Pond Boss Magazine
http://www.pondboss.com/images/userfiles/image/20130301193901_6_150by50orangewhyshouldsubscribejpeg.jpg
Advertisment
Newest Members
emactxag, thoki, VitalinA23, Farmpond5343, Audrey
15685 Registered Users
Forum Stats
15685 Members
36 Forums
36099 Topics
491330 Posts

Max Online: 1210 @ 08/23/18 11:01 PM
Top Posters
esshup 24029
Cecil Baird1 20043
ewest 19590
Dave Davidson1 13600
Bill Cody 12520
Who's Online
5 registered (Zep, Flame, Pat Williamson, Smoke68, roundy), 172 Guests and 454 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Topic Options
#487400 - 03/19/18 02:39 PM How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer.
azteca Offline


Registered: 07/08/16
Posts: 144
Loc: QUEBEC
Hello.

How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer (June until October) from larvae, with all the food they need.

I made a test with Yellow perch after a summer, in October they were 5 and a half inches and 3 at 6 inches.

A+

Top
#487414 - 03/19/18 04:30 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
ewest Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014

Lunker

Registered: 03/08/05
Posts: 19590
Loc: Miss.
Depends on location (avg water temps) and food sources/content, numbers and predation.
_________________________















Top
#487417 - 03/19/18 04:56 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
Jim Wetzel Offline


Registered: 08/16/17
Posts: 367
Loc: Holts Summit, MO
8". LMB can do better in same time frame. This is with cannibals. Extreme growth rate I have seen like that resulted in fish that appeared to have undersized eyes so appear opposite of stunted.
_________________________
Aquaculture
Cooperative Research / Extension
Lincoln University of Missouri

Top
#487420 - 03/19/18 05:53 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
teehjaeh57 Offline
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 7892
Loc: Lincoln, NE
My record SMB at age 5 mos was 9" from my growout pond where SMB are collected at fry stage and stocked. Typically largest SMB are around 7" at age 5 mos - but range anywhere from 3" - 7". No clue how much larger the record fish would have gotten provided a few more months growth, definitely pushing 10" though.
_________________________
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau





Top
#487425 - 03/19/18 07:05 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
azteca Offline


Registered: 07/08/16
Posts: 144
Loc: QUEBEC
Hello.

Wow, if your 5 mos means 5 months it is big.

I don't know if you saw my installation for the larvae, in the month of August I give them lots of minnow, so at the end of summer when I put these perch in the pond , I am sure that many will survive to predation.

A+

Top
#487432 - 03/19/18 08:59 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
ewest Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014

Lunker

Registered: 03/08/05
Posts: 19590
Loc: Miss.
Average with plenty of food would be 5-6 inches.
_________________________















Top
#487436 - 03/19/18 09:45 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
Bill Cody Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent

Lunker

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 12520
Loc: Northwest Ohio - Malinta OH
Azteca - your SMB growth of 5.5"-6" is IMO good growth for them in Quebec. I have seen young ones at a fish farm in September at 3" in Ohio, so 5" is very good.


Edited by Bill Cody (03/19/18 09:46 PM)
_________________________
Keep This Forum Viable, Read Pond Boss Magazine -
America's Journal of Pond Management

Top
#487444 - 03/19/18 11:06 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: Bill Cody]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
So when I stocked my SMB December 6, 2017 there were two sizes. I got 60 in the 6-9" range and 40 in the 4-6" range (10 of the larger ones went into my forage pond, the rest in my RES pond).

What size could I expect these to be by say September?

The reason I ask is, I want to move some out of my one acre RES pond to reduce the population from 90 to about 50-60. I need them to be big enough to escape my largest LMB in my main pond where I will move the 30-40 SMB to. They will become a "bonus" predator fish in my main pond where I do not expect them to have recruitment.

I'm thinking they should be around 12" or more to escape LMB predation. Does that sound correct? Will they make it to that size by this fall so I can catch some and transfer them?

If 12" is the right size to escape predation, then they need to grow from about 6" to 12" in just under a year. Will they make it?
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487447 - 03/19/18 11:58 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
Rainman Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 06/06/07
Posts: 6976
Loc: St Louis, MO area
snrub, there may be some in the 12 inch range. I think most will be around 10 inches and some at 11, but a lot bulkier. At around 8-9 inches the length growth seems to slow because there is so much weight added into girth.
_________________________
Rainman

www.TilapiaStockers.com


Top
#487448 - 03/20/18 01:17 AM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: Rainman]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
What would you say would be a safe size to transfer to my main pond? It is in its fifth year. Not sure what the largest LMB is but maybe around 6#????

