Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Feeding Purina Questions

It is about time to order my second bag of feed. My first bag (Cargil 45/12 in the 1/8" size) was purchased from Overton's with my fish. My fish seem to really like it, but I can't get it locally at an affordable price. My local feed store can get whatever Purina product I want. My fish were stocked around three weeks ago (3-5" CNBG, 3-4" RES, 6-8" LMB and 10-12" HSB). I have a half a bag of the Cargil left and was planning to mix some of whatever I purchase in with the remaining Cargil to gradually switch them over. My plan was to use the Sport Fish MVP since I am feeding various types and sizes of fish but I am concerned that none of my fish are large enough to eat the largest pellets at 9/32". Can 10-12" HSB eat this? My CNBG like to feed in very shallow water. If I throw the MVP shallow will the CNBG eat just the small pellets and leave the big stuff? And second I noticed that the MVP doesn't list LMB as a species that it feeds. Will the LMB eat this? Is this just to get people to buy both the "Sport Fish MVP" and the "Sport Fish Largemouth"?

I know that is a lot of questions. Anyone's thoughts on any of the questions would be appreciated.

If your largemouth bass are feed-trained, they'll eat the MVP. That feed has nine different pellet sizes. The two smallest sizes don't float, they'll drift toward the bottom. That design is to allow the more timid fish an opportunity to eat.

Hybrid Striped Bass readily eat the Sport Fish products, including the larger sized pellets in MVP. If you were only feeding the HSB, I'd recommend AquaMax 600.

Since you have fairly small bluegills and 6-8" bass (assuming they are feed-trained), MVP is a good choice.

Any fish which feed won't be selective about leaving any pellets behind. If they fit into their mouths, they'll eat it. Big fish may not be able to eat small pellets, but they don't "reject" them because of pellet size.

Don't worry about the fish not eating the larger pellets. If they are too big to fit into their mouth and there are no larger fish to eat the big pellets, the small fish will peck at the pellets till they soften and ultimately clean them up.

If you have a pond full of only FHM, they would even eat AM Largemouth. They would just have to work at it a while......and they would!

If all you have is small fish, they will eat AM600 just fine. It just takes them a while. The problem is that if you want to feed the small fish, you only feed AM600, and there are sufficient large fish to eat the AM600, the feed will all be gone before the smaller fish get any to speak of. The small fish will hit the pellets and try to tear off a chunk but they can't do that till the pellet softens and the pellet will never soften till it is in the belly of a big fish if there are enough big fish to eat all the pellets quickly.

Thus the multi size product of MVP. The larger fish will eat both the large and small pellets, but with the small pellets there and available the smaller fish at least stand a chance of getting a bite. If two of different sizes are close in proximity, the fish will choose the larger one over the smaller pellet if it can eat it, but if only the small pellet is there the bigger fish is not too proud to eat it.

I feed AM400 part of the feeding season, which is a tiny pellet, around my bank in very close where the small BG hang out (not feeding any now but have a bag on order and will start when YOY start showing up). 3" BG love the stuff. I normally scatter it around the circumference of the pond at the same time I am feeding the larger fish. The larger fish go for the bigger pellets in deeper water and this gives the small fish a chance to eat the tiny AM400 pellets. I throw it only out about a foot or two from the bank. Long story is, if I stop and watch the fish for a while where I throw out more feed in that particular spot than I normally would, and I get more of the AM400 than the small BG can eat quickly, eventually I will have two pound CC come right up to banks edge and Hoover up the AM400 pellets. They are like a vacuum cleaner sucking in 4 or 5 pellets at a time. AM400 to my CC is like candy to a kid. They love that high protein stuff. So at least big CC will readily eat very small pellets given the chance.

Here is a thread with pictures of AM MVP, AM largemouth and a mix of AM500-AM600 (that is the mix I fed before AM MVP became available). Pictures of fish food

Edit: Just for kicks I sometimes will take some AM largemouth and throw out a few pellets. I don't have any feed trained LMB, so the pellets float without a LMB taker. But it is quite a show to see the BG hit that big pellet time after time. I have even seen them knock it out of the water into the air. They keep hitting it and within 30 seconds it will soften enough they start tearing hunks off till it is small enough for one of them to swallow it. Or....... if I do it long enough to attract the attention of my CC, a CC will come along and GULP, its gone. CC LOVE AM large mouth pellets. Just an expensive feed that they don't really need, but they will readily eat it if they get the chance. And the pellet size is definitely no problem for them. Anyone get the idea I like feeding my fish as much as fishing for them????

