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Joined: Mar 2016
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OP
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Hi all This year my LMB have spawned like there's no tomorrow and they're still spawning. I've never seen a reproduction like this one. I have billions of fingerlings everywhere, all well protected by fathers. At the same time I still have not seen any BG (last year the pond shallow areas was full of BG spawning in may. The questions are: - should I do something to decrease the LMB fingerlings number or simply let them be and let nature take its course? - could they overpopulate the pond unbalancing fish population and food chain or they will be simply eaten by bigger LMB? - is it possible that LMB, being more this spring in the 12-15" size, have extinguished BG? I have covers but not on BG spawn beds. Thank you   
Filippo
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Hey Filippo,
I don't have the answer to your question but I do have a question for you while you wait for answers.
Are LMB and BG common in Italy? If not, was it hard to get them to stock in your pond?
![[Linked Image]](http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=11852&filename=I_subscribe_zps2qlyoyn2.gif) Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
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Hey Filippo,
I don't have the answer to your question but I do have a question for you while you wait for answers.
Are LMB and BG common in Italy? If not, was it hard to get them to stock in your pond? Hi Bill, unfortunately LMB can be found in fisheries but no way to find any kind of BG to buy. I can fish some in friends ponds but few and far. I think if LMB are so many to extinguish BG I'd need to stock a truck of BG at one time to hope some will survive....
Last edited by ItalyBASS; 05/08/16 09:09 AM.
Filippo
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Moderator Ambassador Field Correspondent  Lunker
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Moderator Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
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You cannot stock enough BG to feed the LMB. If the BG numbers are down, then you have to start removing LMB at the rate of 30+ pounds per surface acre. If you remove the Males now that are guarding the fry than you will help your pond immensely, as the fry will be eaten easier by other predators.
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I've just learned that those I thought were BG are PS instead.
Here PS (called "persico sole" alias Lepomis gibbosus) is the only kind of Lepomis you can find.
In the USA you have a lot of Lepomis like BG, HBG, GSF and all the xxxx sunfish.
My fault.
Filippo
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Hey esshup!
How you doin'?
What's a surface acre?
I will remove some males, but it will be hard for me. After years of tentatives finally I have some good and healthy LMB and killing them is tough.
Last edited by ItalyBASS; 05/08/16 10:20 AM.
Filippo
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Even more reason to remove the LMB, as the PS don't reproduce as much as the BG here do. Less food for the LMB. Pumpkinseed image:  Bluegill: 
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This is one I caught last summer, about 5". 
Filippo
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I was told HSB will help keep LMB numbers down. Any HSB there?
Sean
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Hey Sean, I know that some lakes for a fee have HSB, so I m pretty sure they can be found in fisheries. But wont they compete with LMB for food? Goal for my pond is to have a good and healty population of LMB to fish C'n'R with friends ans sons (sons in the next years because they are still in my wife's belly and they will born in the beginning of october  ). I don't need trophy bass but surely I don't want stunted ones....
Filippo
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The LMB can't be strictly C&R, you have to C and keep to keep their population numbers down.
To put one pound of weight on one LMB, it has to eat 10 pounds of fish. That's why I say catch some of the males out of there and keep 'em so the schools of fry don't all survive. If just one or two do, that will be still too many if they all survive.
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Fillipo,
If you have a ready supply of baitfish and you are able to locate some sunfish, you might dump a bunch of baitfish in with the SF when you stock.
I understand what you say about killing your fish; I have a tough time doing that too. If you start catching stunted, skinny bass, it'll be easier.
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Moderator Lunker
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Fillipo, a surface acre is 43,560 sq ft. It's easier for us in the US to look at it as the playing surface of a football field or 100 yards x 40 yards.
About 95% or more of those young bass will be eaten by the other bass and the punkinseeds. But, that still leaves way too many for their food supply. It reminds me of Texas. The average unmanaged Texas pond is bass heavy and bluegill light. In other words, too many predators for the food supply. Like you, without heavy culling, we wind up with a bunch of starving, skinny, bass.
It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.
Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.
Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Thank you all, I appreciate your help. I'll catch n keep some LMB for the general health of all the pond. In the meanwhile I've just received a pic of a minnow I don't know from that friend of mine who will give me some PS. He has 2 ponds, one with Koi, the other one with CGC, some PS and a bulk of these minnows 3-4" long:  Does anybody know what they are? Could they be good as forage for LMB? He said they would be easy to catch alot with minnow traps.
