Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose I would like scientific evidence that Florida Bass

Can someone provide me with a scientific study that shows where Florida Strain bass die in cold water, not some anecdotal "oh this didn't work in my lake" but real evidence. Maybe they are just less aggressive in cold water and can't compete with the Northern Strain, that doesn't mean they couldn't spawn with the northern strain if introduced at a larger size. So much miss information out there. I think Lake Chickaamauga and soon Kentucky Lake might dispel some of these myths that exist........

I would start with these papers.

http://afs.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1577/1548-8659-121.5.686?journalCode=utaf20

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1577/1548-8659(2000)129%3C0001%3AOGASOL%3E2.0.CO%3B2

To best of my knowledge, what was previously referred to as a subspecies of Largemouth Bass, namely the Florida Largemouth Bass Micropterus salmoides floridanus, has been elevated to its own species Florida Bass Micropterus floridanus leaving what what previously called the Northern Largemouth Bass Micropterus salmoides salmoides now being referred to as simply Largemouth Bass Micropterus salmoides.

This isn't "scientific evidence", yet JM Malone produces over 3 million LMB/yr, and they know where, and why, the Florida strain LMB die.

Pure strain Florida Bass, like Coppernose Bluegill, will have heavy mortality in cold winters, especially is under ice. Growth is poor in more northern climes as well, due to the shorter growing seasons and extra stress from cooler water. Florida Bass are also naturally less aggressive than northern bass.....I don't think Florida strain Bass outgrow northern strain bass in cooler waters either. F1 hybrids MAY do a bit better, but genetics passed on are climate based......in short, there is little bang for the buck by stocking Florida Bass north of I-20, as stated in the JM Malone excerpt below...



Florida strain largemouth bass are the largest strain with some fish reaching 20 +pounds in size with most averaging 10 + pounds. Florida strain largemouth bass in their native climate have a year round growing season and do not have to cope with stressful cold winters. Therefore they live longer and grow larger in their native climate. However, Florida strain largemouth bass are difficult to catch prompting many pond owners to restock with northern strain bass to produce quality fishing. Florida bass are not very cold tolerant and ponds north of I-20 stocked with Florida strain largemouth bass can experience 50% mortality in the winter and up to 75% mortality under ice cover.

F1 hybrid largemouth bass are gaining in popularity in the southern region as easier to catch then Florida strain largemouth bass and larger than northern strain largemouth bass. The jury is still out on the F1 hybrid largemouth bass. Once the F1 bass reach maturity and spawn the hybrid genes will be mixed up and those passed on to offspring will be selected by the local climate.

In one of Phillip's studies 0% of the Fla LMB stocked in Wisc survived winter.


Transactions of the American Fisheries Society 120:58-64, 1991
© Copyright by the American Fisheries Society 1991
Survival and Growth of Northern, Florida, and Reciprocal
FI Hybrid Largemouth Bass in Central Illinois
DAVID P. PHILIPP AND GREGORY S. WHirr1
Center for Aquatic Ecology, Illinois Natural History Survey
607 East Peabody Drive, Champaign, Illinois 61820, USA
Abstract.—Stocks of northern largemouth bass Micropterus salmoides salmoides, Florida largemouth
bass M. s. Jloridanus, and both reciprocal F, hybrids were produced in Champaign, Illinois,
with natural spawning techniques. The genetic composition of each of these stocks was confirmed
electrophoretically. Overwinter survival of northern largemouth bass in central Illinois was significantly
greater than that of Florida largemouth bass; the two reciprocal F, hybrids had intermediate
survival. The absolute survival rate of all stocks decreased as the severity of the winter
increased; however, the effects were most dramatic for the Florida subspecies. The northern largemouth
bass also exhibited greater second- and third-year growth than the Florida largemouth bass;
again, the reciprocal F, hybrids were intermediate. Results of this study indicate the potential
negative effects that may arise when Florida largemouth bass or hybrids between it and the northern
subspecies are introduced into waters of the USA and Canada that are within or contiguous to the
native range of the northern subspecies.



North American Journal of Fisheries Management 28:516–522, 2008

Copyright by the American Fisheries Society 2008



Here is a basic overview from the study but there is more not said.

Two subspecies of largemouth bass Micropterus

salmoides, the Florida M. s. floridanus and the northern

M. s. salmoides, were first described by Bailey and

Hubbs (1949). Kassler et al. (2002) proposed divergence

of the two warranted species designation. Philipp

et al. (1983) showed that (1) the native range of the

Florida largemouth bass (FLMB) was restricted to

peninsular Florida; (2) the northern largemouth bass

(NLMB) was native to waters north of Maryland along

the Atlantic coast, and then west to the Mississippi

River; and (3) a hybrid zone existed between the ranges

of the two. The FLMB, NLMB, and their hybrids

interbreed where they coexist (Isely et al. 1987;

Gilliland and Whitaker 1991; Philipp and Whitt 1991).

Physiological and ecological differences among

FLMB, NLMB, and their hybrids have been documented.

For example, they exhibited different critical

and chronic thermal maxima (Fields et al. 1987) and

different mortality rates when held at low temperatures

(Carmichael et al. 1988). In addition, FLMB and

NLMB differ in the timing of spawning, growth rate,

reproductive success, and survival (Isely et al. 1987;

Gilliland and Whitaker 1991; Philipp and Whitt 1991).

Performance differs among endemic units within the

historic range of FLMB and NLMB. For example,

growth and survival differed between progeny of

parents from different drainages in Illinois (Philipp

and Claussen 1995). Similarly, swimming performance

differed between Illinois and Wisconsin populations of

bass (Cooke et al. 2001). Lastly, the survival, growth,

and reproductive success of the local stock were higher

than those of the nonlocal stock when comparing

performance among Wisconsin, Illinois, Texas, and

Florida populations at each locale (Philipp et al. 2002).

Strain is not appropriate as more typically used when talking about domesticated populations.

Species is where most of scientific community is on taxonomy of these black basses.

Critical and Chronic Thermal Maxima of Northern and Florida Largemouth Bass and Their Reciprocal F1 and F2 Hybrids
Robert Fields, Shirley S. Lowe, Christine Kaminski, Gregory S. Whitt & David P. Philipp
Transactions of the American Fisheries Society, 116:6, 856-863, DOI: 10.1577/1548-8659(1987)116<856:CACTMO>2.0.CO;2


…NLMB should have a selective advantage in environments in which a greater pro- portion of their time is spent at lower temperatures. Indeed, this appears to be the case; FLMB exhibit significantly greater over-winter mortality and slower growth than NLMB in more northerly environments (Philipp and Whitt, unpublished results).


Overwinter Growth and Survival of Largemouth Bass: Interactions among Size, Food, Origin, and Winter Severity
Aimee H. Fullerton , James E. Garvey , Russell A. Wright & Roy A. Stein
, Transactions of the American Fisheries Society, 129:1, 1-12, DOI: 10.1577/1548-8659(2000)129<0001:OGASOL>2.0.CO;2


Because of extensive stocking of the Florida subspecies, Alabama largemouth bass contained about 96% of the Florida genome through hybridization (M. Maceina, Auburn University, Department of Fisheries and Allied Aquacultures, personal communication). High mortality of Alabama largemouth bass in the Ohio and Wisconsin winters likely occurred as a result of their intolerance to cold temperatures, even given our slower cooling rates (about 0.58C/d) as compared with those of Philipp (1992).