Pond Boss Forums AERATION Systems questions Will this pump work for me?

Will a Gast 0523 1/4hp pump supply enough air for 2 diffusers in 9 feet of water and 3 diffusers in 4-5 feet of water. I would run separate lines to the three in shallow water.

So what your asking is will your pump, pump enough air to run 5 fusers all at the same time? Or are you talking about running the one at 9 feet and then running the one in 4 feet separate? If so then I would say yes it would. If your wanting to do all of them at the same time then I would say I am not sure.....

RC

RC51

I forgot to mention this when we talked and I didn't want to bother you again....so I figured I would ask here.

After we talked, I realized I didn't take into account the island that separates the pond almost in half. also, the shallower part has some ridges that rise to within 1-2 feet of the surface.

I would like to run them all at the same time.

I want to make sure I get the right pump.....as like most of you I don't have money to burn!

Ok here is where someone else may have to chime in. I do not think that pump will adequately work to all those diffusers at that same time even with a gang valve to help control air flow.... I may be wrong I'm just not sure?? Hopefully someone like Esshup or Bill will chime in and let your know for sure?

RC

I think you can operate the 5 disk membrane diffusers with the 0523. I'm operating 6 diffusers with that pump, although in deeper water (11-15ft). Depending on water clarity you may not need to provide full mixing to the diffuser in 4-5ft of water. I question if anoxic conditions occur in most ponds at the bottom zone 4-5ft deep especially if the area gets some wind action. Before I would place diffusers in 4-5 ft of water, I would verify that this area develops significant stratification and anaerobic conditions. Wind action normally mixes most ponds down to 6 ft deep. Exceptions are ponds are wooded areas with little wind action.

Thanks Bill!

I am new to this so how do I verify stratification and anaerobic conditions?

This pond gets a fair to good portion of wind especially in the shallower area.

Bill, esshup, etc
If you or someone else northern IN, OH needs a Gast pump, this one popped up on Craigslist and looks to be in new/mint condition.


Gast pump in S Michigan

LB63 - get yourself an indoor outdoor digital thermometer. You should probably encase the wire to the sensor in silicone caulk or epoxy to make it more water proof. Mark the cord in 6" or 1 ft increments. For 4-5 ft of water, measure the surface to bottom temperature every 6" or every 1 ft. If the surface is more than 5F cooler than the bottom you have thermal stratification. Generally for ponds if the temperature drops more than 1F per 1ft you have pretty strong thermal stratification or layering, and then deepest water (8-20ft) often will not have dissolved oxygen UNLESS the water in that 5ft depth is clear (vis >2-2.5ft). At the top of the thermocline you will see 2-3F decrease in 2 ft. If the sunlight reaches the bottom in 4-5 ft of water, the plants will make oxygen at that depth, thus aeration is not needed because oxygen is on the bottom. Reason for aeration is to put DO on the bottom sediment-surface. Note: my definition for pond stratification is NOT the standard limnology definition of thermocline which is >1 deg C decrease per 1 meter. Some authors have defined the thermocline as the depth at which the temperature changes most rapidly and the thermocline (aka metalimnion) as the entire zone over which the temperature is changing rapidly. Thus the specific definition of thermocline depth is not always the same in every body of water. The thickness of the thermocline is variable from pond to lake. It is somewhat variable and depends on conditions. It is common in ponds for the thermocline layer to extend to the bottom.

For More info read through this thread:
http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=443810

Thanks Bill!

I will locate a thermometer and see what I find out!

Bill,
Went out to pond this morning and here is what I've got.

In the shallow end with muddy water ...visibility less than 1 foot and water about 6" low the temp readings are as follows:

84 at surface
84 at 1 foot
83 at 2 feet
82 at 3 feet
80 at 4 feet
79 at 5 feet

Deep end same water clarity..

84 at surface
84 at 1 foot
83 at 2 feet
83 at 3 feet
79 at 4 feet
73 at 5 feet
70 at 6 feet
69 at 7 feet
66 at bottom

Help please????

Hey, LB, I'm not Bill Cody, but I do have a few observations.

First, it appears that the thermocline is quite pronounced and starts around 3 or 4 feet. If that persists for a long period of time, you may have issues with anoxic water at the bottom.

Second, without diffusion or wave action, this will likely get worse as the water warms. My new pond has a standup pipe that drains from the bottom, for example. After it filled in March, the water coming out seemed perfectly fine. But by late April, as temps moved higher, I noticed a distinct nasty smell. The pond seemed okay, but the bottom layer was obviously no longer so.

I don't have electricity yet, and am working on it so can put in diffusers. But as anyone here will tell you, care must be taken not to overmix the anoxic bottom water too quickly, otherwise a fish kill might ensue. Sadly, the biggest fish are the first to die.

Good luck!

Thanks anthropic! I'm about ready to pull the trigger on a DIY aeration system. Pretty sure I need diffusers in the deep end just not sure about shallow part of pond.