Filippo
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This is one I caught last summer, about 5". Wow the coloring on that pumpkinseed is beautiful! They seem to really like it in your pond!
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This is one I caught last summer, about 5". Wow the coloring on that pumpkinseed is beautiful! They seem to really like it in your pond! Thank you CC! They are good until they hit the wrong fish (a big LMB) ;-))
Filippo
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Moderator Hall of Fame 2014 Lunker
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Several ways to help limit LMB over crowding.
Seine (net) the nests while the young are there and remove as many as possible. Even if you don't get them all it will run off the male which will also help. Can also rotenone them. Not sure rotenone is legal in Italy.
Those are indeed PS and will not reproduce enough to sustain LMB. Are there any other forage species available?
Can also catch (fishing) some adults for food and seine net out some adults also.
Last edited by ewest; 05/09/16 01:12 PM.
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Hi ewest, I don t know if rotenone is legal or not here, but I prefer to fish some and give to friends alive or eat them. There are currently other kind of forage for LMB in the pond like crayfish, little CGC and carassio (my LMB love to eat carassi in the 3-4" size) and bullheads. I could also add this minnow: if only I could know which fish it is and if it's good for LMB. I can take billions of these minnows from a friend's pond. The only things I know about them are that they spawn several times during spring/summer and when they are spawning they have some kind of little horns around the snout.
Last edited by ItalyBASS; 05/10/16 02:40 PM.
Filippo
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is that as big as those "minnows" get?
If that is a max size or slightly bigger, I could see your LMB eating Billions of them for sure.
Goofing off is a slang term for engaging in recreation or an idle pastime while obligations of work or society are neglected........... Wikipedia
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I can't help you with ID of fish from Italy. I found this webpage that has several minnow species on it. perhaps if you selected the fish you already can recognize by sight and cross those off the list, then using google image search to check on a visual match for the others you can identify it? The eurasian minnow for example is something most readers of this forum will not have much experience with. The body form of your fish looks more like the streamlined shape of a shiner, dace, or chub. We have a fish called the Lake Chubsucker that has a body like this but the mouth is a bit different. Perhaps you could submit the picture to a fish biologist in your region or to a biology or natural resource management professor at a local university that trains biology students or fishery management students? Tell them there is extra credit or a case of beer for the winner... try this: fish of italy...
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is that as big as those "minnows" get?
If that is a max size or slightly bigger, I could see your LMB eating Billions of them for sure. Bobby I'm pretty sure they won't be bigger than that one in the pic. I hope they taste good for LMB because the size would be really good.
Filippo
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...... Tell them there is extra credit or a case of beer for the winner...
or perhaps a bottiglia di vino! 
Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
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Joined: Mar 2016
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I can't help you with ID of fish from Italy. I found this webpage that has several minnow species on it. perhaps if you selected the fish you already can recognize by sight and cross those off the list, then using google image search to check on a visual match for the others you can identify it? The eurasian minnow for example is something most readers of this forum will not have much experience with. The body form of your fish looks more like the streamlined shape of a shiner, dace, or chub. We have a fish called the Lake Chubsucker that has a body like this but the mouth is a bit different. Perhaps you could submit the picture to a fish biologist in your region or to a biology or natural resource management professor at a local university that trains biology students or fishery management students? Tell them there is extra credit or a case of beer for the winner... try this: fish of italy... CC thank you for your reply. I will try to indentify the minnow lurking online first, then asking some expert if I can't find it by myself. I've already found, using google with lake chubsucker, that my minnow looks really like the one you told me and that it's a cyprinidae. And the search goes on....
Last edited by ItalyBASS; 02/02/17 03:40 PM.
Filippo
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...... Tell them there is extra credit or a case of beer for the winner...
or perhaps a bottiglia di vino! HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHA Bill! I thought the exact same thing when I read that!!! LMAO!
Last edited by ItalyBASS; 02/02/17 03:41 PM.
Filippo
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Well, I think I found it (many thanks to canyoncreek who gave me the right hint). The minnow is a Pseudorasbora parva (alias Stone moroko), a cyprinidae native of Asia, introduced in Europe. It reaches a max length of a little more than 4". According to this academic article it's really appreciated by LMB. This is a great news because I have an inexhaustible source of these minnows in a friend's pond far 1 hour from mine.
Last edited by ItalyBASS; 05/10/16 04:12 PM.
Filippo
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