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I'm having trouble finding your address to the get together. I think im only 30 minutes from ya.


The people who say I can't do it can just sit the @^#% down and watch me. Friends call me Rusto I also subscribe to pond boss mag. http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=504716#Post504716
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I'll post the exact location a couple weeks before the get together. I'm only a little over a mile from the Kansas Crossing Casino. I'll PM you.

SE Kansas PBF get together September 22, 2018


John

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Had some recent rains causing my sediment and forage ponds to overflow into the main pond (normal). One thing that fascinates me is how small BG desire to swim upstream. It is hard to make out the fish in the pictures but the 1" long BG are massed together in this flowing water crowded up against rocks or anything that gets them temporarily out of the current while they rest getting ready to make a run against the current trying to get upstream into another pond. There are hundreds of them staging. In one picture it looks like a couple BG are stranded and perhaps dead. But when I put my finger down by them they took off. They will find any crack or depression to get out of the current while waiting to make the run.

I see this every time there is a rain that causes this overflow. Sometimes the fish are of a larger size, often times 2-3" fish. If the water is at just the right flow amount, the main pond at the right height I have witnessed 3" BG swim up the waterfall flowing into the 90 degree elbo of the overflow pipe and make it from my main pond to the sediment pond. None have ever made it into my forage pond. Out of hundreds of trys in the sediment pond I saw 3 fish make it. None of these small fish in the pictures will make it. Water level is too low in the main pond. But it will not keep them from trying. Persistence.

The last picture of one of the fish with my fingers for size comparison. Fish between 1 and 1.5".

It is no wonder fish move from one BOW to another in the most shallow water.

PBF informal get together September 22, 2018

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Last edited by snrub; 09/07/18 12:15 AM.

John

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Thanks for documenting this so clearly and so well! Everytime someone proposes that fish got into a body of water by holding on (with their fins apparently) to raccoon legs or that eggs get stuck on duck feathers.... the 1" long bluegill are feeling very slighted that they do not get the credit they deserve for being incredibly tenacious.

To see these tiny beings saving energy and throwing everything they got into swimming UPHILL in a torrent of water and some of them actually making it.. it speaks to how fish are more likely to transport THEMSELVES to other bodies of water rather than hitching a ride...

I would love to see others especially in southern states set up game cameras by tiny puddles or ponds and see how the fish get into them. I hear that gambusia will show up 'by themselves' in almost any body of water. It seems if you took a backhoe and dug a little depression and set up a game camera, and if fish did show up in there that it should be pretty easy to catch the GBH or raccoon or duck that landed there. And if they don't drop in from the sky or are carried in by another creature, then that puddle of water should stay void of fish, right?

Great things we learn on this forum!

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My old pond and RES pond are side by side, separated by only maybe 100 feet. I built a terrace out into the field (actually a long extension of the dam on the RES pond) quite a long ways specifically for keeping the BH and GSF that I know are in my old pond from getting in my RES pond. In heavy downpours a sheet of water could be coming off the agricultural field and open a pathway for the unwanted fish to migrate. I think a half inch of water is all that is needed for very small fish.

I'm not absolutely sure even the terrace will be absolute control. Some day there may be enough runoff that fish could migrate anyway. But at the very least, just from a numbers game, it should keep the migration to a significantly lower level that what it could have been. If I had just built the dam that the pond "needed" a heavy rain with both ponds overflowing their emergency overflows they would have either almost or actually joined BOW's.

Having had experience with GSF and BH contamination in other ponds and seeing the potential in my brand new RES pond, I went to some length (moved some extra dirt) to prevent it.

One thing about fish contamination, it is much worse to get it early than late. Even if I do get contamination at some later date the desired species will already have established populations and a few unwanted fish will have a hard time getting established to a point of ruining the pond.


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Fish looks skinny. Little hard to tell by the picture but measured right at 18" or just a little more. Did not weigh it. It looked to be healthy and swam away well when released but in the picture it looks kind of skinny to me. Definitely no lack of forage in the pond because there is an abundance of BG and not enough LMB.

