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Not sure if this thread has been started for 2017 yet or not, if so, just let me know and I'll post pics to the correct thread. If not, here we go!

HBCP ranging from 13-15"






One of several decent SMB up to 18"




Few good WE, a few are reaching 19" and seem to be benefiting from my dock feeding program









Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Great looking fish TJ!

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Great pics and beautiful fish!

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Outstanding buddy!!!

Thanks for starting the yearly thread.


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Great fish....!!!

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Very Nice! WE benefiting from dock feeding program? They eating pellets or just feasting on the smaller YP feeding?


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great looking crappie TJ....I think they are beautiful fish.


Fishing has never been about the fish....

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If there was a beauty contest for spec's, those would be the winners!

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Yowza, yowza, yowza!!!!!


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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outstanding group of fish and great examples.


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Beautiful fish, TJ. You say the walleye are benefitting from the feeding program... Do they eat the fish food or are they eating the fish food fed fish? (try to say that 3 time real fast)


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Repurposed BG chunks...have several trained HBCP, HSB, SMB, and WE that chill under the dock until feeding time.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Great looking fish TJ. Looks like a lot of fun.


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Beauties TJ! I'm curious if they went for more BG chunks or did you use another bait?

Last edited by Bill D.; 01/13/17 07:56 PM.

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1/8 oz slender spoon tipped with small fhm mainly or slip float and fhm rig



Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Thanks!!

Did you harvest any of the fish or was it C&R? I've never done much ice fishing but have wondered if the fish sometimes freeze on a really cold day before you can get them back in the water?


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Very nice TJ! That SMB is a chunk.



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I CR everything, to a fault, unless fish are low WR.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Very nice looking fish TJ! We were getting some really cold weather there for a while, and I thought I might be able to try ice fishing, but it will be back in the 50s a lot of next week.

Last edited by SetterGuy; 01/15/17 09:39 AM.

9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Dude, those fish are incredible! Well done, very well done.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Any ice yet, T?


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Made it to 3", then melted off. Fished open water yesterday, supposed to be in fifties this week, no below freezing temps for several days. Crazy warm January.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Tell me you lived on the ice when you hit 3"!!!


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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So, you can't catch them unless you fish for them. A balmy 28 degrees this morning, and the water temp was 49.

First HSB this winter. 3.5# Caught on an articulated BG colored fly.


Typical of CNBG caught this morning. A little over a pound, and caught on a woolly bugger. I'm holding the CNBG this way to show the white tail fin tipping. I think this is a cross mix between my legacy Florida CNBG, and Todd's OTS strain.


6.5# LMB caught on a 9.5"(1.1#) CNBG, who was caught on a woolly bugger. The CNBG fins were caught in the LMB's gills, and it was quite the tussle on a 4 weight fly rod. I got the CNBG out without any visible damage to the LMB's gills.

Last edited by FireIsHot; 02/16/17 11:23 AM.

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Porky fish.......like their "___________"


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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I just put a post-it on my computer to choke you next time I see you. I knew I wouldn't remember, so I thought it prudent to write it down.


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What me worry?



Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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I've got nothing for that.

I guess I'll see you in Ft Worth later this month.


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A female northern BG, good one for our ponds at 11 inches and a pound and a quarter.



"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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What a beauty!

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Sweet Tony! Sure hope mine get there someday.


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It's all relative to one's goals.

An 11" LMB, 8.5 ozs for a Wr of 77%



A 9.5" HBG from the same pond, 17 ozs for a Wr of 143%. Wonder what it might've looked like if it wasn't blind in one eye?



Sacrificing the LMB to give the edge to the HBG.


I went fishing today. It was good for me.

Last edited by sprkplug; 03/05/17 04:28 PM.

"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Great example Tony and nice looking HBG. I have both BG and HBG in my pond and use the same BG Wr chart for both. Is there an HBG specific chart?

Last edited by Bill D.; 03/05/17 06:38 PM. Reason: Typo

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Unfortunately no, Bill. There was talk of creating one a few years back, I was involved in the effort, but I didn't make a very good showing of it at all.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Well done T - pretty impressive body condition considering you're just coming out of Winter. LMB doing their job!


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Al I missed your fish - awesome! Congrats on the HSB too!


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Sunil coming to Fort Worth? have the authorities been notified?


