Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations The testing will begin today.

Fascinating stuff to be sure. If changes in seal level, or glacial interludes, along with a few million years did allow for the development of two (or more?) different subspecies of CNBG, then who can say? A lot of literature that I have read suggests that once sea levels returned to normal, the two divergent strains were able to interbreed, and a great deal of that diversity was lost over time. So much so that some sources claim mystacalis no longer exists, and purpurascens is the standard that defines CNBG.

There's no denying the effects of a selective breeding program, and Overton's work with the CNBG speaks for itself, like Bruce's work with the northern strain does also. But starting with the correct stock appears to me to be of paramount importance, and this is where I allow myself to wonder about isolated pockets, or areas where the effects of this genetic dilution might not be as prevalent.

One of the 'to do' items in my bucket is to someday fish for hand painted BG's in the Apalachicola river. There's a BG unique to a fairly specific region.

BG Zero? I feel a vision quest coming!

You mean you can eat them too? I thought you just fed them until they exploded, took pics, and scared the LMB away when they came near them. I have to admit that BG have been a blast to manage, and my LMB are feeling neglected. I'm fine with that.

Why doesn't someone raise those hand painted bluegills for sale? Are they cold tolerant? I would think one of those native fish growers would try this. There surely would be a demand for several thousand of them.

I'll bet they wouldn't like my colder water very well. Still, the idea of experimenting with a few of them is very appealing. I would love to have some.



Wherever he is right now, Yolk Sac has suddenly broke out into a cold sweat for what he thinks is no apparent reason.

You bet. I mean it's a small quest to be sure, not on par with discovering the Ark of the Covenant, or Bigfoot or something.

Baby steps, Al...baby steps!

I believe a couple of local hatcheries have raised them. It would be unlikely they'd be much more cold tolerant than CNBG. No doubt a neat subspecies or at least genetically unique river basin strain.

I will add to this since I have worked with multiple stocks from peninsular Florida, and the Savanah River drainage.

Savanah River drainage CNBG I think represent bulk of what is traded outside of Florida. They are the most similar form to the NBG in terms of overall appearance, but still distinguishable.

CNBG of the St. Johns and Suwanee River drainages are very similar to each other and relative reddish in base coloration. Suwanee stock does not handle transport well while the St. Johns stock does. At least one supplier in Arkansas has carried St. Johns stock.

Stocks occurring in the Manatee River drainage and possibly down to the glades are different yet again. They are decidedly round in profile and when crossed with NBG or the other CNBG stocks have a flat spot on the upper part of caudal peduncle. This variant lacks the red coloration. Larvae of these guys are very different with respect to behavior.

It is my opinion the CNBG should be split into three subspecies in their own right. All should be split from NBG and Hand Paints which should be split from each other as well.


I have seen nothing that makes me think CNBG and Hand Paint are closer to each other than either is to NBG.

Hybrids I have made may have fertility issues.

I like the hand painted bg and would love to have some in the pond. Any problems have them in a pond with the cnbg? And where would one go to find and buy such a good looking bg? How big will they get in an E Texas climate? In the pic provided by essup they look to have a larger mouth so do they?

Jim, where do you place the CNBG found on the west coast?