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#514699 - 12/06/19 05:19 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
NEDOC Offline
Lunker

Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 968
Loc: SC Nebraska
Not positive, but I believe that is the only size they can ship. It may be a different story if you can drive to get them.
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#514703 - 12/06/19 07:49 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: jpsdad]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5584
Loc: SE Kansas
The number I order is still a big question mark.

I'm open for suggestions.

From my personal need, I really don't need all that many to stock my other ponds.

But on the other hand, I would like to try raising a fairly big number, just to see if I can do it. I could surely find someone to take a few off my hands. Also I have no idea of what mortality to expect.

I was thinking maybe getting 300 or so. Raise them till they are 6 inches or so and start transferring them out. As the remaining fish keep growing, keep taking some out to make room for the fewer number but larger size.

I would figure on feeding them and I have a single 9" aeration diffuser that I can put all the air I need to it.

Open to suggestions.
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#514711 - 12/07/19 07:02 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
TGW1 Offline


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2989
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
snrub, In the past 4 yrs I have ladder stocked 80 with most of them being 10" in size in my 3+ acre pond. I feel like I have around 40 to 50 today. It's difficult to know exact numbers. And when you go fishing you will most likely catch a couple each trip. They grow pretty fast and like George Glazner once said "if they would jump like an lmb then no one would stock lmb but just hsb". The numbers are based on what I see around the feeders and when I hand feed. At my pond the hsb will for the most part will hang out near the deeper water but they will also move into the 2 to 4' shallows to feed on the shad. Hope this helps you out on the numbers.
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#514744 - 12/08/19 09:03 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: TGW1]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5584
Loc: SE Kansas
Thanks.

I'll see where the price breaks are for quantity and how many they put in a shipping box and go from there.

Can't remember how many Nedoc started with but he raised a bunch in only a cage.
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#514750 - 12/09/19 12:30 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
Heppy Offline


Registered: 10/03/16
Posts: 145
Loc: South Central, Virginia
Does anyone know the difference between HSB (female white bass x male striped bass) and HSB (male white bass x female striped bass)? I知 guessing maximum size but have no factual information. The reason that I ask is either cross is available from different hatcheries with the HSB (male white bass x female striped bass) being more expensive.
Thanks,
Heppy

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#514751 - 12/09/19 12:40 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
Snipe Offline


Registered: 10/26/18
Posts: 810
Loc: NW Kansas
Heppy, I've questioned our hatchery on this in the past because certain specie crosses produce different percentage sex, etc..
I'm told in the case with striper and wb it's advantageous to use the higher egg count from striper. There should (scientifically) be no difference in genetic size regardless on Morone.
Palmeto, sunshine bass are 2 of the crosses.


Edited by Snipe (12/09/19 12:42 AM)
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#514756 - 12/09/19 07:49 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: snrub]
NEDOC Offline
Lunker

Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 968
Loc: SC Nebraska
I raised 1200 in a cage. It's fairly simple to do actually.
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#514759 - 12/09/19 08:57 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
TGW1 Offline


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2989
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
NEDOC, I seem to remember you raising the hsb in the cage but did not recall the numbers raised. So, did you add all of them to your pond? I think your pond is much larger than mine but still 1200 are a lot of hsb. How's that working out for you? I would think it would take a lot of forage for that many hsb.


Edited by TGW1 (12/09/19 08:57 AM)
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#514761 - 12/09/19 10:10 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: snrub]
RStringer Online   content


Registered: 06/06/18
Posts: 532
Loc: Parsons KS
Snrub if you get to many I would be happy to take some off your hands.
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#514764 - 12/09/19 10:56 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: Snipe]
Heppy Offline


Registered: 10/03/16
Posts: 145
Loc: South Central, Virginia
Originally Posted By: Snipe
Heppy, I've questioned our hatchery on this in the past because certain specie crosses produce different percentage sex, etc..
I'm told in the case with striper and wb it's advantageous to use the higher egg count from striper. There should (scientifically) be no difference in genetic size regardless on Morone.
Palmeto, sunshine bass are 2 of the crosses.