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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The spawn in East Texas is on. Two questions: The fishing was slow one day, then the air temperature climbed and the sun came out in the afternoon. After that, the LMB were hitting aggressively, all of them pretty good size. Are the LMB that sensitive to environmental changes that are not necessarily water temp. related?
Also, two years ago I coorected a pretty bad pH problem in this lake. Prior to that, the LMB that we caught were not this big or thick. Do corrections in chemistry work that quickly?

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The next three pics are from laxbro:




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Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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Not sure what happened to the pics from laxbro.

They were in my three posts above.

Nice YP, Shortay!!!


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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Beauty Shorty. Looks like she is ready to pop!


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Posting these for DD1. He'll tell the tale.




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Nice hybs!


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Josh is a young man(18 YOA) who hunts and fishes continually and is good at both. He, my Grandson Trevor, and a couple of girls went to my place last week for a day of fishing, shooting and 4 wheeling. This was caught using Stubby Steves for bait.

The fish came either last year or the year before from Allen Hall. When we finally got rain, he brought about 125 CNBG's from his ponds in East Texas. Some of those fish went 8 inches or so. This one looks to be pushing 2 pounds so have done well. I'm feeding Optimal but am nowhere close to heavily feeding. In a 1.5 acre pond, I generally feed about 5 seconds per day. However, over the winter I don't feed and just started again about a month ago.

I tried some Stubby Steves yesterday and caught a lot more bluegills than usual. And, none swallowed the hook. A couple that I got yesterday would have pushed 11 to 12 inches. Those Stubbies have been in my refrigerator for about 5 years. I had forgotten about them but the guys found them. I need to order some more.

Al, thanks for the fish.

Last edited by Dave Davidson1; 03/26/17 08:06 AM.

It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Nice fish !!! Looks like you're doing something right DD1

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Dave, are you saying that the fish in the first photo isn't a HBG?


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Nice Panfish


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Nope Tony; CNBG


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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That is so weird to me, Dave. The size of the mouth, the pronounced hump/ledge on the chest, (below the index and middle fingers), the traces of blue striations on the cheeks, and the completely yellow pelvic fins all shout hybrid to me. Actually, the only thing missing is the subdued overall coloration, and I put that down to the murky water in the photos. No GSF in that pond?

I guess I will never grasp the entire copper nose identification thing.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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CNBG - look like George's offspring to me.
















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Ewest, you don't find the mouth too large, even for a 2 lb gill? And the all yellow pelvics?

I've never even seen a live CNBG, so I have zero experience with them. But I do have access to a vast CNBG library. I will look at gape, and fin coloration, maybe educate myself a little better.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Now, after looking at the photo again, I think the overall body shape favors a hybrid. George's CNBG tended to display the classic, round pie plate traits. This fish has the longer, stockier look.

Dave, your photos have totally freaked me out. Something isn't right in my HBG universe.

Last edited by sprkplug; 03/26/17 10:07 AM.

"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Tony, I have no hybrids other than a very small # of GSF in this pond. I essentially had to start over a couple of years ago after a 5 year drought. 1.5 acres became a 1/4 acre mud hole with some small bass and some BG(probably a couple of GSF). Then the floods came and it filled. I restocked with about 500 small 2 or 3inch BG, 5 pounds of fatheads and a dozen 4 inch HSB. I have never stocked an actual HBG in it. Alan brought some of his mature CNBG girls and boys. The pedigree on that fish would probably be George to Overton to Allen to me. No fish of that size or color were in my pond until Al dumped them in.

I figure Josh's hand is about my size, maybe a little shorter. My hand measures 8 inches from the wrist to fingertips. I'm guesstimating that fish at approximately 15 or so inches and possibly 2 pounds. Biggest I've ever seen and I did nothing special or even talented for it to happen.

I went there yesterday to check on things and fish a little. I caught 4 awfully big yellowish bluegills, actually CNBG, but they weren't as big as that. Actually, other than a monster Green Sunfish, I doubt that I've ever had a 9 inch BG of any kind in it.

Last edited by Dave Davidson1; 03/26/17 10:38 AM.

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Very Nice bg , I would have guessed HBG...either way nice bg.


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Not from my pond, thank goodness! But thought some might be interested. These photos were taken this week on the James River in Richmond VA. My dad went out with a friend, shown in photo's, to try for shad and stripers. Both running to spawn now. They caught this shad with a lamprey attached.




I fished the James for many years, and my dad even longer. Never seen an eel attached to any fish caught in the James like this. Very glad I don't have to worry about this in my little pond!

Last edited by CMM; 03/26/17 12:45 PM. Reason: I posted the same picture twice.

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Me either. I never seen anything like that.



