub]
Shorty Offline
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Registered: 07/28/05
Posts: 4173
Loc: Raymond, NE
I think it might be a SMB, not for sure though.

Here is a fingerling SMB from my pond.





Attachments
DSC05939resize.jpg (568 downloads)

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#491580 - 06/10/18 04:36 PM Re: Fish ID [Re: Shorty]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
One thing I noticed right away was the black arc band on the inner part of the tail fin that is both on your and my fish. That stood out different than any of the fingerling fish I am used to seeing.

I need to start carrying a jar or clear plastic bag in my UTV so I could put the small fish in it to get a better picture.


Edited by snrub (06/10/18 04:38 PM)
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#491594 - 06/10/18 08:35 PM Re: Fish ID [Re: snrub]
Bill Cody Offline
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Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 12398
Loc: Northwest Ohio - Malinta OH
snrub your fingerling is SMB due to the pattern of the caudal (tail) fin. Your SMbass are successfully doing their "thing".
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#491606 - 06/11/18 12:11 AM Re: Fish ID [Re: Bill Cody]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Thanks Bill!

I had no idea they would reproduce that quickly.

I have no problem with them producing excess SMB numbers as I have at least a couple other ponds I can angle catch and move some SMB to add as bonus fish to the other ponds should they become too numerous in this pond.
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#492741 - 06/26/18 05:38 PM Re: Fish IDMore SB recruitment [Re: snrub]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Threw the cast net in this RES pond trying to see if I have any RES recruitment. As the pond has dropped a few inches from dry weather I am seeing some abandoned nest sites.

After a dozen throws nothing except the two fish pictured below. Water is too clear and the fish too fast and widely dispersed. No RES.

But near some water primrose in shallow water I did snag a couple more SMB recruits with the cast net. They have grown enough since the last one I caught they would actually stay in the net. Well the bigger one anyway. The smaller second one was half way through the mesh when I picked it up.

Nice to know I have SMB and recruitment. I would really like to raise enough SMB in this pond to be able to transfer quite a few to my main pond and grow them out as bonus fish there. With LMB in the main pond they will not thrive like I hope they will here in the RES pond but they could still be fun to catch and might do ok there.

I took these two and put in my forage pond which also has SMB stocked.

Bad looking clouds came my way in a hurry so I headed for the house. Hope we get some much needed rain.


Attachments
20180626_150813.jpg (49 downloads)
Description: largest of the SMB recruits.

20180626_151422.jpg (38 downloads)
Description: smaller of the SMB recruitment

20180626_151757.jpg (39 downloads)
Description: storm clouds coming in fast

20180626_151844.jpg (42 downloads)
Description: white caps on the pond




Edited by snrub (06/26/18 05:43 PM)
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#492750 - 06/26/18 07:08 PM Re: Fish IDMore SB recruitment [Re: snrub]
Mike Whatley Offline


Registered: 04/22/18
Posts: 242
Loc: Louisiana
Good looking baby bronzes.

Sure wish my pond got that kind of wave action occassionally. I can have 40mph wind and the water barely ripples.
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#493337 - 07/06/18 12:39 AM Re: Fish IDMore SB recruitment [Re: Mike Whatley]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4839
Loc: SE Kansas
Been having some fun observing this pond.

Tossed in a minnow trap in shallow water over night and had two to three dozen intermediate size FHM along with a couple of SMB fingerlings. Good to know I still have FHM.

Watched a school of nervous FHM mid day today when the sun was direct over head in clear water. They were acting a little spooky when I noticed a few slightly larger fish in around them then noticed they were SMB fingerlings. The SMB were maybe 4" and not big enough to eat the FHM I saw but they were sure making the minnows nervous. Don't know if they were just herding the minnows around, picking off small ones that I could not see, or if they were just schooling with other fish but it was an observation I had not seen before.

The fingerling SMB are kind of funny to watch. I have lots of them. They often run in small groups of a pair to a half dozen. I'll throw my jig out in shallow water and watch them chase it right up to within 6" of the bank. If I let it set on the bottom then jiggle it or move it slightly they act like a bunch of kittens stalking a ball on a string. If I drag it through the water sometimes they will strike at it but their mouth is not big enough to get around the hook I was using. With a tiny hook I know I could catch one after another. I did actually catch one slightly over 4" and landed it to look at.

No luck catching any RES fingerlings with the cast net but I really have not tried at the correct time of day. Right before sunset in shallow water is best but I have tried it mid day. Have also not been able to catch any RES by hook and line after a few different days trying.

But I know the RES are there. Now that the summer water has cleared I can see a half dozen male RES on really large nests. The fish only look like 5 or 6" RES and the nests look huge for the fish size. I suspect the large nests were made by bigger RES males early during the first spawn. I'm guessing these guys are just maturing and getting big/old enough to nest. Every year I have seen late spawn RES relatively small males in shallow water.

Been tossing out some Optimal #2 starter around the edge of this pond along with some regular size feed too. Today I specifically did the starter separate so I could see if I could get any of the numerous SMB fingerlings to take it. I was able to witness a half dozen strikes by the fingerlings getting the small pellets. They do not go after it like FHM will but at least they are getting the idea.

I would encourage anyone to get a little bit of starter pellets and toss it in 6" to foot deep water around their ponds just to see what comes up to eat it. You can crush large pellets, but the small nice round starter pellets float for ages and they are just bite size for small fingerling fish.

I tried the same thing around my old pond because this year for the first time I am seeing LMB fingerlings in good numbers around it. Still none in the main pond but at least I am getting recruitment in my old pond. But the slightly larger LMB fingerlings just ignored the starter pellets. But the fingerling BG woofed it up.

Just some fun observing what is going on around my ponds.
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#493346 - 07/06/18 07:51 AM Re: Fish IDMore SB recruitment [Re: snrub]
NEDOC Offline
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Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 732
Loc: SC Nebraska
Great report. Thanks.
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