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Bill D. #443695 04/12/16 07:30 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Dang it Dan! I think you musta misunderstood. I said I thought it is cool you have some swamp land NOT that I wanted to build a swamp! grin

No problem though. Bob O is still in Florida so I'll just have FEDEX drop those critters in his pond. He loves that Florida "wild life!" grin


Drop a couple of those speedos off, so he feels like at home laugh wink

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Dang, another misunderstanding. I suppose this puts the kibosh on the Green Swamp Monster we had all ready for you? Dan, p/s, That thing is some sort of stinky!

Bill D. #443998 04/14/16 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Thanks for the info guys!

Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
.....you should be able to catch them if you are a decent angler. .....


Dang Bill! Nothing like piling on the pressure! grin Water is overflowing the shore and low visibility right now. Should be interesting trying to catch 3 or 4 fish out of the entire pond in those conditions. Good news is forecast is for less wind this week and warming temps. Maybe I can spot them to get an idea where they're hanging out.

The bait shop at the State Park near me has shiners. I'll swing by and pick some up and get busy chasing those LMB.


Update.... I talked to my bride and we have decided to leave the LMB. I went back and reviewed my first post on this thread and realized, to be true to the charter, the goal is diversity and never knowing what you will catch and harvest. Although more than 1 LMB was not originally considered, bucket stocked LMB happen to many folks and it is what it is. We may end up with a traditional LMB, SF, CC pond but that is ok as well. It will be interesting to watch the possible transition and, hopefully, others can learn from the experiment and our attempt to maintain the diversity.

Bill D.


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Bill D. #444001 04/14/16 08:37 PM
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Definitely your pond as with all ponds they will evolve. What most of don't realize is ponds are constantly changing minute by minute. We just are not able to see all of the changes most of them chemical and microscopic.


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Bill D. #444003 04/14/16 08:50 PM
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Dogged again!!


Do nature a favor, spay/neuter your pets and any weird friends or relatives.
Bill D. #444009 04/14/16 09:26 PM
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Bob-O, I apologize to you sir. As once again I misunderstood and misshipped that Burmese Python to Cecil instead of you. Hope he does not mind as it is a tad under 14' and of course still alive. Best Wishes, Dan

Last edited by Dan123; 04/14/16 09:30 PM.
Bill Cody #444238 04/16/16 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
Definitely your pond as with all ponds they will evolve. What most of don't realize is ponds are constantly changing minute by minute. We just are not able to see all of the changes most of them chemical and microscopic.


Update...My bride said she wanted fish for dinner so we hit the pond. Several gills and 2 LMB about 13 to 14 inches. The fish were in great shape, IMO, for just coming off winter. Nice and fat. One LMB was a female full of eggs so 1 spawn less to have to try and manage around. smile

The LMB were not targeted so I figure we were true to the charter and just harvested what came along.

Last edited by Bill D.; 04/16/16 08:41 PM.

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Bill D. #444284 04/17/16 08:41 AM
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Two of your maybe only 3 LMB on the first outing?. Great. What did you manage to catch them on? You think you only have one LMB remaining?


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Bill D. #444303 04/17/16 01:56 PM
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He's turning Pro, after watching Clunn on the St. Johns.!

Dan123 #444347 04/17/16 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted By: Dan123
He's turning Pro, after watching Clunn on the St. Johns.!


Yep! Taking the cork and cane pole on the road! grin

Last edited by Bill D.; 04/17/16 09:22 PM.

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Bill Cody #444349 04/17/16 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
Two of your maybe only 3 LMB on the first outing?. Great. What did you manage to catch them on? You think you only have one LMB remaining?


Caught one on a big FHM and the other on a 3+ inch GSH; both under a cork. I think there are at least two left that I've been able to see. Have to look close as there are SMB swimming around as well.


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Bill D. #445109 04/23/16 09:10 PM
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Interesting development. I was watching a King Fisher catch minnows at the pond. For background info...It comes every morning and evening. It always perches on the roof of the pump house to scope out the situation. It is about 75% successful hunting, as far as I can tell, as it returns to the roof to beat the minnow to submission before swallowing. It caught a fish way to big to swallow. I laughed and said "I don't think so!" I watched as it just dropped it and let it roll down the roof to the ground. I walked over and it was a 5 to 6 inch GSH that was flopping around and totally unharmed, as far as I could tell, so I tossed it back to the pond. I didn't know I had GSH that large.

I have no predators capable of eating a GSH that big in my pond and I know they will get a lot bigger. Maybe I should stop removing LMB when I catch them?

Last edited by Bill D.; 04/24/16 06:44 AM.

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Water temp was at 60 last evening so I threw a couple of handfuls of pellets to see if I had any takers. Only a couple CC showed up. Tried it again tonight and the CC were hitting pellets like crazy and a few BG (not pellet trained) showed up; even the little newbie CC I stocked last fall were there (I think CC are born pellet trained! smile ). Looks like it's time to crank it up on the feeding for me. Hard to beat the taste of a CC fillet that was raised on grain based pellets!