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And did you see the size of the shad! Can't wait to get out there in a couple of weeks and see if they are still running. I am really hoping for a nice striper or two on the fly rod! Maybe all the eels will be gone by then. I'm not really squeamish, but, YUCK.


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Yes I did. I don't think I've ever caught one. I fish mostly for Crappie and Sunfish. Although I have caught a few Bass, and catfish on occasion



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Don't know if you get a shad run in central tx farmallsc. They are ocean fish up in th rivers to spawn, then back to the salt. Fun on flyrod! Cmm


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Originally Posted By: CMM
Don't know if you get a shad run in central tx farmallsc. They are ocean fish up in th rivers to spawn, then back to the salt. Fun on flyrod! Cmm



I bet they would be fun on the fly. I haven't done salt water fishing as much as I would like. I did go to Alaska several years ago and went down to Valdez for halibut. Very fun, but expensive. It was a once in a lifetime and I really enjoyed being up there.



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I'm throwing in the towel...I have been unable to find any pics of a CNBG with that pelvic fin coloration and large mouth gape. I have questions, but irregardless that is an awesome sunfish!!


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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I thought it appeared to have some GSF genetics too...but I am pretty unfamiliar with CNBG way up here.


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+ 1 on the green sunfish cross ,my CNBG don't have that large of mouth

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Pat, The big GSF cross I caught earlier in the year had the distinctive green spots on the jaw. And none of them have had any yellow coloration.

I actually caught 4 or 5 big CNBG's yesterday(credit the Stubby Steves)while tossing feed. All had the yellow colors that Al added to my pond.

Until the last week I've done very little fishing and then with small lures.

The Stubby Steves have really impressed me. I'm about through with night crawlers and fiberglass lures.

EDITING AND ADDING: Being a card carrying, certified, member of the GSF Fan Club, I would love to see some GSF or HBG in these fish. But there are too many nice ones with the distinctive yellow coloration. And, none of the regular bluegills have any sign of crossing.

Last edited by Dave Davidson1; 03/26/17 07:56 PM.

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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
I'm throwing in the towel...I have been unable to find any pics of a CNBG with that pelvic fin coloration and large mouth gape. I have questions, but irregardless that is an awesome sunfish!!


Were you looking in the mirror when you threw in 'the towel?'


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"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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Dave, does the mouth gape appear large for a BG to you? I seem to remember someone here on the forum talking about gape on BG, but I can't find it. And that yellow pelvic fin.....I've seen CNBG with the light border, but the entire fin that bright yellow?

I completely acknowledge your GSF expertise, as well as the fact that you know your pond and I don't. AND, you know CNBG and I don't. I mean no disrespect, nor do I want to dispute what you're saying. But if I had seen that first photo without any info, I would've marked it hybrid in an instant.

You say the raw ingredients for hybrid gills, (BG and GSF), were already in the pond? Any chance the drought shrunk the spawning areas, leading to natural hybridization, followed by concentrating the forage to promote quick growth for the remaining larger fish?

That mouth gape...wow! I would love to see more pics of these fish, as whatever their pedigree they are amazing.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Originally Posted By: Sunil
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
I'm throwing in the towel...I have been unable to find any pics of a CNBG with that pelvic fin coloration and large mouth gape. I have questions, but irregardless that is an awesome sunfish!!


Were you looking in the mirror when you threw in 'the towel?'


Be nice Sunil, I broke 4 inches off the tip of my go to St Croix this afternoon and I'm in mourning. cry


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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I'm just kidding, but it seems like you were the one who was questioning the breakdown of the fish, so there was no 'other' party to throw the towel at...


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CNBG very often have orange to yellow fins/tail and or white/light fin/tail edges. The mouth is big but that could be accounted for by how it is held or local adaptation. That looks just like one of George's fish from muddy water. I enlarged the pic and it has the typical scale pattern of CNBG on its nose area (where the copper band is). Also as best I can tell it has the correct number of fin rays.

Last edited by ewest; 03/26/17 10:30 PM.















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Tony, my condolences. Last year I bought a fly fishing combo from Cabelas; about $100.00. When I got home I put the 2 pieces together and promptly broke the tip off. It's still sitting in the corner of my garage. I need to toss it but...

One point of possible interest is that none of the smaller, 6 to 7 inch, fish I caught show the yellowish coloration.

I'm going to see if I can catch some more of those big yellow guys/girls and will post another pic. About time that I learned how to post pics anyway. Stay tuned.