Thank you for that Snipe!
Heppy

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#514767 - 12/09/19 12:04 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
NEDOC Offline
Lunker

Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 968
Loc: SC Nebraska
I gave a few to friends, and then I ended up stocking 800 in a 15 acre lake. I haven't caught one yet out of my large pond. But I do believe I started seeing them appear at the feeder late last summer. My management goals are different than most in that I'm not after large HSB. They're in there in an attempt to reduce the number of carp I have.
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#514781 - 12/09/19 06:38 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: snrub]
jpsdad Offline


Registered: 05/20/18
Posts: 427
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: snrub
The number I order is still a big question mark.

I'm open for suggestions.

...

I was thinking maybe getting 300 or so. Raise them till they are 6 inches or so and start transferring them out. As the remaining fish keep growing, keep taking some out to make room for the fewer number but larger size.

I would figure on feeding them and I have a single 9" aeration diffuser that I can put all the air I need to it.

Open to suggestions.


John,

I think if it were me with your situation I would get the max they will ship in a single box. NEDOC mentioned that is 400.

Might sound odd, but I wouldn't worry about stocking too many. You will stock them in cool weather after the turnover and the weight per acre you add would probably be less than 15#/acre for 3 acre BOW even if all 400 were stocked. However, at that stocking rate you will need to begin thinning them the very next year. I've attached a spreadsheet that plans a harvest through 4 years. Under such a plan you would purchase fry and grow them out every 4 years. Feel free to play with spreadsheet with numbers more to your liking.

***BUMP***

John, the harvest weight per fish is assumed to be the average of the fall weight and the prior fall weight. The harvest plan allows for taking HSB throughout the year with the number harvested being a harvest goal for the year. This keeps the HSB from developing a very large biomass and allows for a progressive harvest over several months in each year.

The following summer after stocking is when you will need to really hit them hard with a harvest. The average weight per fish of this first year is estimated at around .67 lbs which is an 11" fish. So you might begin harvesting at a minimum length below the average weight ... say 9" which is .25 lbs. Once they achieve 9" the standing weight would be in the neighborhood of 50 lbs/acre. By harvesting them along you can keep the standing weight below 70 lbs/acre. Over 12 weeks the harvest of 240 fish is about 20 fish per week.

You would only need about 160 HSB if you wouldn't want to harvest sizes smaller than 13" but the way I figure it the small fish you harvest are worth at least a several times more than what you pay for the whole batch especially if they grow primarily on pond foods. They should also make a huge dent in the BG YOY to help with the trophy BG goals you have.


Attachments
SNRUB Scenario.xlsx (23 downloads)



Edited by jpsdad (12/10/19 07:49 PM)

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#514784 - 12/09/19 08:09 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
RStringer Online   content


Registered: 06/06/18
Posts: 532
Loc: Parsons KS
Snrub if you wait til spring when my pond fills bk up. I will pitch in on them. I wouldn't want more than maybe 30-50. I would come pick them up no problem.
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The people who say I can't do it can just sit the @^#% down and watch me. Friends call me Rusto I also subscribe to pond boss mag.

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#514790 - 12/10/19 06:38 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
TGW1 Offline


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2989
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
Originally Posted By: NEDOC
I gave a few to friends, and then I ended up stocking 800 in a 15 acre lake. I haven't caught one yet out of my large pond. But I do believe I started seeing them appear at the feeder late last summer. My management goals are different than most in that I'm not after large HSB. They're in there in an attempt to reduce the number of carp I have.


