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#370614 - 03/30/14 10:54 AM DIY sump pump/aerator
mcfalcon Offline


Registered: 03/29/14
Posts: 3
Loc: southeast texas
Ok all these videos on youtube about sump pumps outfitted with venturi devices for circulation and aeration. Is this good idea? Has anyone tried it? Maybe pros/cons.
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#370627 - 03/30/14 11:54 AM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4838
Loc: SE Kansas
I have for many years made use of things not designed to be used for a specific purpose, making it do a new purpose. Sometimes it works well, sometimes not so well.

For something that is going to be in continuous use, energy cost should be a big consideration. For example, you might save a few bucks on not buying the pump specifically for the purpose, only to find out later that the electric cost to run it has amounted to more than what the proper pump would have cost to begin with.

Maybe not. Just something to think about. "Making do" for temporary use items is sometimes very practical. For something that is going to be used a lot or in continuous use, using the correct tool a lot of times makes more sense.

I like tinkering and making use of surplus stuff I have laying around for other purposes. It is fun. But for things I am dependent on or use a lot, am not afraid of buying the right tool for the job. Shooting myself in the foot (metaphorically speaking) numerous times has brought about this line of thinking.

If you do it, good luck and by all means let us know how it turned out.
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#370633 - 03/30/14 12:19 PM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
mcfalcon Offline


Registered: 03/29/14
Posts: 3
Loc: southeast texas
If i do attempt I will most certainly post results. Ive been reading about the thermal stratification of pons and aeration. I guess my theory on this would be intake on bottom, plus air, exhaust on top would equal twice the water mixing.Ohhhhhh... I didnt mention just bought a house with pond. Few BG like 10 catchable and babies and few catfish like under 10 well now I have roughly 60-80 newborn cat babies and I want to make sure they have the best environment I can give them. And NO MONEY . LOL
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#370670 - 03/30/14 05:52 PM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
Bill Cody Offline
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Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 12398
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Venturi aerators and injectors are good tools for the right job or certain applications. I don't think the venturi is the best device for mixing ponds larger than garden or koi-goldfish type ponds. The venturi system will work but it is too inefficient for large pond aeration.
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#370709 - 03/31/14 12:32 AM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4838
Loc: SE Kansas
Welcome to the forum and there are LOTS and lots of threads on using various methods to de-stratify a pond.

One thing that is hard for some people to conceptualize in the systems that use air is just how much water they move. People might be familiar with an aquarium aerator and think that the bubbles are what is doing the aeration. It does to a very small degree, but what does the majority is the air-water interface at the surface. The bubbles move the water from depth to the surface where it can take on O2 at the air/water interface.

I have an air pump that uses just 100 watts of energy to run it. But from a depth at 8-9' where the diffuser is it moves thousands and thousands of gallons of water a day. It moves enough water that it will repel my paddle boat away from it with more gusto than a person would imagine from the water current produced.

People get the incorrect idea that the bubbles are the aeration. They are not. They are just the work horses that move the water. It is the air/water interface at the surface that does the majority of taking on O2 from the air.

This water current produced by the bubbles is also what moves the water from lower levels to the surface to de-stratify a pond.

There is no way I could get an electric water pump to move the gallons of water my 100 watt air pump will for the same amount of energy cost. I bet it would take 5 or 10 times the wattage to move the same amount of water with a water pump.

So either a water pump or an air pump will both move water. They both have their places. In some of the situations, the air just does it more energy efficient (but not all situations).

Just something to consider in your planning. See what electric your sump pump uses then find an on line calculator to find its monthly operating cost based on your cost per kwh. Might save you from a nasty surprise on your electric bill.

At least that is the way I understand it. I'm no expert at anything.