Edit: There is no doubt in my mind that CC are the "smartest" fish in the pond. Did the ones last night communicate with the others in someway that made all show up tonight?

Last edited by Bill D.; 05/07/16 10:08 PM. Reason: After thought

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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Water temp was at 60 last evening so I threw a couple of handfuls of pellets to see if I had any takers. Only a couple CC showed up. Tried it again tonight and the CC were hitting pellets like crazy and a few BG (not pellet trained) showed up; even the little newbie CC I stocked last fall were there (I think CC are born pellet trained! smile ). Looks like it's time to crank it up on the feeding for me. Hard to beat the taste of a CC fillet that was raised on grain based pellets!

Edit: There is no doubt in my mind that CC are the "smartest" fish in the pond. Did the ones last night communicate with the others in someway that made all show up tonight?

Funny thing Bill my cc and BC don't come to the top when the feeder goes off and there is 250 of them in there. Only CNBG and LMB , the bass learned it on their own

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Originally Posted By: Pat Williamson
Funny thing Bill my cc and BC don't come to the top when the feeder goes off and there is 250 of them in there. Only CNBG and LMB , the bass learned it on their own


That's strange Pat. Have you ever seen or caught one since you stocked them?


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When I was feeding pellets tonight I had a pleasant surprise or two. A school of BNM showed up so at least I know the ones I stocked several weeks ago are still hanging in there. A bigger surprise though was a school of 4 to 5 inch YP showed up and were hammering pellets like pros! I now have confirmation that I did have at least a small YP spawn in 2015! smile Is it unusual that an entire school of YP eat pellets with no effort to actually train them?

Last edited by Bill D.; 05/08/16 06:19 PM.

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I had a friend, his wife and his 5 yr. old son over this evening to fish. They caught some LMB, and some YP that he thought were bass. laugh

When the feeder went off, the YP, LMB, SMB, HSB BG and maybe a CC or two were up at the Optimal.


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3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).
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Originally Posted By: Pat Williamson
Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Water temp was at 60 last evening so I threw a couple of handfuls of pellets to see if I had any takers. Only a couple CC showed up. Tried it again tonight and the CC were hitting pellets like crazy and a few BG (not pellet trained) showed up; even the little newbie CC I stocked last fall were there (I think CC are born pellet trained! smile ). Looks like it's time to crank it up on the feeding for me. Hard to beat the taste of a CC fillet that was raised on grain based pellets!

Edit: There is no doubt in my mind that CC are the "smartest" fish in the pond. Did the ones last night communicate with the others in someway that made all show up tonight?

Funny thing Bill my cc and BC don't come to the top when the feeder goes off and there is 250 of them in there. Only CNBG and LMB , the bass learned it on their own


The first year for my CC I never saw any hit the surface. When feeding some sinking pellets if I held very still and waited I could catch a glimpse of one once in a while near shore on the bottom. Year two by the end of the year I was seeing a lot of them hitting pellets on the surface but some swimming frantically along the bottom wondering where the food was. Now this third year I see a lot of 2-3# eating off the surface. I've harvested about a third of the population (originally stocked 100 per acre).

Although I don't have any right now, I like to mix in about 10% of a sinking catfish pellet, just to help get some of the fish feeding that are not prone to come to the surface, hoping if they get some feed off the bottom they will learn to eat on the surface. By using only 10% I still get the feedback of the floating feed to know the fish are actively feeding. The CC will stir the bottom up some though with sinking food, if that is a problem. I kind of like them doing that, but my sediment settles back out quickly so it does not cause turbidity.

Last edited by snrub; 05/08/16 10:03 PM.

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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Originally Posted By: Pat Williamson
Funny thing Bill my cc and BC don't come to the top when the feeder goes off and there is 250 of them in there. Only CNBG and LMB , the bass learned it on their own


That's strange Pat. Have you ever seen or caught one since you stocked them?


I do catch some on the jigs intended for the BCP . The CC was full of eggs and about 15-16" . They about to just be of eating size

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Originally Posted By: snrub
Originally Posted By: Pat Williamson
Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Water temp was at 60 last evening so I threw a couple of handfuls of pellets to see if I had any takers. Only a couple CC showed up. Tried it again tonight and the CC were hitting pellets like crazy and a few BG (not pellet trained) showed up; even the little newbie CC I stocked last fall were there (I think CC are born pellet trained! smile ). Looks like it's time to crank it up on the feeding for me. Hard to beat the taste of a CC fillet that was raised on grain based pellets!

Edit: There is no doubt in my mind that CC are the "smartest" fish in the pond. Did the ones last night communicate with the others in someway that made all show up tonight?

Funny thing Bill my cc and BC don't come to the top when the feeder goes off and there is 250 of them in there. Only CNBG and LMB , the bass learned it on their own


The first year for my CC I never saw any hit the surface. When feeding some sinking pellets if I held very still and waited I could catch a glimpse of one once in a while near shore on the bottom. Year two by the end of the year I was seeing a lot of them hitting pellets on the surface but some swimming frantically along the bottom wondering where the food was. Now this third year I see a lot of 2-3# eating off the surface. I've harvested about a third of the population (originally stocked 100 per acre).