My goal has always been to return fish to the water ASAP. Eating them would be like cannibalizing one of the Grandkids.

Last edited by Dave Davidson1; 03/27/17 04:13 AM.

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I'm with you on not eating our project fish. I often get asked whether I ate the fish in the photo, and the answer is almost always no. Some people look at their fish as an investment, and as such they're looking for a return on that investment, by way of a mount for the wall or supper for the table. I see that, but my return is the satisfaction I get from watching them grow.

If they die of old age without becoming a filet for the plate, I'm perfectly Ok with that.

Ewest, I would love to study additional photos of CNBG with all yellow pelvics, can you post some photos? I've seen the tipped/bordered fins, but the solid color is new to me.

If we allow the large gape being due to local adaptation, then both Al's and George's fish should display the same trait, correct? I'm sure the adaptation requires more than one generation to manifest itself?

Yeah Dave, breaking the rod just plain sucked. But, it was my own fault. I was fishing an area with an excessive amount of topographical challenges! grin


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Originally Posted By: sprkplug

Be nice Sunil, I broke 4 inches off the tip of my go to St Croix this afternoon and I'm in mourning. cry


I hate it when that happens! If only 4 inches, I would just clean up the break and put a new tip on it. You can buy kits complete with a little tube of glue. I broke the tip off my favorite rod about 40 years ago and it's still one of my favorites today.


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For what it’s worth, I'm with Spark on this fish being held by Josh. That fish he is holding has hybrid genetics. This is why. First go look at some CNBG pictures and look closely at the gill flap. It is ALWAYS pure all black clear to the margin, all along the back border. All pure strain BG always, repeat always, have the gill flap complete black – no noticeable light or colored margin.
http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=92482#Post92482

Now go look at HBG pictures in the Archives. The HBG especially those with green sunfish genes always have a boarder on the back edge of the gill flap. This gill flap boarder of coloration comes from the GSF gene pool. Also go look at the gill flaps of the hybrid BG & female bluegill posted by Spark also on pg2. BG has all black flap, hybrid - a border on the flap.
http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=256325#Post256325

Now go look very carefully at the gill flap on the fish held by Josh (pg2 of this thread). I clearly see a distinct boarder or margin on the back margin of the black part of the gill flap. CNBG never have this distinct boarder around the gill flap. Actually for the fish in the picture, the distinct boarder surrounds the entire gill flap. The margin is quite evident, but a very light color due to the light hue of the fish living in turbid water. The fish held by Josh could be a CNBG X GSF cross. Regardless of where the fish came from, it has hybrid characteristics due to the unmistakable gill (opercle) flap evidence. The light coloration makes the identification more difficult if one uses coloration as evidence.

Now if you don't believe me go read the technical scientific descriptions of green sunfish and bluegill. Bluegill: opercle membrane is black as opercle spot(Troutman), other source: ear flap black to the edge (Becker); other source: opercular flap entire black edge(Ross).
Green sunfish: "opercular flap with black center and with a broad light colored margin"(Becker)... other source: ear flap is black with a white or yellowish margin(Ross).

Last edited by Bill Cody; 03/27/17 06:36 PM.

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Got a little vacation time last week and got to hit the pond. Only caught a couple HBG but they have grown well and seem to be in really good shape. The larger ones are around 8" now. Gotta throw a thank you to teehjaeh for the phone time and help setting this pond up as well as all the other PB members who indirectly help everyday.

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When I can, and I hope soon, I'm going back up there and catch some more to get good pictures. Can't go today and storms are coming the next couple of days. The others that I caught were also very large but not as big as this one. And, they all had the yellow coloration. OTOH, none of the smaller 5 to 8 inch fish had that coloration.

I'm saying CNBG because it exhibits the traits that Georges fish had that Todd got and bred.

Of course, that might not prove this ones genetics.


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Last edited by ewest; 03/27/17 12:02 PM.















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Originally Posted By: Sunil
I'm just kidding, but it seems like you were the one who was questioning the breakdown of the fish, so there was no 'other' party to throw the towel at...


It was me admitting defeat at not being able to find any more pics of CNBG with all yellow pelvics....


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Eric's picture of the maleCNBG makes my point that the gill flap of CNBG are completely black with no boarder. Coloration of a fish is a weak identification characteristic.


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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
Originally Posted By: sprkplug

Be nice Sunil, I broke 4 inches off the tip of my go to St Croix this afternoon and I'm in mourning. cry


I hate it when that happens! If only 4 inches, I would just clean up the break and put a new tip on it. You can buy kits complete with a little tube of glue. I broke the tip off my favorite rod about 40 years ago and it's still one of my favorites today.


