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#448020 - 05/23/16 10:33 PM Re: Observations from Mutt Pond [Re: snrub]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Originally Posted By: snrub
Second best. At least when said in front of Nattha. grin


LOL! Definitely! She knows Thai kick boxing.......
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#449240 - 06/08/16 10:38 PM Re: Harvest Time [Re: Bill D.]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Originally Posted By: Bill D.
a 8 1/4 inch HBG (Thanks for the ID help Cecil). I really like the white fins and fin tips. This one was returned to the pond.





This guy is still in the pond...Maybe he is much blacker??

I have a black velvet SF with a bright blue chin patch that comes every night at feeding time. You can spot him anywhere in the pond. All the other SF are "normal color." Tried to get a pic tonight but he was a bit far from shore. I will post one soon as I get one.

Anybody else have a coal black sunfish?


Edited by Bill D. (06/15/16 10:10 PM)
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#449809 - 06/15/16 09:46 PM Black Sunfish [Re: Bill D.]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois

Well I’m still trying to get a decent picture but the water visibility is not cooperating. Here are a couple of terrible shots of Blackie. I think it's an HBG. Comes every night and the color never changes; velvet black with aquamarine chin. It is not aggressive at all and lazily drifts up and takes pellets. Anybody got something similar? He is like the exact opposite of an albino but you can see, even in these terrible pics, his eyes almost glow.







Edited by Bill D. (06/15/16 10:09 PM)
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#449813 - 06/15/16 10:53 PM Re: Black Sunfish [Re: Bill D.]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4228
Loc: SE Kansas
I had a BG, probably about 4-5", that was black on the back half of its body. The front half looked normal like the other fish. But the back half had a pigment problem and was very dark like your fish.

I eventually quit seeing it. It either became normal or got eaten by a LMB.
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#450316 - 06/22/16 05:48 PM Re: Spring stocking plan. Improving the food chain [Re: Bill Cody]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
You have quite a few predators (SMB,LMB,WE,CC, & YP) for placing only 250 papershells in your pond. I catch YP with adult papershell in them. Every small fish in your pond will eat crayfish less than 1" long. IMO Survival will be dependent on how much cover you have available and how many you stock. For an existing pond with those predators capable of reproducing, I would have stocked closer to 2500 not 250. I stocked 300 PSC in a 1/3 acre minnow only pond and had good reproduction and recruitment. If you are really interested in providing crayfish as a constant forage food try growing them in a small 0.1 ac pond or pool with minnows as polyculture. Then transfer the surplus.

For readers here is a link to the page with some of BillD's shoreline see: West Waterway 1.jpg
http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=443300&page=6

Your rock lined shoreline with large concrete pieces may be enough cover for the crayfish to maintain broodstock, although with those crayfish loving predators (bass &CC) I would not expect numerous crayfish to always be present to serve as a good food source. With reproducing bass present it is very difficult to maintain minnows and small forage foods without a weedy pond. I think your predator types will eat crayfish more readily than small fish depending on abundance and encounter rate.


Update…

The papershells arrived in good condition a week or so ago and all were approximately 2 inches long. I stocked them into the rip-rap and concrete slabs around the pond shoreline. They made themselves right at home. I also stocked 1 into each of my aquariums as well. The first night every plant in all 3 aquariums got uprooted and was floating the next morning. Needless to say, I relocated the ones from the aquariums to the pond!




Edited by Bill D. (06/22/16 05:49 PM)
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#450397 - 06/23/16 11:24 AM Re: Spring stocking plan. Improving the food chain [Re: Bill D.]
TGW1 Offline


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2009
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
Bill, I did my first stocking of crawfish last year and they denuded the western shoreline with the exception of Blue flag and Louisiana iris. Everything else was removed by the craws. They loved the pondweed lol

Tracy
_________________________
Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.
Thank The Good Lord the government in Washington DC gets little done.
Outlawing guns will make a lot of us down here in the South
Outlaws and proud of it

Tracy

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#450414 - 06/23/16 02:39 PM Re: Spring stocking plan. Improving the food chain [Re: Bill D.]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4228
Loc: SE Kansas
"The first night every plant in all 3 aquariums got uprooted and was floating the next morning. Needless to say, I relocated the ones from the aquariums to the pond!"
laugh

Years ago the wife, kids and I caught various creek critters to put in an aquarium. Wife went to lots of trouble to plant some different plants into the bottom. The craws did exactly what you said. They commenced to digging out and eating every plant and rearranging the aquarium to suit their wants instead of my wife's wants. Needless to say she was not happy about it.

In another situation, again years ago, wife had a few fancy tail goldfish in a small aquarium. Kids and I caught a few craws and put them in there. Wife noticed the fancy tail goldfish tails were getting shorter and ragged. One day we saw one of the small craws holding on to the tail of a goldfish with one pincer and eating the tail with the small pincers while the goldfish swam frantically around. Wife dispatched the craws. grin Boys and I just thought it was funny. She was not amused.