Bill Cody,

What do you think?

Bill,
Went out to pond this morning and here is what I've got.

In the shallow end with muddy water ...visibility less than 1 foot and water about 6" low the temp readings are as follows:

84 at surface
84 at 1 foot
83 at 2 feet
82 at 3 feet
80 at 4 feet
79 at 5 feet

Deep end same water clarity..

84 at surface
84 at 1 foot
83 at 2 feet
83 at 3 feet
79 at 4 feet
73 at 5 feet
70 at 6 feet
69 at 7 feet
66 at bottom

Help please????

_________________________

LB - your temperature measurements to me indicate the shallow end would marginally benefit from some minor or low strength circulation since there is only a 5F difference between surface and 5 ft. At 4 ft the water is mixing pretty good or normally from wind and convection - IMO. Notice at the deep end at 5 ft deep there is clear stratification where the temperature difference is 9F and at 6ft the difference is 14F, indicating a pretty strong thermal stratification. No mixing occurs below 5.5-6ft deep in your pond unless there would be a significant weather event. This indicates the deep part of the pond would benefit most from bottom aeration. Depending on the size and location of the diffusers, this mixing and associated currents could easily expand into the water 3-4 ft deep to keep it more evenly mixed.

Water below 6ft deep at this point in time (May 31), likely has no DO or very little dissolved oxygen (1-3ppm). As the season progresses more oxygen will be lost in all the layer below 5.5-6ft. I guess it has not Do since your water clarity is only 12".

Your bottom temperature of 66F at 8ft deep indicates that your pond stopped mixing top to bottom this spring when the water 'reached' 66F; then DO loss began.

Bill,
That's kinda what I thought based on your last message. So would a surface aerator such as a kasco benefit my shallow end?

LB,

What Bill said right here is most important.

"Depending on the size and location of the diffusers, this mixing and associated currents could easily expand into the water 3-4 ft deep to keep it more evenly mixed."

With that said you may not have to do anything in the shallow end is what he is saying. With the exception of maybe in winter to keep ice off the pond if you get enough ice.

Think about what your diffusers do for a sec. Lets say you have 2 stations and 2 fusers on each station. Well diffusers pull water up from the bottom and push it up to the surface to get more oxygen well I think what Bill is trying to say here is in this pulling or upwelling of water if fusers are in right place in pond it could pull enough water from shallow area also to help mix it enough so you wouldn't have to do anything in the shallow area. Least I think that's what he meant... lol

RC

I am concerned about the island preventing mixing getting to the shallow end. Can't get a pic to load of pond and island....

I think I understand diffusers may not benefit me in the shallow end...however.... could I use them just to move some water hopefully to help with cooling and prevent stagnant looking water?

Yes of course it's not gonna hurt anything at all by putting 1 or 2 fusers in that area... Even if you don't run them all the time just when water looks a little funky? You wont get much benefit D.O. wise but you would get the benefit of your pond mixing some better and not looking like a bowl and pea green soup!!

RC

Actually and this is just me thinking... haha, if that shallow area is not real wide and only 3 to 5 feet and if it was close by the house I would experiment just for fun and pound a pole into the shallow end and setup a trolling motor on the pole with a big ole marine battery and let the trolling motor circulate your shallow water out towards your air diffusers... You would be surprised as how much water a trolling motor can move even set at like 2 or 3 it don't have to be on 5.

At first you would have to charge your battery up every couple days depending on how long you ran the trolling motor but you could eventually think about a solar panel if it works real well and you would want to keep it running. I don't know just me brain storming...

RC

Set a single diffuser in the shallow area to get some low cost water movement in that area. I did not know you had an island involved which is a good reason to not have an island. It blocks water flow/movement.

Thanks guys for all the help. I'm about to order a pump, diffusers, weighted line, and other stuff. Hoping to have things up and running asap. I will have pics if I can get them to load!

But thanks for everything so far.....I'm sure I will have more questions later!

Ok,

Got my Gast 0523 series pump. Made a manifold with ball valves, pressure gauge, etc......

Stupid question.... I see pics of pumps with filters and some without.... Why is that and do I need one?

I know....it all depends.....the pump will be in an enclosed box with ventilation and a fan.

Air intake filters help keep out any crud from going inside the compressor. Just like a car engine, (which is really just a big air pump), air compressors live longer when they are fed clean, dry air, and are housed in a well ventilated and cool environment. Yes, you won't see as much crud as a car engine, but there is still dust and bugs that go inside the cabinet.

Cool in pond aeration is as close to ambient temp as possible. That is why there are fans placed in cabinets to draw in and circulate outside air - to get rid of the warmer air that is inside the cabinets.

Essup,

This filter will go on the "in" port on the pump correct?

LB here is what your looking for.

Yes said filter goes on the intake side to keep anything from getting down in your pump.