That's what I remembered about your plans of reducing the carp. I will say that my hsb will do a number on a 3 to 4" TFS. In fact, I saw them schooling and attacking something yesterday afternoon. Just busting the water surface. And I have seen one choke to death on a cnbg so I know the hsb will eat them also. I would expect some large hsb in the 3 to 6 lb range in the next few years if they are feeding on the carp. I have caught several of mine fishing or dragging a tube jig on bottom. So look out carp smile


Edited by TGW1 (12/10/19 06:38 AM)
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#514793 - 12/10/19 07:52 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
SetterGuy Offline


Registered: 10/30/13
Posts: 1565
Loc: NE Missouri
You guys have me fired up to try HSB again. I believe all of my first stocking didn稚 make it. So, I don稚 really know how they will impact my other fish. I知 getting over run with HBG, I知 hoping they will help control those. I知 also afraid my YP numbers have plummeted, my guess is due to the explosion of HBG. Will the HSB primarily work on the HBG, or will they clean out my few remaining YP first? I知 going to put in a lot of cedar branches along the banks for YP ribbons to be protected (hope that will help).
Is there another fish (walleye perhaps) I should try to find?
Thx
Jeff
_________________________
5 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (way too many), SMB, and HSB (rumored..)
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.

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#514799 - 12/10/19 10:27 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
NEDOC Offline
Lunker

Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 968
Loc: SC Nebraska
snrub, I would second what jpsdad has said above. I don't think there is any negative to overstocking them as long as you, or someone you know is willing to adjust your population in the near future.
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#514804 - 12/10/19 01:59 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
canyoncreek Offline


Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 2153
Loc: West Michigan
Setter Guy, go for it! stock another batch and see how they do.
I would be surprised that your YP aren't successful at self-sustaining unless your Golden Shiner population is eating the fry or the SMB are hammering the year old class?

Stocking more YP would be pricey as you would have to stock or transplant adults. Time for a grow out pond!!!

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#514805 - 12/10/19 02:36 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
Bill Cody Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent

Lunker

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 13096
Loc: Northwest Ohio - Malinta OH
I've seen YP do poorly in a small pond with a strong SMB population. HBG could also be eating the YP fry to 0.75". Then the SMB preying heavily on 1"-4" YP.


Edited by Bill Cody (12/10/19 02:38 PM)
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#514807 - 12/10/19 03:42 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
SetterGuy Offline


Registered: 10/30/13
Posts: 1565
Loc: NE Missouri
Ok, thx. Wish I could find a predator that would just go after HBG. Ha!
I think I know where I can find some. (Hopefully)
Thanks again.
_________________________
5 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (way too many), SMB, and HSB (rumored..)
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.

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#514808 - 12/10/19 04:14 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: SetterGuy]
Pat Williamson Offline


Registered: 08/08/14
Posts: 2884
Loc: Oakwood,Texas
Originally Posted By: SetterGuy
Ok, thx. Wish I could find a predator that would just go after HBG. Ha!
I think I know where I can find some. (Hopefully)
Thanks again.


I知 sure some members would gladly 斗oan ya some otters to crop them .....lol

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#514810 - 12/10/19 04:56 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
canyoncreek Offline


Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 2153
Loc: West Michigan
What I did was set up a 50' seine net in a semicircle around the feeding area. I added weights to the bottom to try to seal the bottom against uneven terrain. You can thread or attach chain, cable, or make your own redimix weights to keep the bottom better hugging the bottom. Then extend the ropes on each end to shore.

I kept one end open with about a 25 foot open water gap but kept the net tied to a fence post in the water at that point.

I hand fed (or your feeder can train them) and soon they found the way around the net to get in the shallows to get to the feed and after a week or two they had no problems using the single entry/exit portal to get to the food.

One day I used a boat to get out to the post where the end of the net was tied extension ropes on and brought them back to shore. Hand fed and when the feeding frenzy was going simply closed the gap by pulling the ropes in to shore to close that small gap. Then with help pulled the 50 foot semicircular net in and got a considerable harvest.

Of course a good harvest might be 100-HBG, maybe you have 2000 to harvest?

I did find some fish would flip over the top of the net so extra floats might help keep that top edge at the top of the water. My goldfish would get a blast of energy and would burrow in the mud and wriggle right under the bottom rope. I don't think the HBG would do either.

Find an unsuspecting friend who thinks HBG are a good idea in his/her pond and donate them or have a good fish fry!

