Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Poachers again. Is pond really worth it?

Got a call from a neighbor at my pond -- I live about an hour away. She heard from another neighbor who saw a couple of kids (? age) fishing at my place around midnight, wanted to know if they were there with my permission. Of course, they were trespassers & poachers.

Given my foot issues in recent months, I'm wondering if it is worth it. Tired of pouring money, time, and energy into a place where I rarely go, then have poachers steal the fish. I've put up signs, I've asked neighbors to watch & call sheriff, I've gotten in touch with the county agent, but nothing seems to work.

Not looking for advice, really. Just discouraged.

One thing that often works in the hunting world is to give one of your neighbors who likes to fish excusive fishing rights under your rules. I am fortunate to have a very trustworthy neighbor who pulls 60 bluegill and 10 small largemouth out of my 1.3-acre pond each year. He also catches and releases SMB in another of my ponds and traps my place after deer season is over. If anything is awry, he makes sure that I know about it. If you trust one of your close neighbors, you could allow them to fish in return for calling the police if they see trespassers. Things should be simpler, but society is what it is...

I think most of us initially and for a long time after consider that we will never sell our land/ponds, especially for those of us who do not live at our ponds.

But eventually, when you don't go there as much, the time may come to sell .

You guys make me glad my ponds are walking distance from my back door.

Good idea about authorizing neighbor to fish & keep watch, RAH. I'm gonna try to do exactly that.

Things are looking up a bit, as the miscreants were spotted trying to trespass again. Neighbors saw them, called them out, got pics of them & the car that dropped them off. Unfortunately from a legal standpoint, they were stopped before getting on my land, but neighbors know who they are.

Maybe there is some hope, we'll see. I've been told they released fish, which is better than killing them, but then again who knows?

It all depends on how the fish were handled too. They could have released them just to have them die a few days later. I hope you get to the bottom of this, and soon.

You know, I think neighbors are an underappreciated part of the process of finding land & building a productive pond. Once we looked at a neighborhood that gave off sketchy vibes, and later discovered that two women had been murdered there in just the last five years. Before we knew that, I was getting desperate after years of searching, and even had thoughts about wearing a holster & revolver every day we were there. Surely that would be enough, right? My wife rightly nixed that idea fast!

The place we eventually purchased had some good neighbors, though admittedly we didn't meet everyone around. Obviously one of those neighbors we didn't meet turned out to be less than honest, but others were fine people. Perhaps it also helps that we've tried to be a good neighbor to them, as well, offering them access to harvested fish & wild blackberries.

Since we know who the bad guys are, but don't have pics of them breaking the law, I'm wondering what to do next. A letter? A sit down meet? Report to cops or maybe a game warden? I've already got my good neighbors helping to watch, so hopefully that's a first step.

I'm kind of split on this. I can be protective of my pond also. My first thought is liability. However, I'd rather see kids fishing then up to no good. If they we courteous, didn't do any damage and followed the rules they could be helpful. Get their names, parents phone numbers and they might even help you out in a jam someday. Rules include , fishing regulations, no fires, no trash left, pick up trash if they see it, no illegal anything and only they can fish not their friends. Just my thoughts.

Most of us who don’t live on our land can have these problems. I am almost off the grid, at the end of a dead end road, with a locked gate. Alan and Scott can tell you about it. Many years ago catching a poacher get me into a butt whipping contest with an armed man. I took his rifle along with his hunting license and turned both over to the Game Warden. Now way too old for that stupid stuff. Catching an armed man who is breaking the law is not on my list of priorities.

When we leave, we don’t lock the door to the house. Why have a window broken or a door torn up? I keep my 4 wheelers and tool chests in a locked shipping container with a shield over the lock. I remove my tractor keys.

The Game Warden, DEA and Sheriffs Department have used a high hill on my place to watch the roads for road hunters and drug deals. They know where I keep the keys to my gate. They always contact me in advance.I don’t live there but do value my privacy when I am. Since I haven’t heard from them recently, I can only assume that they haven’t been around.

I understand your dilemma. After building my biggest pond (about 18 acres), stocking it, everything else, I once found remnants of a seine along the shore. I was mad and frustrated. I thought about it some more and realized they wouldn't have caught much or done much damage as it has few good spots for seining (mostly too deep).