I might have culled this one but since I am short on LMB anyway I put it back. I had caught a 3-4" BG on a 1/32 oz jig and decided to just leave it on the hook. Tossed the line and BG back out and the bass took the BG and I landed it. Pretty good fight on a lightweight 9' crappie rod.

I hardly ever fish specifically for LMB so I do not catch too many. Was a bit of a surprise.

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Last edited by snrub; 09/08/18 10:42 AM.

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That LMB is losing weight. It appears that it use to be heaver and is shrinking. How old do you think the LMB is ?
To have that size head and dorsal body mass indicates a much larger fish at one point in time.
















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I'd have culled it, though with a heavy heart. But my BOW has lots of LMB, so even an 18 inch skinny one is not an asset.


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It could very well be one of the original stocked, IIRC five years ago this fall.

It looked thin to me. Otherwise I did not see any external problems with it and it fought well.


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Here are some more pictures of fish trying to swim up a water stream into my sediment pond. I don't think any of these fish will make it. The main pond is up in the tube now so the fish can rest better but the water dropping into the tube has to be at just the right flow rate. It might have been earlier in the day before I got there though.

Some GSF. Lots of BG

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Last edited by snrub; 09/08/18 09:46 PM.

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I've had virtually no recruitment from my LMB for the last few years so my BG population has gotten too large creating too many small and medium sized BG but few really large ones. If left unchecked I feel like the situation will turn into stunted BG. I've been feeding and harvesting a lot so the BG are staying in relative good body condition but there are still just too many of them.

So starting nearly a year ago last fall the decision was to raise some LMB fingerlings up to the 10-12" size in my sediment pond and transfer them over to the main pond to help with the BG control. If I get the LMB population more in balance it should take care of the BG over population and allow the LMB to start getting some natural recruitments.

I put a hundred 4-6" LMB in the sediment pond last December and thought it was a bust. I had only caught and moved a half dozen fish, figuring the rest had died. Well turns out I just did not know how to catch them. By using various large lures and lately GSH on a circle hook under a bobber have transferred about 30 LMB to this main pond. Most were in the 10-12" range with a couple 9" runts and one fatty 16" (I suspect it ate some of its brothers and sisters). First picture below is of kind of an average one.

In addition have been adding a few SMB from my RES/SMB pond. Caught two 13" ones tonight and transferred. Second picture is of the first one. This makes 7 of these transferred in the 12-13" range. I've also transferred a half dozen in the 6-8" range.

Hopefully all the transfers will do well and get my BG population under control.

Edit: added picture of the LMB fingerlings when stocked December 6, 2017

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Last edited by snrub; 10/06/18 11:26 PM.

John

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Got the new Texas Hunter feeder in and got it installed. Model DF125DL.

It is the smallest model and I hope I don't regret getting the smaller one. But 70# of capacity should last me almost a week at the rate I feed from the feeder. I'll still hand feed a couple other spots around the pond. I ultimately went with the small one because it could be shipped UPS and the larger ones have to go motor freight. Had the medium one in the cart till I found out it came motor freight. Since the pond is near my house and I am out there daily I figure will just dump a bag of feed in every three or four days.

I did a single rate test of Aquamax MVP feed. A gallon of AM MVP weighs about 3.4#. I dumped that in the feeder and set the test run to run 60 seconds. Timed it and it took 47 seconds for the 3.4# to run out. So according to my calculations the feed rate is approximately 14 seconds for each pound of feed distributed (factory feed plate setting). I only did a single test so not very scientific but it should be in the ball park.

Fish were hitting the pellets as soon as they hit the water. Of course they have been used to me feeding off the dock all spring so not surprising.

Right now I have it set for 25 seconds at 7am, 30 seconds at 8am, 30 seconds at 6pm and 30 seconds at 7pm. Should be around 8# per day on my main 3 acre pond. Will feed probably another 3# by hand in a couple other spots on the opposite side most days.