Snrub,
Have you tried the Optimal Bluegill Jr? I am sold on it now, and have a little left from late fall and a bag on order. I fed a bag of AM Grower 400 last year (hard to get, took 6 weeks), and I like the BG Jr a little better. The 2" BG eat it just fine.

Edit: I bet we could grow really big CC with those bass pellets. Could a 1.5 lb CC eat the bass pellets?
I need something the BG won't gobble up before the CC get started. The CC are getting big and lazy.

Yes, in fact I have both Optimal BG and BG Jr left over from last year that I plan to feed my RES in my forage pond as soon as I get the hybrids thinned out. Those hybrids are chow hounds. Pigs.

I'll probably stay with the AM products as my local feed dealer can get them in a couple weeks for the most part. But I have decided to use the Optimal for my RES in the forage pond.

As you posted your response, I was just thinking I ought to go out and take pictures of the AM MVP along side the Optimal BG and BG Jr and add it to that thread I linked in the above post.

The Optimal we bought this year has many more sizes than last year. I really like the new blend.

MVP didn't throw very good out of my TH feeder. I guess it had trouble with the largest pellet. I tried to adjust the spinner, but feeder was set at max from factory.

The first Optimal BG I bought 11 months ago cost $38 (not 36) per bag. It's $50 now. I wonder if that was an intro price or have costs gone up that much?

Edit: I looked back and the $38 did not include shipping then. The new price includes shipping, so has only gone up maybe $3.00, if that.

We bought a pallet in a group buy, so it was still $36 per bag, but it is $50 if you buy just one bag.

Brian is that 50# bags or 40# bags??

Optimal BG feed comes in 40 pound bags.

snrub, I may take your lead and get MVP to throw at medium and deep water and then throw 400 near the bank for my smaller bluegill.

Bob, yes my LMB are feed trained. I can always tell when they are feeding because they hit the top of the water pretty hard.

If you start feeding those small BG right next to the bank that AM400, within a week you will have them lining up waiting on you to feed them.

It gets pretty exciting when they are there waiting and a LMB decides it is supper time. I don't know how a LMB can catch a BG in 3" of water 6" from dry land, make a 90 degree turn, and be back in deep water in the blink of an eye. I've had LMB come partially out of the water and if I didn't know better, thought they turned in air. All six foot away from me while riding the UTV and feeding around the pond edge.

I throw a couple hand fulls of the MVP out as far as my left arm will toss it, then throw about a quarter hand full of the 400 near the bank, repeat all while driving around the perimeter of the pond. Sometimes I will stop and feed in one place just to observe the fish for a while.

A bag of AM400 will go a LONG way feeding small fish.

Oh, they are already lining up waiting for the Cargil. I stocked 405 fish. I think about 300 of them are there waiting in 6" water every day around 6:00 pm. Bass aren't big enough to ambush feeding time yet. They are feed trained so they are still going after the pellets.

snrub, here are some pictures of my fish lining up ready to eat. They really like the Cargil 45/12 in the 1/8" size. Do you think the AM400 would be a comparable product? Still leaning towards AM400 in the shallows and MVP in Medium to Deeper water.

Put an order in at the feed store yesterday for a bag of MVP. $39 for a 50# bag. I am assuming that is a decent price. Doesn't seem too bad. I still have half a bag of the Cargil 45/12 I will feed in the shallows.

That's about what I paid for the Cargill. I think the Optimal is close in price and maybe a couple bucks less. Not including shipping.

Yeah. The good thing is that he is not charging me for shipping. This is not an item they stock but the Purina truck will throw whatever special orders they have in with their weekly order free of charge. Works for me!!

Yes, those pictures look familiar.

I am not familiar at all with Cargill feeds other than the Sportsman's Choice branded Trophy Fish, which I had to buy a few bags last night from TSC because my Aquamax MVP order has not came in yet. Seems like Purina believes fish feeding starts about a month after it actually does.