Since then, we've caught two people getting ready to fish. My brother spotted them pulling in lane to go to lake. He and a sister followed up and called me. I got there in time to take pictures, contacted game warden and states attorney, and etc. They each had to pay fines of about $200. Haven't seen them (or anyone unauthorized) back since. We do have some trail cameras up to help identify anyone that might. There are some pretty decent trail cameras now that can send photos via cell so you get real time notification and have solar chargers so you seldom have to visit. Might be worth checking out.

Also, as I get older, actually catching the fish and etc. is less important to me. It is more about myself / family / friends relaxing. I wouldn't be opposed to some others fishing it as long as they followed the rules and helped out in some way in exchange. Maybe those kids would help maintain it in exchange for access rights following your rules. At one point, I had a surplus of channel cats there that would have been easily caught and weighed around 15 pounds each. I didn't have much time to dress them and would have allowed someone else to catch them if they would have given some catfish fillets to one of my brothers (who was badly injured in a fire). Didn't really know of anyone I could really trust to do that and not also catch / remove the big bass / HSB / Bluegill. I think those big catfish have since died.

Thanks for all the great replies! This is a common issue, I guess, especially for those who don't live on their pond.

If the intruders were younger kids, I'd feel a lot more inclined to work out a deal. Problem is, they are 19 and 24 (neighbors know them well). If I can work a visit by the game warden, or the police, that would likely help, along with watchful neighbors and game cameras. My son & grandson plan to hunt deer there -- we have lots of them, drawn to the water-- so maybe would help install some quality game cameras. After all, there are deer poachers to watch for, as well.

My most eagle-eyed, watchful neighbor is a lady I've seen but never met. RAH made the great suggestion of allowing fishing to someone trustworthy who will watch the place while I'm gone. However, I'm told she loves to catch & eat catfish, which I don't have & don't want. Almost certainly that means she uses live worms which get deeply swallowed, which is something I don't want my larger BG, LMB, or even HSB to experience.

So now I'm thinking about the little forage pond, maybe 1/8 acre. It already has some CNBG in it, but I could easily stock CC as well. Set up a feeder, and maybe it would be perfect for her! She's quite honest, according to the folks who've known her for years, so would probably keep with my rules. Who knows, maybe she'd share a filet or two!

Dunno if this arrangement would work, but seems worth a try. I do have good liability insurance, by the way. Any thoughts on this?

Filling a small pond with catfish and installing a feeder, that lady could be catching prime eating catfish in a short time and probably be very appreciative of the opportunity, and well worth every penny invested to have somebody local with a vested interest in watching the place.

Also the newer game cameras are very effective in alerting you pretty much in real time, of course those work better if you have a general trail or access to your fishing hole, obviously if it is wide open it may be harder to cover all the access points. Good Luck!

Great idea on the small pond. Go for it. I'd use the cams that send the pictures. If you use a cam that has an SD card, once the cam or the card is stolen, then all the proof is gone.

And, fwiw, I use the Cuddelink game camera system, they can be set up to surveillance mode where they send pictures immediately, but one huge thing that they have available, (and other brands probably do too), is a strobe flash camera setup that will take a real live flash and color picture after dark, mounted up on a tree or something, high and out of reach, and flashing like a regular camera at night, will intimidate the crap out of somebody, for starters, they will know without any uncertainty that they are caught on a high tech game camera, and the longer they hang around looking for it the more times this thing will put out a blinding flash.
Trust me it is intimidating as hell to be sneaking along in pitch dark and have a blinding flash light up your world then pitch dark again, especially if you were trespassing. because you cant tell hardly without setting it off a number of times where its coming from.
I have seen it go off several time on deer walking in front of it when I am out at my deer stand early or late. might want to consider that option

I heard about a guy (hearsay) that had an alarm system. I’m told it was quite a noisemaker. In my case I have neighbors too close for that.

Again, thanks for the ideas. I do like the notion of the blinding flash at night, since that is when they usually sneak on the property. Best to send a good pic along, too. Wish I could wire it for a siren sound, too, but that might be overkill.