I sent mine back to Sage when it broke (I won't go into details, but no children were harmed) it's as good as new.. I feel for you.


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It's under warranty, but dang it I broke it. It wasn't St Croix's problem, and I don't feel right asking them to take care of it. I'll stand the replacement on my dime, and try to be more careful next time.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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I mentioned repairing a broken rod tip in an earlier post. FWIW for anybody that wants to repair one, this is what I did so many years ago....Rod Tip repair Kit. More expensive are available.

https://www.fishusa.com/product/Berkley-...P5EthoCKMTw_wcB

Last edited by Bill D.; 03/27/17 09:24 PM.

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Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
Eric's picture of the maleCNBG makes my point that the gill flap of CNBG are completely black with no boarder. Coloration of a fish is a weak identification characteristic.


I've avoided commenting on the fish pedigree because I think both sides make good points. Plus people a lot smarter than me and having seen a lot more fish that I ever have already seem to disagree, so any opinion I have would only cloud things more.

But that never stopped me before. smirk

One thing bothers me about it being a hybrid. Any of my hybrids show much more pronounced GSF characteristics. Caught about a dozen RES/GSF hybrids out of my forage pond tonight. So if this is a HCNBG, are the very mild GSF characteristics because of just the natural variability of hybrid characteristic expression? Or could it perhaps be the result of a HBG female pairing up with a CNBG male giving only 25% GSF influence?


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Bill that is a pic from Bruce and was only posted to show yellow fins as requested not ear tab.
















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I tend to classify BG x GSF hybrids as being either BG dominant, or GSF dominant. Meaning they favor one heritage more than the other. I have both here in our pond, and one of the most telling characteristics for me is the body dynamic. Does it favor the classic big bluegill, round pie plate shape, or is it the stockier, heavy body commonly associated with GSF?

Look at the fish in the photo ewest posted, and notice the shape. Round. Then look at Dave's fish...more blocky. Add the yellow pelvics, huge mouth, opercular marking, (which I hadn't noticed, thanks Bill), and it just points to some GSF in there, to me anyway.

I'll go out on a limb and toss out the notion that the fish is not one of Al's, but a naturally occurring hybrid. Hatched into that pond a few years ago, reaped the benefits of the drought compressing his food supply into easily gulpable quantities.

Maybe the unusual appearance is due to being an f2 or later, and/or backcrossing with a BG. I don't know, just thinking out loud.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Interesting turn. Let me check my records, and I can at least confirm the dates and the chain of custody of the CNBG I took to Dave's.

I'm no help on the pic, and far better minds than mine are already on it. Anything I added would be speculation anyway.


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So Dave had a drought, and we wanted to help get him restarted once his pond filled back up. The CNBG I took to Dave were directly stocked in the brood pond on 03-11-2013 by Overton's Fisheries. I assume they were from a late 2012 spawn, and the brood pond was drained and seined prior to their stocking.

We set up a cage, and the CNBG were being pulled by hook and line, and each and every CNBG that went into that cage was visually inspected while in hand. The CNBG that weren't selected, went directly into the big pond.

On 06-19-15, we seined the pond and hand selected the biggest and most colorful CNBG to go in the cage. The CNBG hit Dave's pond on 06-20-2015. Most of the males were +-8", and the females were +-7". We selected larger fish because we wanted them spawning immediately, and survive any possible predation. Best I could tell, the mix was 40/60% male to female. The male to female ratio was a little skewed, but we did that to get more numbers of larger catchable (read recreational) males. That should presently put those fish at around 4 1/2 yo.

Not sure if anybody else has, but I've been to both George's and Dave's ponds, and the body coloration I'm seeing in the posted picture is very reminiscent of George's fish. Regardless of the lineage, that's just a beautiful fish.

As a side note, I've started seeing multiple CNBG with red tails, and fin tipping. We've never seen those here before, and I only found one picture of a red tailed CNBG, and that was from an Overton's picture dated 2007. Nothing surprises me anymore when dealing with CNBG.


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Al, do you see the all yellow pecs on your fish, in addition to the tipping?

By the way, what is your current pond record? They must be brutes by now!! Have you broke two pounds yet? If not, you are surely right there!