You say yours is 1/8th inch and according to this Aquamax 400 information sheet it is 3/32, so slightly smaller pellets than your current Cargill at 4/32. AM500 is the next Purina step at 3/16 or 6/32 so it would be a jump higher than your current Cargill. I know my small BG love the AM400 and I have a bag on order. A bag will last me most if not all year, because I feed such small amounts of it to my smaller fish.

Here is a link to the Aquamax feed listed under the bluegill tab . Click on tab at the top of the page for other fish species.

My cnbg are spoiled and picky about what they eat. Last year, my seed and feed store guys gave me a bag of Purina Bg food, sorry but don't remember the size number but was slightly larger than the Cargill 1/8". The cnbg had been feed Cargill daily for a yr and a half, everyday same time same place.
So I threw out some of the Purina and the fish would not eat it, it all floated to the bank. I tried it for several days feeding at 3 different feeding spots where the TH feeders were set. No response from the fish. I then feed the Cargill and the fish tore up the water feeding, like they had not eaten in a few days. My fish are spoiled

PS, A friend here gave me a bag of Optimal and the fish tour into the feed and it does not look anything like the Cargill feed, maybe the smell is similar, I don't know

I've heard people say that before, that their BG did not like certain feed. I think mine would eat small rocks if I threw them out there. Would spit them back out, but when they get to feeding they will hit anything on the surface.

That may have to do with how many BG I have and the competetion they give each other. I really believe my LMB have had little to no spawn success the last couple years and I am getting way too heavy on BG population. I would assume a hungry fish with lots of competition is less likely to persnickety than a well fed fish with little competition.

At one time a couple years ago I was feeding up to 6# per acre feed, but last year and this year I backed it back to about 3# because I am concerned about water quality. Had a fair amount of bluegreen algae last year and I do not like that stuff. Stinks and is dangerous. So my fish are not as well fed as they once were. That could also be why they don't turn up their noses to any feed I throw out there.

Animals are funny about not wanting to eat what they are not used to. Back when we had cattle on the place I used to throw a few ears of corn out to them. During the growing season I would grab ears of corn out of the corn fields to see how they were progressing and would end up with a dozen in the back of my pickup. Throw them out to the cows and you could tell right away which cows had been exposed to eating whole corn before. A lot of them would come over to an ear, sniff it, and leave. But the ones that already knew it was food would tear into it. If I would have fed ear corn every day, eventually all of them would have gotten used to it and ate it. I suspect fish may be the same way.

Edit: Another observation I have made is the fish being conditioned to eat by the sound of my UTV. If I walk out around the pond and throw feed out, a few will start hitting it and after a couple minutes the splashing will call in the others and they all will be there feeding. But if I go out with my UTV, which is what I normally feed with, it is game on instantly. I see fish wakes flying toward me and as soon as the feed hits the water there is a fish boil going after the feed. So I find it interesting that the fish become conditioned to outside events that send the message that "it is time to eat". They are much more aggressive feeding when they hear the sound of the UTV. I have heard guys say the sound of their feeder blowers cause the same kind of reaction.

Yup the blower comes on it's a race to there when the feed comes out. Good observation.

I agree with your comments on fish feeding aroused by different sounds and time of day. And population may also come into play but for me there has always been a large population of cnbg from the first stocking. High forage stocking rates go with trophy lmb ponds So, I have no way to compare low verses high numbers of cnbg, other than there are way more today than a yr and a half ago. And like u snrub, I am backing off the feeding rates this season due to fighting water that has had two much green water. Pond seams to now have a natural fertilization going on this year so I will not fertilize this year where I did the past two years. I am now feeding 6 seconds per feeder per day (have not measured wt recently of the amount dispensed). No plans to increase this year. The only reason I could come up with when talking of them rejecting the Purina was size and smell. I think giving the Purina a longer time or number of days they would have eaten their feed, but given all the trouble people were having getting the product I decided to stay with the Cargill fish feed 1/8 and 1/4" sized pellets.

Tracy,

I'm going to buy a sack of each as well this time. My fish have been eating the 1/8", but I've got some big GSF that would probably appreciate the bigger nugget. Shucks, I bet if I threw some of those Beaver Nuggets from Buc-ees, they would tear it up! Haha

Maybe my situation was due to those fish were feed on Cargills from their beginning to where they were close to 16 to 24 months old +- when I tried the Purina, I really don't know what the deal was.

Tracy,
Did you try to mix the feeds half and half to transition them?