I talked with the sheriff's office & they agreed to send a patrol car around for the next couple of weeks. Neighbors know to call 911 when they see trespassers. Apparently the poachers told other young people they had permission to fish, so there was even a car full of eager anglers rolling toward my place. I need to put up more trespassing signs, and prosecute so others will stop this crap.

Yes. The cameras, posted signs, and prosecutions help. Google maps doesn't. That is how those people found mine (not visible from any road). Then they talked with a friend of theirs at the local conservation office who told them that I'm a nice guy and probably wouldn't care. They didn't bother to check. Cost the two of them about $400 plus time.

On another trespass situation from long ago. One of my brothers had a pond (that used to be a great pond at one time) about half a mile off the road at the edge of a woods. I was mowing by the road and saw a van pull off the road, about four or five guys jump out and head towards the pond, and then the van took off. I called my brothers, we jumped into the back of one their 4 wheel drive truck, and came in hot and fast from the other direction. Scared the dickens out of them. All but one took off running through the briars and barb wire fences. That one didn't have time so we had a conversation with him that it was private property and they had best never be caught there again. Heard later that the briars and barb wire fences had taken a toll. To my knowledge, they never came back. I wound up buying that property years later and drained the pond. Even though it was well off the road and hidden, it had gotten the reputation of being loaded with good size fish. I ultimately dug it out bigger, redid the dam (with a drain pipe in bottom), and have left it empty since. I suppose enough people have made the hike back to find an empty pond that people have stopped going there by now. I want to shape it a bit more and then use it to raise HSB to a bigger size to stock in main pond someday.

Couldn't agree more...I dread the day when the maps of my area get updated and my solar panels appear along with my dock.

game warden

this -

I had a pond and drove up to it one day and there was a guy fishing off of the bank and another in an innertube floating around fishing - I got out of my truck with my shotgun - asked them what the hell they were doing trespassing on my property. Told them to both take their wallets out and lay them on the ground and to get off of my property which they did quickly. Picked up the wallets that had all of their information (drivers license etc) - called the game warden who came and got the wallets and drove to their home - put a stop to that real quick

my 16 yo son is getting into deer hunting so we just picked up a pretty nice and pretty affordable cellular enabled game cam. We got the Stealth brand Fusion X pro. The nice thing is that they enable it to work with 2 cell netowrks (I think Verizon and ATT) but it doesn't have to be YOUR cell phone carrier. They just use those networks in their cell enabled cameras. The camera picks which network is strongest and uses that.

It is really helpful since the pictures how up very rapidly on your phone using their app. Pay for the year of service all at once and it is about $10/mo. You get unlimited picture downloads and video 'previews' Enough seen on the video to decide if you really need to see the whole video or not. Then if you download the video you get I believe 15 downloads per month.

This model also has a handy 'on demand' feature through your app so you can use it like a surveillance camera. As your heading into the woods you can trigger a picture to help see what might be there before you spook it off. It also means if you had this by your remote pond you could trigger a photo anytime you want from your phone. The on demand photos on the plan we chose are also unlimited.

I was a bit intimidated by all the game camera offerings and having to figure out how to set up a plan but it was very painless to set up and compared to our old game camera the resolution is amazing. They have a night mode where the unit tries to add day colors to a black and white night picture and again the result is pretty spot on.

So consider this as an option if you have Verizon/Att networks near your pond. We are running it on AA batteries but working on building a little battery box with lead acid batteries using up some old 12v scooter batteries and will try to add a solar panel as well to help trickle charge them.)

A little cheaper on Amazon I see:

https://www.amazon.com/Stealth-Cam-Fusion-Camera-Network/dp/B0BPTP4L83

Inexpensive Security Alarm

If you want a sound alarm that is motion activated, Harbor Freight makes a cheap, effective unit for $17.

I usually set one up in my driveway in town for the guys that wander up to try the garage doors and the parked cars.

It has two volume settings, and the HI setting is pretty loud and would certainly startle guys walking in the dark. However, it is much quieter than a car alarm, and would not bother the neighbors.