Edited by snrub (06/23/16 02:41 PM)
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#450419 - 06/23/16 03:30 PM Re: Spring stocking plan. Improving the food chain [Re: snrub]
RRWJ Offline


Registered: 06/19/16
Posts: 38
Loc: Il
Dont crawldads bore holes in a ponds dam and cause leaks?

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#450432 - 06/23/16 05:34 PM Re: Spring stocking plan. Improving the food chain [Re: snrub]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Originally Posted By: snrub
"The first night every plant in all 3 aquariums got uprooted and was floating the next morning. Needless to say, I relocated the ones from the aquariums to the pond!"
laugh

Years ago the wife, kids and I caught various creek critters to put in an aquarium. Wife went to lots of trouble to plant some different plants into the bottom. The craws did exactly what you said. They commenced to digging out and eating every plant and rearranging the aquarium to suit their wants instead of my wife's wants. Needless to say she was not happy about it.

In another situation, again years ago, wife had a few fancy tail goldfish in a small aquarium. Kids and I caught a few craws and put them in there. Wife noticed the fancy tail goldfish tails were getting shorter and ragged. One day we saw one of the small craws holding on to the tail of a goldfish with one pincer and eating the tail with the small pincers while the goldfish swam frantically around. Wife dispatched the craws. grin Boys and I just thought it was funny. She was not amused.


Snrub,

LOL!
Yeah, I had one in an aquarium when I was in college (plastic plants! smile ). The guy would climb up to the top of the plants and jump out trying to catch fish. He ate a lot of my fish. He didn't grab them with a pincher. He wrapped both pinchers around them kind of like a cage.

TGW1,

Vegetation control is one of the goals. I am hoping they at least help control my FA if I can get a good population established.


Edited by Bill D. (06/23/16 05:34 PM)
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#450435 - 06/23/16 05:38 PM Re: Spring stocking plan. Improving the food chain [Re: RRWJ]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Originally Posted By: RRWJ
Dont crawldads bore holes in a ponds dam and cause leaks?


RRWJ,

It depends on the species. Some species burrow and can undercut the shore and damage dams. The papershell crawfish (PSC) I stocked are known for no/minimal borrowing and are considered one of the best species to stock as forage in ponds for that reason.


Edited by Bill D. (06/23/16 05:39 PM)
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You'll never know what ya can catch unless you wet a line!

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#452133 - 07/17/16 10:06 PM Re: Harvest Time [Re: Bill D.]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Just an update...

Part of the charter of Mutt Pond is just a decent place to fish. Somewhere you can go and catch nice sized fish for an occasional fish dinner. No more standing shoulder to shoulder with other guys at the local BOWs catching 6 inch BG(if yer lucky and get the "big" ones) to have a fish fry.

My bride headed to the pond tonight, with a bag containing a couple of chicken livers, mumbling something about catfish for dinner tomorrow night. She came back 20 minutes later with 2 CC pushing 4 pounds.

Gotta love it when the plan works! smile


Edited by Bill D. (07/17/16 10:08 PM)
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#453359 - 08/03/16 09:30 AM Re: Harvest Time [Re: Bill D.]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Another Update.....

Our CC have gotten a little bigger than we like, pushing 4 pounds, so we have been spending a little time harvesting them. Removed 8 this week. We tried night crawlers and chicken liver but had little success. Switched to using 4 to 5 inch shiners and nailed them. I guess my take away from this is that "it depends" on a lot of things as to what bait is going to work for you on any given day when it comes to catching CC. 3 weeks ago, it was chicken liver.

Also tossed a couple minnow traps in last night just to see what I could catch. I was very happy with what I found. Both traps contained lots of 1.5 to 2 inch SF. They were a mixture of BG, HBG and PS. There might have been some pumpkingill (PSXBG) as well as there were what appeared to be a few PS but no orange on the flap. This is the first I have seen of the PS since stocking them at 2 to 3 inches in fall 2014. I have never actively fished for them with a small hook so I may have to give that a try.
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#453384 - 08/03/16 12:13 PM Re: Harvest Time [Re: Bill D.]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4228
Loc: SE Kansas
I might have to give the shiners a try. Grandson and buddies caught twenty some CC one night early summer (I think they were using liver of some sort) but later have not had much luck catching them. I have lots of GSH in my forage pond that are easily trapped so will have to try that.

Those PS sure are pretty fish. Not native to our area or I would like to try some.;
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#453400 - 08/03/16 09:59 PM Re: Harvest Time [Re: Bill D.]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Snrub,

GSH is what we used for the CC. Fished them a couple feet under a cork near bait fish cover like lily pads, brush piles, etc. It was a lot of fun. My bride had them break her line twice. She is still struggling to get the hang of my old Sabre reels (at least 45 years old). The drag is disabled when you are reeling in.

Good Luck!
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You'll never know what ya can catch unless you wet a line!