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#514812 - 12/10/19 05:35 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
SetterGuy Offline


Registered: 10/30/13
Posts: 1565
Loc: NE Missouri
My grandkids lay on the dock with little hand nets and catch them. They are about the size of a drivers license. Then they throw them in the woods 鍍o feed the raccoons. We catch 100s with worms under bobbers. Most of those end up in the woods too. They are way too small to even attempt to clean. We used to catch YP. mad
I may end up with a LMB, HBG pond, may as well add CC and make it like most Missouri ponds. It was fun while it lasted. I should have never added the dang HBG.
_________________________
5 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (way too many), SMB, and HSB (rumored..)
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.

Top
#514821 - 12/10/19 09:04 PM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
canyoncreek Offline


Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 2153
Loc: West Michigan
I can see how frustrating that is. A lot of the blame goes to the old fashioned teaching and training to the past and present biology, fisheries, and DNR students that the best thing possible anyone could stock in your pond is LMB, BG (or HBG) and CC.

I would be in the same boat myself were it not for members on this forum as my MI DNR suggested that in northern ponds only these 3 fish would thrive. Although the DNR is well aware of RES in SW MI, and the flourishing pumpkinseed in more northern lower MI lakes, they were not suggested. YP was NOT on their list since YP will not 'do well' in a pond of 12' or less. Despite their experience doing their job, they did not seem to want to disclose the hassles of balancing catfish with the other fish. They also thought LMB/BG somehow balanced each other out well.

The mystery to me is that these are the same officers who sample all the local lakes and find the same story over and over, hundreds of skinny 11-12" LMB and thousands of tiny bluegill with gigantic eyes typical of hungry bluegill. Every lake, same story.

Why do they think this combo will be easier to manage in a homeowner's pond?

Have you ever seen a self-balancing LMB/BG lake anywhere where bluegill are naturally large and healthy and where LMB continue to maintain healthy weights up beyond 14 and 15"?

Maybe it is a unique problem in northern ponds where we have no other forage. We have no natural shad, no natural GSH or other shiners, no threadfins, it sounds like stocking some other forage species in all the public lakes would be the wiser way to go.

I'd love to see them introduce YP in all the public lakes in MI. Perhaps even try lake chubsuckers or better yet common or spotfin shiners!!


Edited by canyoncreek (12/10/19 09:05 PM)

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#514824 - 12/11/19 08:45 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: SetterGuy]
NEDOC Offline
Lunker

Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 968
Loc: SC Nebraska
Originally Posted By: SetterGuy
My grandkids lay on the dock with little hand nets and catch them. They are about the size of a drivers license. Then they throw them in the woods 鍍o feed the raccoons. We catch 100s with worms under bobbers. Most of those end up in the woods too. They are way too small to even attempt to clean. We used to catch YP. mad
I may end up with a LMB, HBG pond, may as well add CC and make it like most Missouri ponds. It was fun while it lasted. I should have never added the dang HBG.


I know what I壇 do.... I壇 stock HSB. Get them to an age where they値l feed train on pellets. And then train them to eat larger pellets when thrown in. Once they池e trained to do that I壇 catch HBG, cut them in half and throw them to your HSB. I知 crazy that way.
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#514826 - 12/11/19 10:59 AM Re: Chronicles of stocking Hybrid Striped Bass...... [Re: NEDOC]
SetterGuy Offline


Registered: 10/30/13
Posts: 1565
Loc: NE Missouri
Originally Posted By: NEDOC

I know what I壇 do.... I壇 stock HSB. Get them to an age where they値l feed train on pellets. And then train them to eat larger pellets when thrown in. Once they池e trained to do that I壇 catch HBG, cut them in half and throw them to your HSB. I知 crazy that way.


Wow! I never would have thought this. Excellent idea! Thank you! I知 an absentee pond owner, so daily stuff is not an option, but I値l do what I can do.
Thanks again,
Jeff
_________________________
5 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (way too many), SMB, and HSB (rumored..)
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.

Top
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