The small unit in the linked picture is the motion sensor. I put a piece of black electrical tape over the little red light that is below the sensor, so the bad guys cannot easily find the unit.

The large unit easily picks up the signal 50' away inside my brick house. (This portion is for indoor usage, you will have to create some type of housing to utilize it outdoors.) Both units are battery operated, so you do not need AC to place the system. The maximum range is well over 50', but I do not know the effective limit.

My system will trigger on a car going up the driveway, or a person walking within about 20-25' of the motion sensor. The alarm unit makes a loud "bing-bong" sound.

It will certainly give you a "false alarm" for a deer, and perhaps down to the size of a large raccoon on a cold night? I believe my unit has even triggered on a cat under ideal detection conditions.

Are people accessing your property only by going up the road? If so, you could put the motion detector past your neighbor's house and the alarm unit inside his house. He could then peek out his window and call the game warden. (I don't know if the geometry required for that approach would work in your situation?)

If it does work, it will be a pain in your neighbor's butt due to wildlife false alarms. Perhaps offer them a $500 reward if they call the warden and that results in a capture?

If you do buy a unit, be sure to experiment with it around your house in town. You will quickly get a feel for how it operates, and how that might be put to best use at your absentee pond.

Good luck!

P.S. My initial advice was to suggest installing a few Claymore land mines, but then I remembered that you are a far better man than I am, so I went to Plan B!

Oh exactly Sunil. As we age sometimes our perspective can change. I view our property as a good investment, that God willing we can still enjoy for a few nore years as the value increases. We've had our property now for 11.5 years. It's been a lot of fun, but at some point, the time will come to sell for a nice profit/retirement money and a bundle of great memories. Like Bob Lusk says...we are all really just stewards of our property/ponds until someone else (family or stranger) takes it over.

My wife and I are hoping to donate our place as a park if we are able to. We have already spent over 30 years developing the wildlife habitat, so we are hoping to share it more widely after we are gone. Of course, the future is always uncertain, so who knows what challenges it will bring?

I have managed deer leases, ponds, and owned some ranches (one of which Bob featured in the PB magazine years back when he visited our place)

For me it has always been about the journey of trying to improve the wildlife and property. I enjoy the process and the challenge -

I have a good friend who restores old trucks in his garage - he will work on one for 4-5 years and he always tells me he hates it when the job is complete - he loves the process as much as the end results

I bought my place a long time ago. Maybe 40+ years. I’m now 80 and pretty dependent on my son in law, grandson and his buddy for heavy physical stuff. Arthritis has hit me in the back so I have to be careful. But, I still write the checks and still mow my lawn. And, I still am the only one who knows enough about the land to make decisions and manage it. I don’t live there. All the family is in Fort Worth.

It’s worth many times what I paid for it and, it’s been paid off for a long time. Actually an insane amount due to huge migrations to Texas. Demand for rural property is out of sight. My phone never stops ringing But, I don’t need the money as much as I need a place to get away from EVERYTHING. I expect a lot of you guys understand this stuff. Right now, with temps running up to 110, I’m stuck in town and going nuts.

You know, Dave, every time I get a setback on the pond I think a bit about selling. But I doubt would get anything close to what was spent on the dam, roads, bridge, electric, waterlines, boats, dock, feeders, feed, artificial habitat, stocking, electro surveys, small home, etc as it's just been 8 years. And that doesn't count the blood, sweat & tears.

Latest deal with foot surgery makes me question again. While I have a few friends who like to fish, my family rarely uses it. Very disappointing, as that was what I hoped would happen, introducing my grandkids to fishing & the outdoors.

We have spent 3 decades decreasing the monetary value of our farmland by converting it to wildlife habitat:) No regrets.

I know what you mean about family. None of them go there. Grandsons best friend and his wife are there a lot. Price of the land has sky rocketed; about 20 times what I paid for it and I also think about selling. But, being fiscally conservative and debt free I can’t think of anything I really want to do with the money. It’s my get away from town place. But, with temps of 105 to 110, not much sense going there right now.

When it cools off, I need to replace the water heater and gas cook stove.

Oh nooo anthropic. I am dealing with a foot issue as well. Not fun. I had surgery scheduled for this past week and decided to postpone and see if I can do some treatments to avoid surgery. Good luck with your foot situation.