Pictures of the dock mounting below. The feeder sits about 70 feet from the shore line out over the water.

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Last edited by snrub; 05/07/19 02:58 PM.

John

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I have that same feeder and love it, although 100# lasts a month. Beautiful set up and pond you have John

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Thanks Pat!


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That is quite a nice family recreation area you've created.

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Gorgeous water. I've heard other people say that 9 seconds by TH feeder is one pound, but perhaps this depends on size of feeder & of course the feed.

Do you throw strictly BG feed or larger LMB pellets? I've had some issues with LMB pellets getting stuck, even when throw plate is adjusted.


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Snrub it looks like you have put together a nice place. Your feeding a lot more MVP feed than me even though I have 3 feeders throwing @ 5 sec per day per feeder. I make up some the difference in feed weight by hand throwing about 4 lbs of Aqumax lmb. And I will sometimes hand throw some additional mvp.


Right now I am seeing quite a few smaller cnbg around the feeders but not seeing all that many small ones around the ponds bank. But the lmb and hsb continue to have RW's well above 100%.


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Nice work Snrub ! That is a good feeder. Nice place ! The fish you transferred in should help reduce the BG #s. BG have small stomachs (1-3 pellets) but can digest quickly in warm temps. With that info you can design your feeding program to meet your goals. Adjust to fit your situation - more feeds but shorter duration close in time helps spread food to more fish - so to does few but longer feeds (everyone has time to eat and fill-up) - in the middle is adjustable to feed your target fish. Just a thought.
















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Beautiful spot Snrub!

I have had the same size TH feeder (LM135, 70 lb. capacity) for the last two-plus years but I only feed a touch over a pound of pellets twice each day. The factory setting of the spin plate is not consistent on every unit I believe. My factory setting threw 4.3 ounces of MVP every 10 seconds which was much less than what customer service at TH HQ told me the factory setting would throw (don't get me wrong, TH customer service is awesome).

That was not a problem because it is easy to get to the spin plate and adjust the gap between the hopper and the plate with a hex key. They recommended only making 1/16 inch adjustments at a time. I now have it set to throw 8.5 ounces of MVP every 10 seconds so each feeding time dropped from 40 seconds to 20 seconds twice each day.

I am only doing supplemental feeding at that particular 1.6 acre pond so I thought about 2 lbs. each day total was good as we have plenty of BG forage for the LMB.

And also, that is one hell of a dock Snrub! Really nice. BM61.


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Thanks Anthropic. The water is colored with midnight blue pond dye that has been diluted due to recent rains and is a really pretty color right now. It is starting to get an algae bloom so taking on a green cast to the blue color, which it needs with the new BG fry I am seeing.

Good info bassmaster61. I knew the feed plate could be adjusted but did not think about it being set differently on different units from the factory. I can see also where different feeds would have different feed rates. I would think AM600 would feed differently than AM500 or MVP. I like the feed rate where mine is set. I actually changed the settings today to 16 seconds each at 7, 8, and 9am and 5, 6, 7pm. Way too many choices. May drive myself nuts trying to figure out the best feed pattern.

Eric I have always fed around the circumference of the pond so have had lots of growth but few of the largest BG. Lots of medium size BG but few really big ones. With the feeder I am hoping there will be a few "pigs" that hang around the feeder and get a few of my BG to the size I see some of the other ponds on this forum sport.

Thanks everyone for the compliments.


Last edited by snrub; 05/08/19 08:29 PM.

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John, if my experience is anything to go by, you will likely get some absolute BG pigs hanging around the feeder. Maximum Three and a half year old CNBG was 10.5 inches and very fat when my granddaughter caught him near a feeder this winter.


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An interesting experiment to try. Try hand feeding at different times after the feeder has gone off. Like 1 hour one day and then 2 hours the next day and try to gauge what size fish are eating.
