Would 10" SMB be big enough to escape that size LMB predation? That is my main concern, getting them big enough so they do not become LMB snacks.

One other variable to the equation. Where I got them from they were being fed commercial fish feed along with natural forage. I was told they would easily pick up feeding again this spring. I intend to do just that. If I can get at least a significant portion of the SMB on feed, I am no longer concerned about 90 fish in the one acre pond over eating their forage fish base. If I can get them on supplemental feed, I can leave them in an additional year if I need to to get them to a size my LMB in the main pond will not eat them.

Just trying to get a feel for the possibilities and options available to me.
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487458 - 03/20/18 11:21 AM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
Bill Cody Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent

Lunker

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 12520
Loc: Northwest Ohio - Malinta OH
I would not be in a hurry to transfer all of them this year. IMO transfer those that are at least 10.5" or 11" as you collect them. They will grow relatively fast to 12" when eating pellets. You could see those that were 6"-9" get to 11-12" by this fall 2018. Keep in updated about your progress!


Edited by Bill Cody (03/20/18 11:22 AM)
_________________________
Keep This Forum Viable, Read Pond Boss Magazine -
America's Journal of Pond Management

Top
#487468 - 03/20/18 03:13 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
teehjaeh57 Offline
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 7892
Loc: Lincoln, NE
John - where did you source your feed trained SMB? Hartleys?
_________________________
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau





Top
#487485 - 03/20/18 05:21 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: teehjaeh57]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
Yes, Hartleys. Jerry Hartley and a younger man drove a pickup down with a live tank and delivered them.

They brought me the 60 6-9" and 40 4-6" SMB for my RES and forage ponds as well as 100 4-6" LMB for my sediment pond.

The LMB in the sediment pond I will grow to about 12" and catch and transfer to the main pond. I've had trouble getting adequate LMB recruitment in that pond.
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487486 - 03/20/18 05:24 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: Bill Cody]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
I would not be in a hurry to transfer all of them this year. IMO transfer those that are at least 10.5" or 11" as you collect them. They will grow relatively fast to 12" when eating pellets. You could see those that were 6"-9" get to 11-12" by this fall 2018. Keep in updated about your progress!


Thanks for that info Bill. Hopefully the SMB take to feed. If they do I may not even worry much about transferring. I could probably sustain the 90 in that pond with supplemental feed. I just figured it would be too many SMB for that size BOW if they were totally dependent only on FHM and RES for forage.
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487495 - 03/20/18 09:16 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
Bill Cody Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent

Lunker

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 12520
Loc: Northwest Ohio - Malinta OH
If those larger SMB had been eating pellets at the Farm then they will very likely return to eating pellets especially if forage numbers are below common numbers.
_________________________
Keep This Forum Viable, Read Pond Boss Magazine -
America's Journal of Pond Management

Top
#487569 - 03/21/18 10:32 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: Bill Cody]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
They should have plenty of FHM in the beginning. Just not sure how fast those will get extirpated and the RES producing enough forage to take their place.

Whole new ballgame for me. grin
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487574 - 03/22/18 02:34 AM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
teehjaeh57 Offline
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 7892
Loc: Lincoln, NE
John spoke with Hartley's today - thanks for the tip. They claimed they did NOT feed train their SMB, which was not what I was hoping to hear. I spoke with Jeff...any insight? Did you deal/speak with someone else? I would love a feed trained SMB source...I lack the time to feed train my babies living offsite.
_________________________
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau





Top
#487594 - 03/22/18 12:49 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: teehjaeh57]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
TJ, I had a very short conversation with Jerry Hartly when he (and I think it was Jeff that was with him but unsure of that) delivered the fish. I mentioned what I was doing with the pond (RES and now SMB) and that I was over stocking it and intended to take out some of the SMB as they reached 12" to transfer to my main pond. I told him of my concern that the FHM might not be enough to sustain them to that size and also mentioned that I did feed and had been feeding the FHM to that point.

This is what he said to me best I can remember. He said the fish he delivered were all the same age and came from the same batch of breeder fish (60 6-9" and 40 4-6"). He said the difference in size was that one batch of fish was in an environment where they had lots more natural forage so they grew quicker. He said that both ponds were fed and that the SMB would take easily to feed. He suggested I order a ton of feed from his feed supplier which was a sinking feed and feed it (which I did not do). He said if I would throw a pile of it out in a foot of water that in a few minutes it would be black with SMB feeding on the pile of feed.

