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#511666 - 09/17/19 08:41 AM Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba...
Tbar Offline


Registered: 01/10/15
Posts: 740
Loc: Texas
Is there a test for Naegleria Fowleri???

My grandkids were out at the farm a couple of weeks ago and now their mother is wanting to have our pond water tested before they go back in.

This has been in the news lately. This extremely rare and serious disease has a 99% fatality rate with only 4 survivors in the country.

https://www.livescience.com/amp/66083-wh...p8hBgHkWn0IFMdI

http://www.sealynews.com/stories/brazos-river-authority-cautions-swimmers-about-deadly-amoeba,81652

https://www.kxii.com/content/news/560223...XARsFv-GNO3-0rQ

https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/health...1d-268d1449477d

https://www.foxnews.com/health/texas-girl-brain-eating-amoeba-dies-family-says

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/teen-fourth-person-survive-brain-eating-amoeba-50/story?id=41589808

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#511670 - 09/17/19 10:13 AM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
Zep Offline
Hall of Fame 2014


Registered: 07/27/10
Posts: 3370
Loc: Dallas & Wills Point, Tx
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#511672 - 09/17/19 12:12 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
canyoncreek Online   content


Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 2115
Loc: West Michigan
With a disease that is almost 100% deadly don't you think there should be inspection of all public and private fresh water ponds or some kind of government ban on swimming in untested/untreated ponds once they are above a certain temperature?

We have a county park system near me in MI that is geographically huge and when fully developed will be one of the largest public parks in the country. It includes multiple old gravel pits, the largest which hosts public swimming in raw outdoor pond scum and all kinds of naturally growing algae and amoebas. Millions in donations have poured in to make this a national public land treasure. I can see where one case of this would likely shut down the water based portions of this venue.

How many triathlons in late summer have their swim portion in very nasty weedy and scum filled lakes? I wonder how we can reduce risks here? I can't imagine it is as simple as wearing a nose plug and the risk goes away. As you might recall, when you put eye drops in your eyes you can taste them as the overflow of tears goes into the nose and back of the throat. Lake water, with or without goggles, still is going to enter the nose via the tear duct drainage and the critters are pretty small to think a goggle or nose plug is going to keep them out.

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#511673 - 09/17/19 12:41 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: canyoncreek]
anthropic Offline


Registered: 05/03/14
Posts: 1938
Loc: East Texas, USA
My guess would be that Michigan rarely has a problem with this amoeba since the water doesn't get above 80F very long. More of a southern issue, usually.
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#511674 - 09/17/19 12:45 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
Zep Offline
Hall of Fame 2014


Registered: 07/27/10
Posts: 3370
Loc: Dallas & Wills Point, Tx
Lance and CanyonCreek...these terrible brain eating organisms obviously are extremely rare as far as killing people...but to be honest I've never liked swimming in water where I can't see my toes..the mud, the vegetation/moss, the organisms, the poop, whatever...so I have rarely swam in lakes/rivers and that's not going to change...I don't even like public hot tubs...I owned one but will never own another one....but as always it's certainly a 2EachHisOwn.
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#511675 - 09/17/19 01:07 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
BrianL Offline


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 844
Loc: Paris, TX
It is so rare, it is almost hard to account for. Odds are very very small at 2 people per year, compared to 3600 people that drown each year in the US.


Edited by BrianL (09/17/19 01:08 PM)
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#511676 - 09/17/19 01:16 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
canyoncreek Online   content


Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 2115
Loc: West Michigan
Zep, I hope you are right~! but I suspect most of our shallow inland lakes have water temps of 80 and above in the top 1 foot or so of water through late July and August.

I'm glad it is quite rare but always another scary thing to worry about...

Minnesota I guess had a case but MI none as reported by the CDC.

https://www.cdc.gov/parasites/naegleria/state-map.html

Local info and article:

https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2015/09/10_things_to_know_about_the_br.html



Edited by canyoncreek (09/17/19 01:20 PM)

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#511709 - 09/18/19 07:08 AM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
TGW1 Online   content


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2914
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
Anyone have an idea on what type of water it prefers? Other than waters temp? Does it like waters with a lot of vegetation, are fertile waters more likely to waters that are clearer? Water's Ph come into play? Aerated versis no aeration? Lance, you had to bring this up the day after we were in the pond working on the pier? smile


Edited by TGW1 (09/18/19 07:26 AM)
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Tracy

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#511711 - 09/18/19 09:32 AM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: TGW1]
Zep Offline
Hall of Fame 2014


Registered: 07/27/10
Posts: 3370
Loc: Dallas & Wills Point, Tx
Originally Posted By: TGW1
Lance, you had to bring this up the day after we were in the pond working on the pier? smile


Tracy I bet he brought it up because this sad story just happened here in Texas in the last week:

10 Year old Texas girl dies after contracting brain-eating amoeba
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#511721 - 09/18/19 01:20 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
Downrigger56304 Offline


Registered: 09/23/17
Posts: 28
Loc: Mn
Canyon creek,
I don’t know which case in MN you are talking about, but the lake my family camps at every memorial weekend “had a child infected with it”. It was reported on all the news channels. Mn Dept of health said it was a brain eating amoeba. The lake is around 8000 acres very popular lake with many beaches. After the news broke people stopped swimming, booking resorts and using the lake. The resort we go to almost had to shut down. Fast forward a few months, turns out it was not a brain eating amoeba, but meningitis I believe. There was hardly a mention in the news when the real cause was determined. All the public panic from our own dept of health was in-warranted. They never apologize and said they stand by there decision to warn the public of the threat. So imo you can worry about something that might happen to couple people a year or be like my family and enjoy swimming in the lake every year.