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#453404 - 08/03/16 10:10 PM Re: Harvest Time [Re: Bill D.]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4228
Loc: SE Kansas
Maybe it is time you break down and buy your bride a new reel before she runs off with some guy with a big fancy Pflueger grin


Edited by snrub (08/03/16 10:11 PM)
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#453405 - 08/03/16 10:17 PM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Sounds like a great idea for an anniversary present next year! grin
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#453410 - 08/03/16 11:09 PM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
snrub Offline


Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 4228
Loc: SE Kansas
Don't wait till your anniversery and surprise her early, but try to not look guilty like you bought her a gift because you did something wrong.

Unsolicited gifts can either bring unexpected benefits or problems, depending on your ability to act like you have done nothing wrong. And we all know that is probably not the case. laugh laugh


Edited by snrub (08/03/16 11:10 PM)
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#453416 - 08/04/16 08:25 AM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
TGW1 Offline


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2009
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
Bill, she must love you a lot, I am surprised she is not using your reels. Snrub is right but I think a better deal is to take her to a local BPShop and let her pick out what she wants. Think of the rewards you might get smile Spend a little, get a little or so I have herd.

Tracy
_________________________
Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.
Thank The Good Lord the government in Washington DC gets little done.
Outlawing guns will make a lot of us down here in the South
Outlaws and proud of it

Tracy

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#453441 - 08/04/16 01:13 PM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
Bob-O Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Lunker

Registered: 01/24/06
Posts: 2252
Loc: Butler In. Very NE corner
Seems like I've always spent a lot and gotten very little. On the other hand, I've got plenty of nothin and nothins plenty for me.
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#453468 - 08/04/16 09:46 PM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Guys I am feeling the pressure! smile

When we went fishing in Thailand our gear was an old plastic bottle with a line wrapped around it, a rusty hook (salt water) and a chunk of squid.

Seriously though, she only likes spin cast reels (closed face). Those old Sabre reels have performed flawlessly for 45+ years. All metal parts except for the button and a small piece in the line pickup mechanism. No part has ever failed. I tried to source a QUALITY new reel for her a few years back and came up empty. I bought a couple but they crapped out after a couple years. The only thing she doesn't like on the old reels is the "direct drive" clutch that disables the drag when you're reeling. IIRC the feature was put in to allow you to horse a fish if he heads for structure where he could get hung up. You need to use a pump and retrieve motion with these reels if you have a decent fish on. If any of you guys know of a high quality spin cast, no direct drive clutch, that can routinely handle a 15+ pound CC, I would really appreciate you letting me know.

Perfect example of the loss of workmanship and quality over the years....
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#453478 - 08/05/16 07:49 AM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
Dave Davidson1 Offline
Moderator
Lunker

Registered: 01/04/06
Posts: 13093
Loc: Hurst & Bowie, Texas
Bill, that reminds me of the old Zebco 33 vs the newer ones.
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Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP

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#453533 - 08/06/16 07:53 AM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
TGW1 Offline


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2009
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
Bill, I agree the new closed face spinning reels are made cheaply and do not last as long as the older models. My wife also fishes with these types and prefers the one with the trigger system that is mounted below the reel casing. There is a few made that should handle the line u want but remember the drag system allows for using low poundage line. Now I am just thinking u can get her a new reel every year for your anniversary smile I will usually get a new one most every year for my lady, it helps to keep me in good graces and I need all the help I can get smile and they are usually less than 30 or 40 bucks. that cheaper than a mink coat

Tracy


Edited by TGW1 (08/06/16 07:58 AM)
_________________________
Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.
Thank The Good Lord the government in Washington DC gets little done.
Outlawing guns will make a lot of us down here in the South
Outlaws and proud of it

Tracy

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#453551 - 08/06/16 08:17 PM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Bill D.]
anthropic Offline


Registered: 05/03/14
Posts: 893
Loc: Louisiana, USA
Tracy, I've found a correlation between expense, number of ball bearings, and quality in such reels. Pflueger makes the best in my experience.

So long as you're patient and there aren't too many obstructions, they can handle bigger fish than you'd expect. I've caught four bass exceeding 9 lbs with 4 lb test on such an ultralight reel.
_________________________
7 acre pond in east Texas, full pool reached March 2016. CNBG, RES, FHM stocked Nov 15; TP May 16; LSL bass 30 June 16.




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#453563 - 08/07/16 08:25 AM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: Dave Davidson1]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Originally Posted By: Dave Davidson1
Bill, that reminds me of the old Zebco 33 vs the newer ones.


Yep!
_________________________

You'll never know what ya can catch unless you wet a line!

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#453564 - 08/07/16 08:30 AM Re: On Mutt Pond [Re: anthropic]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5311
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Originally Posted By: anthropic
Tracy, I've found a correlation between expense, number of ball bearings, and quality in such reels. Pflueger makes the best in my experience.

So long as you're patient and there aren't too many obstructions, they can handle bigger fish than you'd expect. I've caught four bass exceeding 9 lbs with 4 lb test on such an ultralight reel.


Our pond is small and has a couple of brush piles. I think she needs a reel that can handle 8 to 10 lb test so the drag can be set heavier to limit the length run a fish can make. Any specific make/model recommendations?


Edited by Bill D. (08/07/16 08:33 AM)
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