That is what I remember of the conversation. Take it for what it is worth. From what I gather from my conversation and what you said Jeff told you I would guess they feed the forage in the ponds where they raise the fingerlings. So not specifically feed trained, from what Jerry Hartly said to me they must naturally take to the feed that is being fed to the pond (to the forage fish I would assume). This is speculation on my part. You would have to confirm that. It sounds like they specifically do not feed train the SMB, but at least in the case of the fish I got the pond was being fed and Jerry Hartly was satisfied the fish had been eating feed.

That is all I know and a little bit more. grin


Edited by snrub (03/22/18 12:55 PM)
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487598 - 03/22/18 02:22 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
azteca Offline


Registered: 07/08/16
Posts: 144
Loc: QUEBEC
Hello.

So is it more difficult to feed training the bass larvae then the Yellow perch.

Some member said Yellow perch usually are not surface feeders, mine are surface feeder, so is it more difficult to make the Smallmouth bass surface feeder.

A+

Top
#487599 - 03/22/18 02:37 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
beastman Offline


Registered: 12/05/11
Posts: 223
Loc: Cincinnati, OH
My YP hit the surface at times pretty hard... I was surprised by this. Feeding Optimal. I have had them beach themselves close to the shore as well by going after pellets.

Stocked in the Fall some of Yolk's SMB, hope to get them on the feed as well.

On warm days I am starting to see some HBG and YP feed.
_________________________
I Subscribe!
3/4 Acre Pond: HSB,SMB,YP,HBG,RES

Top
#487617 - 03/22/18 09:45 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
Bill Cody Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent

Lunker

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 12520
Loc: Northwest Ohio - Malinta OH
SMB train to pellets easier than yellow perch and largemouth bass. IMO almost as easy to pellet train as BG.
_________________________
Keep This Forum Viable, Read Pond Boss Magazine -
America's Journal of Pond Management

Top
#487618 - 03/22/18 10:11 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: Bill Cody]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
That is good to know Bill.
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487638 - 03/23/18 01:19 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
teehjaeh57 Offline
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 7892
Loc: Lincoln, NE
Thanks for the feedback John - trying to piece that bit together on my side...hard to believe schools of feeding SMB would behave that way on a pile of sunken feed. Per Cody on feed training - that's good news they will train easily. I simply don't have the time to pellet train my YOY living offsite, but hope at least some of them take to pellets eventually once stocked into bigger waters.
_________________________
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau





Top
#487671 - 03/24/18 11:45 AM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: teehjaeh57]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 5261
Loc: SE Kansas
I don't know TJ, are you sure you want to be feeding those SMB? They can turn into monsters like these! grin

Our visit to TJ's place with pictures of the HSB and SMB wife and I caught

Took me a while to find that old post. Maybe some day you can stop by my place and I will have some similar SMB you can catch. wink Thanks for that experience!

Edit: Would you believe that Bob Lusk worked for Hartleys very, very, very early in his career? Like about a thousand years ago? Bob is the one recommended I call them about some SMB.

Proud papa of those fish standing off to the right in that first picture.


Edited by snrub (03/24/18 11:55 AM)
_________________________
John

I subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

Top
#487674 - 03/24/18 12:15 PM Re: How big a Smallmouth bass can be after 1 summer. [Re: azteca]
azteca Offline


Registered: 07/08/16
Posts: 144
Loc: QUEBEC
Hello.

Wow, I will have to read your posts.
Thank you for the pictures.

A+



Edited by azteca (03/24/18 12:24 PM)

Top

Today's Birthdays
eags30
Recent Posts
Pole saw
by 2Old2Soon
Today at 12:29 PM
Hall of Fame 2018
by Pond Boss
Today at 10:50 AM
Flocculant effective clearing
by DannyMac
Today at 10:14 AM
My pond full of outcast
by bigpullerman
Today at 08:06 AM
Fish delivery
by Mfitzs70
Today at 06:40 AM
What did you do at your pond today?
by Dave Davidson1
Today at 05:36 AM
Dr Luke’s Birthday
by wbuffetjr
Yesterday at 06:47 PM
How Many Aerators do we Need?
by wbuffetjr
Yesterday at 06:46 PM
changing my aeration set up
by Funky
Yesterday at 07:50 AM
Daughters Hsb pond/ Your thoughts?
by TGW1
Yesterday at 07:13 AM
Newly Uploaded Images
My recent haul
Hello From Lufkin Texas!
Cant seem to Identify what this is.  Any thoughts?
Evaluating and adjusting Fish populations and ID
Vegetation ID
Our new pond

© 2014 POND BOSS INC. all rights reserved USA and Worldwide