Edited by snrub (03/31/14 01:03 AM)
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#370922 - 04/01/14 06:58 PM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
mcfalcon Offline


Registered: 03/29/14
Posts: 3
Loc: southeast texas
TY snrub. I kinda wondered how bubbles that burst at the top of the water did anything to add oxygen to the water itself when it just rises pops and keeps rising lol. And yes 100 watts sound a lot less expensive than the 700-900 watt pumps ive been looking at. You definitely shined some light on the subject ty.
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#370927 - 04/01/14 07:34 PM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
esshup Offline
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More oxygen is added to the water through the surface film/air intersection than from the bubbles of the aeration system.

That's why the lifting rates in GPM of the diffusers is so important. The more water volume that is exposed to the air, the more O2 added.

That's why surface agitators do such a good job adding O2. MUCH more surface area of the water comes in contact with the air. But then you get into the electricity costs vs. amount of O2 added debate.

Both types of systems have their place, it's up to the pond owner to decide which one (or both) to go with.
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#486070 - 02/12/18 03:11 AM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
albertbill21 Offline


Registered: 02/09/18
Posts: 1
Loc: los angles
please help me out which model of sump pump is better ?
thanks

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#486072 - 02/12/18 07:18 AM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: albertbill21]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4838
Loc: SE Kansas
Sump pumps are good for pumping sumps. Not very good for aeriating a pond.


Edited by snrub (02/12/18 08:25 AM)
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#486084 - 02/12/18 11:58 AM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
Rainman Offline
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Registered: 06/06/07
Posts: 6935
Loc: St Louis, MO area
albertbill21, welcome to the forum! What size is your pond? Max and average depths, shape...?

As snrub said, a sump m\pump would cost a lot in electricity and would do little in the way of actual aeration.....Air costs FAR less to pump than water, and gives far better results for the dollar.
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#486102 - 02/13/18 12:59 PM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: albertbill21]
DonoBBD Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 1893
Loc: Ontario, Canada, Eh.
Originally Posted By: albertbill21
please help me out which model of sump pump is better ?
thanks


I would use a brushless waterfall pump if your going to use a water pump. I have a few of the maxflow units and love them. I have two big 5500 gph units. One that run 24/7 in the summer and winter.
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#489338 - 04/30/18 12:48 PM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
Twar Offline


Registered: 04/09/17
Posts: 18
Loc: NY
I am looking at the same type of venturi aeration, only with a bilge pump running off a solar panel. I am looking to aerate a 3,000 sqft forage pond.

I need to run solar as I am too far from electric. Worst case I burn up a $30 pump, but still have the 100 watt panel for upgrading.


What would be the most beneficial, pumping surface water down with the venturi, so it bubbles up and forces top water to the bottom, or setting the pump deep and pumping bottom water up with the bubbles?

I would pump air, but I would have to spend $500-$600 minimum. With this setup I am aiming for $200.

$110 - 100 watt panel
$30 - Attwood Tsunami 1200
$20 - Schumacher charge controller and load controller that will shut off power to the pump if battery charge is depleted.
$20 - 7-10ah 12v AGM battery
$10 - Venturi injector

May even skip the battery and charger and see how long the pump holds up wired directly to the panel.

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#493450 - 07/08/18 11:38 AM Re: DIY sump pump/aerator [Re: mcfalcon]
Mike Whatley Offline


Registered: 04/22/18
Posts: 241
Loc: Louisiana
If you're dead set on using this type of system, IMO, you'd be better off taking water from the surface, which will already have a higher O2 content, and run the discharge out to deeper water in the middle of the pond and allow the bubbles (minimal at best) to rise and help bring the less oxygenated water to the surface. My understanding of venturi systems is they are more effective when you get the valve as close to the discharge as possible. Using a livewell type aeration sprayer on the end of the discharge would create a larger bubble field and should increase your uplift. What you lose in uplift circulation you'll gain in pumping off the top. You could probably get by with a short piece of pvc pipe attached to the end of the discharge with a lot of small holes drilled in it. Just make sure it's well attached so you don't blow it off the end of the pipe with too much back pressure. That's just my way of thinking tho. I'm probably wrong. I was once, but I've slept since then.


Edited by Mike Whatley (07/08/18 11:46 AM)
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