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Since I doubt that I'll ever catch that specific fish, everything is speculation on my part. I'm really going by the pics I saw of Georges fish that went to Overton and then to Al. And, I caught 4 or 5 other very large, 1+ pound, yellowish, fish that had never been in my pond prior to Al seeding my pond with bigger fish to jump start after the drought ended. I didn't look them over but, as usual, immediately returned them to the water.

Other than the physical characteristic noted by Bill and Tony, I'm realizing that the smaller fish, 5 to 8 inch, I caught had no yellowish coloration. That may speak to the lesser spawning of something other than BG. I mentioned a huge, probably 12+ inch, GSF that I caught last year. Other than the huge mouth and green spots by the mouth, it looked like a BG and had no yellow coloration. So, I have to believe that these fish came from Al.

Note: I have never even considered the fin count because I haven't purposely stocked a HBG in the last 20 years.


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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Al, do you see the all yellow pecs on your fish, in addition to the tipping?

By the way, what is your current pond record? They must be brutes by now!! Have you broke two pounds yet? If not, you are surely right there!

Tony I looked, and I had one pic of a smaller CNBG that may have yellow pectoral fins, but the fins were collapsed, so no help there.

I haven't broken 2# yet, but like you, I think there's one in there. Too many, too close, not to be. I have to admit recreational CNBG fishing has been very limited over the last 2 years. I've been concentrating on small CNBG, not large. The things we do for a healthy LMB pond.


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I have seen ,but no findable pics, of every conceivable yellow and or orange (some orange almost red)fin/tail combinations on CNBG. If I find pics I will post some.
















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fishing down by Marco Island, FL.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Very Nice ! Specked Trout


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I really enjoy spec and red fishing. Spec's are great eating, so are reds but I prefer the spec's. Nice spec!


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So, I was on my way home from a fun weekend, and I saw a Dodge truck parked on the side of the road. My first inclination is to always avoid rock haulers and Dodge trucks, but I decided to see if the guy wanted to fish. I'm not sure where he was from because he talked funny. Maybe Canada or somewhere like that.

Most of the 10"s were 1# to 1.1#.


We caught a ton of this size today. Pre-frontal conditions.

Here's a better look.



10 3/4", and 1#11oz



A HSB volunteered too.




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nice al!


Fishing has never been about the fish....

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Originally Posted By: beastman
Very Nice ! Specked Trout
Originally Posted By: TGW1
I really enjoy spec and red fishing. Spec's are great eating, so are reds but I prefer the spec's. Nice spec!


Thanks! Couldn't catch a snook or triple tail to save our lives, but the trout were hitting.


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Outstanding fish Al! Your fishing partner has a shifty look about him, might bear watching closely.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Beautiful fish, Al!

That foreigner showed up in my driveway too! And regarding the Dodge truck, did he use the excuse it's a rental? smile

And "pre-frontal" meaning he DID in-fact bring the rains along with him?

(all in fun, Scott, all in fun smile ).


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I was told that there were 2# CNBG in the pond. Just like most fishermen, I think that was a tall tale.......

Still haven't seen one yet, but there WAS one that was 1 1/2 pounds... Beautiful markings on the CNBG, and no two were alike. I think Al should start a thread on the different color varieties of them, with good close up pictures.

Guess I'll have to wait until October to get one to push the 32 ounce mark. Then it's coming home with me to take a visit to Cecil's.

Just shy of 2800 miles in 6 days. Better to put it on the rental than on mine!! Unlimited mileage, so that was a no brainer. The October trip will be well into the 3,000 mile range by the time I'm done.

You Okies better get the roads fixed before the next trip, the drive down 35 South of Oklahoma City was brutal.....

p.s. The Dodge gets better mileage than the chebby or the ford.......... AND the controls inside the cab are more user friendly.....

On the way back I had a nice chat with the Alabama State Police about 75 miles before Lonoke, AR. No ticket and not even a warning, it seems that going slower than the speed limit also is a reason for them to look at you harder...... BUT, after a 15 minute conversation about ponds I might be going back down there for a consultation. Seems the first Officer is about to buy a house with a pond and needs advice. When the 3rd State Police car with flashing lights pulled up, the two that I were talking to said "Oh Sh.., that's the Supervisor, we gotta go!" LOL

Thanks guys for the hospitality!! I'll have some pictures to put up this evening.


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Scott, did the cops notice your shooting irons?


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

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Scott and I did catch a few. It was fun to get some recreational fishing in, as opposed to management fishing.

Here's my favorite pic of the day. This photo has not been retouched, and it shows a CNBG that was kept wet, and was never touched or contacted by anything hot or dry.