Although I don't have any right now, I like to mix in about 10% of a sinking catfish pellet, just to help get some of the fish feeding that are not prone to come to the surface, hoping if they get some feed off the bottom they will learn to eat on the surface. By using only 10% I still get the feedback of the floating feed to know the fish are actively feeding. The CC will stir the bottom up some though with sinking food, if that is a problem. I kind of like them doing that, but my sediment settles back out quickly so it does not cause turbidity.
they may be scrounging around on the bottom, but who knows....

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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Originally Posted By: stickem'
Bill D,
You sound like you are forage rich...what all preds do you have in your BOW right now? I know you've mentioned CC in the past...but I don't recall what all you have stocked. Do you plan on stocking any more preds in addition to the ones you already have?
Charlie


Thanks for the interest Charlie!

Primary predators in our pond are SMB, WE, YP and a couple 3 or 4 LMB (I will remove them if I catch them). I don’t really count the CC as significant predators as they get pellet fed and removed at 3 pounds or less. And, of course, as this is Mutt Pond, there are 1 of a few other fish in there as novelty catches but no major predators.

Forage before today was mostly BG, PS, FHM, and surprisingly GSH. Hopefully, I can add SFS and BNM to the list. I will also be stocking Papershell Crawfish (PSC) in June now that the broken concrete and rip rap are in place. If I’m successful at getting more vegetation going, I hope to add local scuds and grass shrimp in the future.

My pond is very fertile so I’m trying to take advantage of that by building as strong and as diverse a forage base as I can. I try to research each species I’m going to stock and put habitat in place to try to assure their best chance of thriving before I stock them. I have not seen any threads taking the approach of trying to maximize the diversity of forage species (probably missed it) so I’m guessing it’s not a great strategy but it’s the one I’m going with. In my defense, Mutt Pond is all about diversity and never knowing what's going to be on the end of that line. If nothing else, I can report back so others can learn from the effort.



I got the rest of my SFS order today. Very nice fish. The pond level is pretty high still so I stocked them gently(let them swim out of the bag on their own) into a shallow area with a lot of submerged grass to give them a chance to acclimate a little before having to deal with the predators. Seemed to work fairly well as they hung out in that same area for an hour or so before moving off.

Besides BNM and SFS, I can also get several other species from the same source including Johnny Darters, Blackstripe Topminnow, Central Mudminnow, Emerald Shiner, Redfin Shiner, Scarlet Shiner and a bunch of others. Anybody know how any of these will do in a pond?

Last edited by Bill D.; 05/12/16 06:46 PM.

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Your ability to achieve diversity in fauna will be enhanced by diversity in flora, and both will be enhanced by an otherwise diverse environment. Each species will seek out its own niche. The surest way of learning how they will do is to try them. I like your sense of adventure. Do you know anyone I can get grass shrimp (P. kadiakensis) from?

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Originally Posted By: Turtlemtn
.... Do you know anyone I can get grass shrimp (P. kadiakensis) from?


I recently mentioned grass shrimp to the guy that supplied my SFS and BNM. Sounded like he might be able to supply grass shrimp as well. I'll check with him and report back.


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It was an interesting day today. I was out planting Redbuds and Magnolias for Nattha (my bride). smile

Driving by the pond on the tractor I saw a snapper about 8 to 10 inches heading for deep water. I saw it once last year so I guess it survived. I love turtle meat so, if I catch it, I will be learning how to clean one.

The BG have been on the nest for a three or four days now. Interesting that I saw a female ready to burst eating pellets tonight. Guess that is what is meant by rolling spawn...Pond is in full bloom. Visibility has dropped to 20 inches or so. Perfect timing for the BG spawn.

Spotted a water arum in about 2 feet of water so I have at least one that made it from the ones I planted last year!

The plant I think is American Pondweed at this point, survived the winter and has leaves on the surface. I need to post a pic or two to get a positive ID. Interesting to me is that both this plant and my lilies come to the surface red color instead of green and then turn green. Is that normal?

Only had green Northern frogs until now. Tonight we have a bullfrog singing. I hope they thrive. We love frog legs! grin

Last year's YP spawn and the CC are the two big feeders when I toss pellets in the evening. I guess YP and CC can pellet train themselves if conditions are right.

Planted some pond plants this week as well:

Sagittaria latforia - saladupopl, Duck Potato

Elocharis plaustris - elplcrspba, Creeping Spike-Rush

Nuphar advena - Yellow nuadyepoliba Pond Lily

Iris pseudacorus - Yellow irpsyewairpl Water Iris

Scirpus acutus - Hardstem Bulrush


I love watching the evolution of the pond! Best investment I have ever made!



Last edited by Bill D.; 05/24/16 07:43 PM.

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Second best. At least when said in front of Nattha. grin

Last edited by snrub; 05/22/16 09:49 PM.

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