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#511725 - 09/18/19 03:11 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
lmoore Offline
Lunker

Registered: 05/04/09
Posts: 93
Loc: NE Iowa
If you look up some of the cases on this, some of them have had no exposure to swimming in a lake or river and are assumed to have been infected by tap water. I hope nobody plans to quit showering due to this, especially if I meet any of you in person one day!

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#511726 - 09/18/19 03:54 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
canyoncreek Online   content


Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 2115
Loc: West Michigan
yes, the public health officials have a hard task. They want to warn (probably for liability mostly) but then they have to make crazy recommendations!

Our state has had an outbreak of another very rare but very lethal disease called EEE (eastern equine encephalitis) It obviously hits horses but also hits other animals. It rarely causes problems in humans but when it does they almost always die. It rivals ebola in its lethal hit rate, and it also is mosquito borne.

Several counties south of us have had cases, deaths and ongoing warnings in the news. Today the health depts. in several counties warned everyone to 'avoid outdoor activities'

That is a pretty scary and open-ended warning. How does a responsible parent balance that warning with the true risk especially since mosquitos move and we don't know much the disease or why only a few people contract it?

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#511727 - 09/18/19 03:57 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
highflyer Online   happy


Registered: 07/09/11
Posts: 1918
Loc: East Texas
While tragic, these are one off cases. You are more likely to be hit by lightning or bitten by a shark. Live your life and hug your children.


Edited by highflyer (09/19/19 08:57 AM)
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The one thing is the one thing
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#511729 - 09/18/19 04:15 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
teehjaeh57 Offline
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 8228
Loc: Lincoln, NE
What he said above...and, I find swimming highly overrated, anyhow. I share Zep's aversion to public water sources [hot tubs, pools, showers, etc.], well, really public ANYTHING I try to avoid. It's not blossomed into a phobia [yet]...just a strong aversion [at this juncture].
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#511732 - 09/18/19 06:56 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: canyoncreek]
John Fitzgerald Offline


Registered: 10/27/15
Posts: 2240
Loc: S. end of Elkins, Arkansas
Originally Posted By: canyoncreek
With a disease that is almost 100% deadly don't you think there should be inspection of all public and private fresh water ponds or some kind of government ban on swimming in untested/untreated ponds once they are above a certain temperature?

We have a county park system near me in MI that is geographically huge and when fully developed will be one of the largest public parks in the country. It includes multiple old gravel pits, the largest which hosts public swimming in raw outdoor pond scum and all kinds of naturally growing algae and amoebas. Millions in donations have poured in to make this a national public land treasure. I can see where one case of this would likely shut down the water based portions of this venue.

How many triathlons in late summer have their swim portion in very nasty weedy and scum filled lakes? I wonder how we can reduce risks here? I can't imagine it is as simple as wearing a nose plug and the risk goes away. As you might recall, when you put eye drops in your eyes you can taste them as the overflow of tears goes into the nose and back of the throat. Lake water, with or without goggles, still is going to enter the nose via the tear duct drainage and the critters are pretty small to think a goggle or nose plug is going to keep them out.


What would you propose to do? Shut down all public swimming? People sometimes get these from using tap water in a "neti pot". Any recreation has risks. You could get cut on a grass blade and get a deadly infection. It's simply too bad we cannot mitigate all risks. Even so, I wouldn't advise swimming in obviously dirty or polluted water, especially if the water is warm.
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#511755 - 09/19/19 10:03 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
liquidsquid Online   content


Registered: 11/20/11
Posts: 1985
Loc: East Bloomfield, NY USA
From what I understand it is everywhere in our environment. It would be similar to testing for bacteria in your pond water. It is always there, and at some point it is going to catch you when you are down, or when conditions are favorable for infection.

Swallowing spit over extended periods of time will kill you too, at least according to George Carlin.

I for one will keep swimming in ponds over a swimming pool any day of the week. Chlorine up my nose causes me problems, and I wind up smelling phantom smoke for weeks after a swim.

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#511756 - 09/19/19 10:19 PM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: canyoncreek]
snrub Online   content


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5511
Loc: SE Kansas
Originally Posted By: canyoncreek
With a disease that is almost 100% deadly don't you think there should be inspection of all public and private fresh water ponds or some kind of government ban on swimming in untested/untreated ponds once they are above a certain temperature?

We have a county park system near me in MI that is geographically huge and when fully developed will be one of the largest public parks in the country. It includes multiple old gravel pits, the largest which hosts public swimming in raw outdoor pond scum and all kinds of naturally growing algae and amoebas. Millions in donations have poured in to make this a national public land treasure. I can see where one case of this would likely shut down the water based portions of this venue.

How many triathlons in late summer have their swim portion in very nasty weedy and scum filled lakes? I wonder how we can reduce risks here? I can't imagine it is as simple as wearing a nose plug and the risk goes away. As you might recall, when you put eye drops in your eyes you can taste them as the overflow of tears goes into the nose and back of the throat. Lake water, with or without goggles, still is going to enter the nose via the tear duct drainage and the critters are pretty small to think a goggle or nose plug is going to keep them out.


As sad as it is when it happens, the reality is that deaths caused by it are a drop in the bucket compared to auto accidents or some other common activity. Should we ban driving? Education and knowing the risks when swimming in hot water are probably the best we can do from a practical standpoint. Our world is a dangerous place to live, no getting around it. Sometimes bad stuff just happens.


Edited by snrub (09/19/19 10:20 PM)
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#511759 - 09/20/19 05:30 AM Re: Test For Naegleria Fowleri, Brain Eating Amoeba... [Re: Tbar]
Dave Davidson1 Offline
Moderator
Lunker

Registered: 01/04/06
Posts: 14105
Loc: Hurst & Bowie, Texas
Well said John
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