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Wow, what a beast of a fish!


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Tony, I wish you could have been here for a CNBG day. We hit it on a day that the moon was right, the water temp was right, spawning cycle CNBG colorations, and pre-frontal weather.

We should have taken more pictures, but it's hard to do when you're just having a fun day of fishing with a friend.


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Originally Posted By: Dave Davidson1
Scott, did the cops notice your shooting irons?


Dave, the first officer asked to see the rental agreement and I said to him. "It is in the console. Before I open it up, I have my loaded 9mm CC pistol in there. What do you want me to do? " He said "Not a problem, go ahead and get it out." The long guns had so much stuff piled on top they couldn't see the cases.

I think it's all in how you talk to the officer and how "at ease" you make him feel. Initially as he walked around to the passenger side of the vehicle I had rolled down both of the windows on that side so he could easily see into both the front and back of the passenger compartment of the truck.


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Al, I couldn't believe the color variations on the individual fish. I really think you should start a thread showing the different color variations. What was interesting to me is how fast the colors would change, just like a Mahi-Mahi caught from the ocean. When they are pulled out of the water they are lit up, and 3 minutes later they are a drab color.



vs



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Spawning male CNBG - look like George's offspring to me !
















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Originally Posted By: ewest
Spawning male CNBG - look like George's offspring to me !


Or do Georges CNBG look like Overtons CNBG? That's where Al sourced some of his.


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No George and Overton collaborated with George selecting certain quality CNBG from his ponds and Overton doing the same to come up with OTT CNBG. There is a thread on the subject. All of those are George's offspring.
















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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Outstanding fish Al! Your fishing partner has a shifty look about him, might bear watching closely.


A wise man once told me to never trust a man with a beard and no hair on his upper lip, but this character is also of concern.....you know....that kind of Van Dyke facial hair. He's hiding something.....


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"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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The elusive female HBG. 11 inches, and 1.5 lbs. VERY gravid, returned to pond. Been awhile since I caught one of these.



"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Very nice! cool



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Great fish Tony


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

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Wow , great CNBG and HBG photo's.
Sprkplug- I have just stocked some HBG 4-6 and 6-8", given mixed species in the pond what type of average growth do you suspect feeding optimal bass/zeigler feed? What type of feed do you use now?

I am thinking of buying the Optimal BG feed as well to mix.
Not looking for trophies but some close to a 1 lb would be nice.


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I think one pound is easily achievable, given the right conditions. In my opinion you should have some fish at, or just below a pound by fall. I am feeding optimal and I'm extremely happy with what I see. I started with aquamax, and experienced good growth with it also.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Yo T, outstanding! Well done, she's a beauty!


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Tony, she looks like a football with eyes. Very nice HBG!!


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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
The elusive female HBG. 11 inches, and 1.5 lbs. VERY gravid, returned to pond. Been awhile since I caught one of these.

Spark that wasn't caught in Indiana i suppose, right?

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Why yes, yes it was!


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Sprk are you certain it is female ? If so I want to add it to the HBG thread. We only have 1 pic confirmed of a female HBG.

Sprk's HBG copied from above.
















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Yep, she was a she. Ewest, there are a couple photos in the HBG thread showing I think, 8 HBG females together on a board. All went under the knife that day, and all had unripe eggs. There should be a photo closeup there too.

here it is:

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=22297&Number=282644#Post282644


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Why yes, yes it was!


I had no idea northern or hybrid Bgs could get so large.

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Oh yeah. My personal opinion is that coppernose offer no advantage over northern BG where ultimate size potential is concerned. I have no direct experience with coppers, just info I have gathered while researching.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Reading through some archives, I guess once thought or maybe it was the way hybrids were made through the hatchery that most would top out at 3/4-1lb. It now seems reasonable to get that 1-1.5lb HBG with good management. 1.75lb + even at the top end...and growth is pretty rapid . I am enjoying feeding mine ...very aggressive .


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Each of (CNBG and BG) will do best in its preferred environment. The main factor to consider is location (temp profile).
















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Originally Posted By: beastman
Reading through some archives, I guess once thought or maybe it was the way hybrids were made through the hatchery that most would top out at 3/4-1lb. It now seems reasonable to get that 1-1.5lb HBG with good management. 1.75lb + even at the top end...and growth is pretty rapid . I am enjoying feeding mine ...very aggressive .


Sprkplug is getting very close to the 2# mark. He posted a picture of a really nice HBG of his in the last month or so. Maybe he will link to it or post it again.