Good to avoid surgery if you can get by without it, Zep. Sometimes you can, sometimes you can't. I had stents put in my left leg, which definitely improved bad circulation. However, the process dislodged some arterial plaque, which ended up blocking blood to my big toe. But it could have been far worse if the clot had gone to my brain! As economists like to say, there are no solutions, only trade-offs.

Dave, I get offers every month, but they are farcical. One-third of what I paid for the raw land in 2015, no pond, no roads, no nothing! I guess they are hoping to get someone senile or desperate to take advantage of.

Actually, I’ve gotten a lot of cash offers. But, most have been insulting.
A couple of local realtors have made sure that I have their cards.

We were in a local cafe yesterday and a realtor inquired about my health in a joking manner.

Dave, I get offers every month, but they are farcical. One-third of what I paid for the raw land in 2015, no pond, no roads, no nothing! I guess they are hoping to get someone senile or desperate to take advantage of.[/quote]

I know the feeling, I get deadbeats trying to buy my land for about 1/8 of what I could sell it for, the weird part is, my 80 is sitting on a corner section and is partially in four different sections resulting in 4 different deeds, so they seldom put all four together, they offer me cash price for a 1/4 of it and they would even go as far as paying for all the closing costs. I told one I would buy all the land he can come up with for that price.

I just bought mine in 17 and I could way more then double my money on it today, even with the additional money Ive spent on it doing a lot of clearing and roads and a 14 acre lake. quadruple my investment if I was to parcel it out in chunks.

I hope you gave him a solid right hook to the jaw ... so that he would be able to personally ascertain your health!

When you can combine fun and profit and some tasty fish fillets, then that is a pretty good deal!

I know the feeling, I get deadbeats trying to buy my land for about 1/8 of what I could sell it for, the weird part is, my 80 is sitting on a corner section and is partially in four different sections resulting in 4 different deeds, so they seldom put all four together, they offer me cash price for a 1/4 of it and they would even go as far as paying for all the closing costs. I told one I would buy all the land he can come up with for that price.

I just bought mine in 17 and I could way more then double my money on it today, even with the additional money Ive spent on it doing a lot of clearing and roads and a 14 acre lake. quadruple my investment if I was to parcel it out in chunks.[/quote]

Best I can figure, their offer is about 1/8 of what I could get on the open market. Maybe we're dealing with the same deadbeats.

The bad news: Apparently the poachers weren't content with trespassing & stealing fish. One of my pontoon boats went missing from the dock, ending up in a far corner of the pond. I assumed it had come loose during a storm -- it's happened before -- but found out differently. It was anchored, and the battery was missing.

The good news: Friendly neighbors discovered boat, managed to take it back & secure it to the dock. Apparently the whole neighborhood is watching now, they really don't want me to sell to developers.

Rod, that realtor is a good guy. At one time I had an adjoining 60 acres. I was 4 wheelering on it after selling all of my cows and asked myself why I owned it. I called that realtor and asked what it was worth. He told me that it was like my other place; damn near useless; mostly oaks and rocks. But, there was a long list of people that didn’t think about cows and pastures. He called in a couple of days with a good, all cash, offer. More than I expected.

I later found that he had ignored some of the potential buyers. When I asked why, he said because they were assholes that he wouldn’t want to live next to. I agreed with him when I found out who they were. He also lowered his fee from 6 to 3 percent because it was so easy that he would have been embarrassed to charge the whole amount.

Texas real estate is going nuts.

Dave, we're getting crazy offers on 45 acres that have no access, but I've got a good neighbor that I promised first shot at the property. I know for sure I'd have a buffer if he bought it.

In todays world, with everybody on computers able to work remotely, from a long ways off, rural ground is skyrocketing, they no longer have to be in driving distance from their job, they can work as well from a house in the middle of nowhere as they can in town at the office, and then the covid enhanced a lot of working remotely, so they are taking full advantage of that.

FishinRod really whiffed on that one.

I interpreted your comment about his "health inquiry in a joking manner" in exactly the wrong way.

Well, I am sure it won't be the last thing I am wrong about!