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ive got a two acre pond in south georgia that was stocked with 1000 catfish and 1000 "georgia giants" hybrid bream. needless to say, the pond is worthless. all fish are completely stunted and ive only seen one "georgia giant" in the 8 years its been stocked. bass and crappie were added later on but nothing developed. ive finally talked the family into letting me start it over and i wish to have only bream, shiners, minnows and hopefully trophy bass(no catfish what so ever). the pond is 2.3 acres and averages about 4 feet deep with the temperature currently 65 degrees and the bottom is rather mucky. ive worked with rotenone before, but that was for random population sampling with the state. we also used liquid form. but powder is the only form available around here and they sell it in 5lb bags for about $5-6/lb. ive read just about every article available on the internet but all the dosing reccommendations vary from 1lb/acre foot to 10lbs/acre foot. so which is it? what dosage will definately kill all the catfish?
thanks
brandon

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What about draining the pond down some before using the rotenone ? Then it will take less and the fish will be concentrated. When we use powdered we mix it in buckets with water and start at the lake edge and pour from a moving boat working in smaller and smaller circles to the middle. It works on all types of fish in these lakes from bowfin to gar and carp and cats.
















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What size are the catfish?

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If your average depth is 4', I would consider draining and deepening unless it's spring fed. I can only imagine the fish stress during the Summer months.

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Brandon I am really sincere when I tell you that I hate you had a bad experience with the GG. IMHO there are a few factors that could have been involved. First and foremost was the high number of cats in comparison to bream. Second could have been the timing of true predator introduction to aid in offspring reduction. If the cats were not fed, then after a prolonged period of time they would have feasted heavily on the adult bream leaving the FX generations (who do not display the hybrid vigor of their parents) to take over in the pond. Without a true predator introduction in a timely fashion, any bream will overpopulate in a pond eventually producing a pheromone that stunts all growth. Again I am truly sorry for your experience, especially if you were misguided from the beginning.
As for the rotonone I agree with ewest completely. If you have the ability to drain the pond down you will spend less $ on the rotonone and will have a better kill rate. Generally I suggest 4 lbs to the acre to do the job. In my experience large cats are the last to "pop up", so increasing that amount would not hurt.
Good luck with your kill and restock.


Do fish actually kiss?


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bhb1034, please don't take offense to this, but how in the world did you come up with stocking rates of 1000 cc & 1000 gg in a 2 acre pond ?

I wish you luck in fixing what you see is broken, killing them off appears to be a wise choice. I hope you read and re-read the posts here, the "experts" can turn your pond into a BIG Bass pond. Reconsider introducing shiners into that mix...go fatheads in the beginning. If you have the $$$, threadfin shad. Finally, go F1 LMB when you restock.

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Deb :

I am interested in your comment above "...eventually producing a pheromone that stunts all growth." I assume you mean BG (lepomis) growth. I have read that wrt G.shad and crappie they inhibit all growth that way and seen speculation on the effect of BG stunting on the population of BG and the possible causes. One I recall indicated the ability of the female BG to sense crowding and as a result greatly cut back on spawning. I was wondering if you could elaborate on your point above and direct me to any studies or sources as I have wondered about it. I have seen studies that state BG release a chemical warning indicator when predators are near and a test on if they could inhibit LMB reproduction by chemical release which was negative on that point.

Aren't you glad you stayed -- I am ! Please no one think this is a put Deb on the spot question. It is not. I don't know the answer , think it could be true, and would be greatful if anyone has info on the subject.
















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Eric you are not putting me on the spot at all. This is something I have seen time and again in ponds that were not properly stocked with predators. I did some research on it a while back, but do not have the links. I too will research it again and re-post with something fact based and not based simply on my observations.

Yeh, chip off the shoulder I am glad I returned. \:\)


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Thanks. I will look some more and let you know what I find. I have seen and read about BG (lepomis) stunting especially in ponds with out adequate predator populations. It is a which came first the chicken or egg type question. What is the cause of stunting lack of food or to many fish (or fish of the wrong size) and what causes what results and reactions within the population.
















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thanks for the advice. i think im just going to buy a case(50lbs), which would give me around 5lbs/acre foot to be safe. i had nothing to do with the original stocking of this pond. i would have never put in that many catfish. it was stocked by Ken's Fish Hatchery in tifton, ga and have no clue why the reccommended 1000 catfish for such a small pond. to me that seems like stocking rates for someone who is growing them for commercial use. but anyway, i think gonna buy the rotenone today and try and put it in this weekend. so hopefully it will go well.

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well i got the rotenone today, but im still worried about the temperature being too cold to kill the catfish. the pond is 67 degrees today and i had planned on using it tommorrow. most sources say the water is supposed to be around 70 but i dont want to wait its above that because im afraid fish eggs might survive if theyre spawning. i know summer and fall is better but i really would like to get a new pond started now. any advice?

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I would agree with Eastland and think about drawing down the pond. If you are starting over now is the best time to consider digging it out and removing some of the muck. By digging it out the fish and the water quality should both be improved.

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bhb1034 - You can use the rotemnone when water temps are 67F with good results regarding temp. Complete kills can occur when water temps range from 45F-75F. Most favorable temp for treating is 61F. High turbidity of water to be treated requires higher concentrations of rotenone. Rotenone will tend to bind with clay turbidity or heavy algae blooms. It is best to treat on an overcast day. Sunlight speeds detoxification of rotenone. If it was me I would to a kill test in a tub or similar container by using your estimated concentration on one or two catfish before treating the whole pond to make sure the turbidity levels are not too high to produce a complete kill.


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bhb1034 - You can use the rotenone when water temps are 67F with good results regarding temperature. Complete kills can occur when water temps range from 45F-75F. Most favorable temp for treating is 61F (60F-68F).

NOTE - High turbidity of water to be treated will require higher concentrations of rotenone. Rotenone will tend to bind with clay turbidity or heavy algae blooms. It is best to treat on an overcast day. Sunlight speeds detoxification of rotenone.

If it was me I would do a kill test in a tub or similar container by using your estimated proper rotenone concentration with one or two catfish before treating the whole pond to make sure the turbidity levels are not too high to produce a complete kill.


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