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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Oh yeah. My personal opinion is that coppernose offer no advantage over northern BG where ultimate size potential is concerned. I have no direct experience with coppers, just info I have gathered while researching.
I was so disappointed to read "Florida bass won't get larger than the Northern, in colder climates. It's all about the length of the feeding season". And now you are disappointing me the second time.

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Fla LMB and CNBG evolved together in peninsular Florida at a time when it was cut off from the mainland US by high sea levels. Both are in the same family (Centrarchidae) and genetically related. No surprise they show similar traits with respect to cold tolerance.

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=34231&Number=449213#Post449213

Last edited by ewest; 04/20/17 10:49 AM.















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My new record BGxRES:



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Outstanding!!


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Very nice Theo! cool



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Good grief. What are u feeding them? How much?


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

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Wow...that's amazing. Well done!

Is that a true F1 hybrid? Looks like it...and yes, we need details on the feeding program, please!


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DD:

I feed Aquamax 600 & 500, about a 9:1 ratio. Usually 8-10 cups a day (it's a half acre pond), up to 6 days a week (2-3 days a week so far this Spring).

TJ:

It could be an F1, but based on the typical appearance of my "have to be" F1's over the last 10 years, I think it is more likely some indeterminate Fx (or possibly an F1 backcross with a RES).


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Still slinging the Aquamax? I'm glad to hear it's helping yield these results.


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Not pond related but had to share.

My in-laws, my parents, and my wife and I went down to Cabo San Lucas a few weeks ago. My dad and I went out fishing one day and caught these two 30-40 lb. Yellowfin Tuna. Had a blast and can't wait to go again.







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What fun. And great memories. I love fishing with my dad.


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Looks like a blast. Tell Randall that I said howdy.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

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I don't know what's better, the fish or them WHITE legs!!! haha


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Nice work T !!!! Condition on that beast is outstanding.
















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Theo - I'm glad to see you can raise fish as good as your cattle. Very impressive.
Chris - Those are some nice Tuna. Have you ever caught anything that strong before? It was probably like hooking your line onto a lawn tractor.

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Originally Posted By: wbuffetjr
I don't know what's better, the fish or them WHITE legs!!! haha


Haha. They aren't that bad in person. Half white and half freckles. grin

Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
Chris - Those are some nice Tuna. Have you ever caught anything that strong before? It was probably like hooking your line onto a lawn tractor.


It is the biggest thing I have caught. Took about 10-15 minutes to get it in. Can't imagine trying to catch one that's 100+ lbs.

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Beautiful fish, Chris. Did you eat them? If so, how were they?


7ac 2015 CNBG RES FHM 2016 TP FLMB 2017 NLMB GSH L 2018 TP & 70 HSB PK 2019 TP RBT 2020 TFS TP 25 HSB 250 F1,L,RBT -206 2021 TFS TP GSH L,-312 2022 GSH TP CR TFS RBT -234, 2023 BG TP TFS NLMB, -160




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It is the big salty pond Chris.

Great catches. Worth some bucks at the fish market.


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Yeah I brought back 28 lbs. of fillets. It was very easy to bring it back.

So far I've only ate it raw but I think this next week I'm going to do some seared tuna steaks.

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28# of pure bliss!! Well done! Great raw or lightly seared! Mmmm

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Very nice Chris.


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I keep trying to see if I can get something different but I cant get away from the pond snook. They do seem to be getting bigger though.


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Dang, that's neat.


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My daughter broke the 2 pound barrier yesterday! It's a 11 3/4", 2 lbs 1/2 oz BGxRES. (I sure hope you all have the Photobucket fix.)



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YES!!!!

VERY nice fish!


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Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
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Theo - Your fish growing talents are superb. Very nice hybrid. What did she use to tempt it to take her bait? Any idea how old it is?

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Very nice Theo!



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Nice Theo! Absolutely amazing.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Was there a technique, plan, methodology or?


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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We were using really, really old, pulled-apart-after-being-stuck-together Stubby Steve's pellets on a number 6 (or maybe 8 ???) circle hook, chummed with Aquamax pellets they way my adopted Grandpappy (George Glazener) taught me.

Bill:
IMHO that is NOT an F1 hybrid, therefore I judge the earliest it might have hatched was 2010. And I think it has to be at least 5 years old. So, 5 to 7 years ???

DD:
Results are due to really, really good genes. It worked for the fish, too.


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Wow!!!


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HOG!!!


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

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