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I have several questions about feeding my fish.


My pond is a 3 acre strip pit: Good population of BG, LMB, and FHM. Small population of BCP, and RES. And just stocked CC, HBG, and HSB. I feed using a TH feeder, feeding 10am 6 seconds, 2pm 6 seconds, and 6pm 6 seconds. The BG are the only species of fish I have coming to the feeder and this is my second year of feeding my fish. My goal is to get more fish to come to the feed especially CC, HBG, HSB, and LMB.

1. If you use MVP food in a TH feeder will it throw the pellets equally(roughly the same amount of each size pellet) or will the smaller pellet size sift to the bottom of the feeder after a few feed cycles. Making it then throw predominately only one size of pellet.

2. If feed is stored over winter does it loose nutritional value and/or be less attractive to the fish.

3. If you switch from Optimal feeds to similar size Purina Aquamax feeds or vice versa will the fish still eat them as usual or in your experience is it best to stick with one brand.

4. I've been attempting to hand feed in a different 1/2 acre portion of my pond where the fish typically spawn and I see lots of FHM and baby BG. I have gotten FHM and a few small BG to eat, but was looking for suggestions to get LMB and a larger number of BG to eat.

5. I only feed for 18 seconds total each day, but my BG only will eat what I have provided so far. I've seen at other peoples ponds and read about the fish boiling the water when people feed. But I only have about 30- 40 adult BG that come to the feed and they never go crazy over it. Currently feeding Optimal BG mixed with Junoir. I fed AM 500 last year. Would you recommend feeding at more times than three a day and at what times of the day would you recommended setting the feeder?

6. I've read that your BG will only respond to feeding as consistent as you are at feeding them and when I hand feed it is typically at different times of the day, not on a set daily time. Has anyone had experience ringing a bell to attract the fish when hand feeding or any other way to get them to come in.

7. I stocked 50 CC 6-8", 40 HSB 4-6", and 200 HBG 3-4" on April 13th. I stocked them just to have more species of fish to watch eat fish food. I have not seen any of them since I released them and I observe my pond daily. Is it safe to say they probably got eaten by my LMB and BCP. I realive I didn't stock very many fish, especially for the size of my pond, but I at least thought I'd see some swimming around. I'm guessing it would be smarter to buy 11-14" CC and 6-8" HSB next time.

Last edited by Heath Lawrence; 05/09/19 02:26 PM.

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Heath are your LMB feed trained?
I have never seen any cc at the feeder since I put them in 3 years ago but you can catch them away from the feeder. My BG blow up when the TH feeder goes off. If you are close you will get wet! A good quality feed with40+ protein is the key in my opinion. Older feed will lose its usefulness and the fish won’t eat it as well, I use Cargill 4512 and they wolf it down. Other brands are not that available around me . I won’t buy any feed that is more than three months old but that’s me. You can tell the difference in their feeding

PS LMB are difficult to feed train that weren’t raised that way

I stomp around on the dock and throw in a handful of feed and it’s on, you might try different feed and let the fish tell you what they want. I was feeding TS feed and they lost weight and barely ate it , went back to the good stuff and they gained weight and literally jump out of the water after it

Last edited by Pat Williamson; 05/09/19 09:19 PM.
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Thanks Pat Williamson for the response.

My LMB are not feed trained. I've thought about buying some, but was afraid they would get eaten by my existing LMB and BCP. Also I figured to get LMB in a large enough size that they wouldn't get eaten would be very expensive. Do you have feed trained LMB in your pond Pat?

My TH feeder was about half full with feed from last fall when I started feeding this year, that might explain why the fish aren't feeding as aggressively as I'd like.

I'll have to try stomping on my dock as you mentioned. I've heard snrub say he drives a vehicle or gator to where he feeds the fish and they respond to the vibration in the ground and know it's time to feed.


3 acre strip pit: BG, RES, LMB and BCP.
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