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#421727 - 08/21/15 08:09 AM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
RER Offline


Registered: 01/23/12
Posts: 1926
Loc: N FL
put me on the list, Ill have emily make some more Datil Pepper Jelly if you truely liked it. The Black walnut was a big hit with her.
_________________________
Goofing off is a slang term for engaging in recreation or an idle pastime while obligations of work or society are neglected........... Wikipedia

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#421823 - 08/21/15 10:28 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Done. Hopefully, we'll have more walnut this upcoming season.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

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#430149 - 11/26/15 07:14 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Spent the afternoon in the woods, running some tubing. This will be our first attempt at sap collection using anything other than buckets, so it is very much a work in progress and learn as we go.

Tubing has been used in sugarbushes for several decades, in a few different configurations. The first attempts relied on gravity to simply carry the sap to a central collection point....less time emptying buckets is always a good thing. Soon after, someone decide to adapt an unused suction pump from a dairy, in order to try and extract sap rather than simply letting it drip out of the tree. And it worked. Today, you can still find gravity setups but most larger producers have switched to vacuum pumps, both electric and gasoline powered, to ramp up production.

What we are trying is a kind of hybrid setup. It's a fairly recent development, and it's gathering converts rapidly in the maple community. It's not suited to every sugarbush, as it needs a slope with a decent fall in order to function properly.

It starts by replacing the standard maple tubing of 5/16"ID with a smaller, 3/16"ID product. Basically you begin at the top of the slope or hill, and string the tubing from maple to maple all the while maintaining that all important downward slope. The more fall the better. The idea is to gather enough sap to completely fill the tubing, with no air space....that's the reason for switching to a smaller ID, as the larger 5/16 seldom if ever filled completely. With the smaller stuff, it will easily fill the tubing with no air gap, creating a "plug" of maple sap. Now is where gravity helps us out...as gravity pulls that solid, tube full of sap down the slope, a natural vacuum develops behind it, (or further up the hill). This natural vacuum works at the taps, and actually pulls the sap into the lines.

Almost a siphon of sorts, similar to what happens when a pond is drained. The weight of the falling water(sap) keeps pulling additional water(sap) from the pond(trees). Slick. Obviously the trees furthest up on the slope will have the greatest vacuum, but they claim a benefit to all trees on the line.

The beginning. This will be a tall tap, as we try for all the fall we can get. This first tree is actually on level ground, on top of the hill. Ambitious I know. The loop has one end connected with a three way fitting, and the other end is tucked into a sleeve made on the same fitting. It's called a drop. This keeps the end clean until it's time to tap, when the loose end will connect to the spile(tap). The long extra tube will connect to a vacuum gauge. Hopefully we will get a reading.



Another shot of the drop, with the sleeve pointing down and the line tucked up inside.



Zigzagging down the hill, maple to maple, always running down.




Runs a long, back and forth pattern.

_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#430151 - 11/26/15 07:44 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
lassig Offline
Lunker

Registered: 02/04/09
Posts: 941
Loc: Schuyler Co, IL
Looks great and great concept. My relatives in N WI use a vacuum pump. Just one question, is it too soon to be putting it out? I would be afraid that the deer would mess with it especially that high off the ground. Did I miss something?
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#430152 - 11/26/15 07:47 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5907
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Cool setup. Is there a limit to how many trees can be on one line?
_________________________

You'll never know what ya can catch unless you wet a line!

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#430155 - 11/26/15 08:21 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
FireIsHot Offline
Moderator


Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 4093
Loc: Emory TX
Tony, I told you I'd be back for maple syrup time.

And one of my favorite threads begins again.
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AL

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#430156 - 11/26/15 08:29 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: lassig]
Rainman Offline
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Registered: 06/06/07
Posts: 7026
Loc: St Louis, MO area
Originally Posted By: lassig
Looks great and great concept. My relatives in N WI use a vacuum pump. Just one question, is it too soon to be putting it out? I would be afraid that the deer would mess with it especially that high off the ground. Did I miss something?


My first thought was the same....what happens when a deer trashes such a nice, taut setup?
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www.TilapiaStockers.com


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#430157 - 11/26/15 08:41 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Lassig, you are correct in thinking it's too soon for syrup production, but the weather is right for installing the tubing now, vs. trying to do it with snow on the ground and 15 degrees. The tubing will stay up year-round, and yes limbs take it down, deer mess with it, and what I hear is worst of all....squirrels chew it. When syrup season is finished, the spiles are removed from the trees and the tubing is left in place for next season.

From what I have been told, 25 taps on each run of 3/16" is about max. We have 15 on this run.

We're slowly gearing up Al. I start the new job in January, so will not be able to take off and cook like I have in years' past....will definitely miss that part! Still, we're going to give it our best effort and see what happens. We've upped the maple tap count to 70, and doubled the Black Walnut also.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#430158 - 11/26/15 08:42 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: Rainman]
sprkplug Offline
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Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Originally Posted By: Rainman
Originally Posted By: lassig
Looks great and great concept. My relatives in N WI use a vacuum pump. Just one question, is it too soon to be putting it out? I would be afraid that the deer would mess with it especially that high off the ground. Did I miss something?


My first thought was the same....what happens when a deer trashes such a nice, taut setup?


You climb up and splice it back together! grin
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#430179 - 11/27/15 09:51 AM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
RER Offline


Registered: 01/23/12
Posts: 1926
Loc: N FL
I sure would like some more of your syrup,

I would be glad to trade out again or just buy a little from you...
let me know if you have enough to share again this year.
_________________________
Goofing off is a slang term for engaging in recreation or an idle pastime while obligations of work or society are neglected........... Wikipedia

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#430181 - 11/27/15 10:04 AM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: FireIsHot]
Lovnlivin Offline


Registered: 05/18/12
Posts: 1510
Loc: Eagle, NE
Originally Posted By: FireIsHot
And one of my favorite threads begins again.

^^^ +1 ^^^
_________________________
Keith - Still Lovin Livin

https://youtu.be/o-R41Rfx0k0
(a short video tribute to the PB members we met on our 5 week fishing adventure)

Formerly: 2ac LMB,HSB,BG,HBG,RES

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#430196 - 11/27/15 02:07 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
teehjaeh57 Online   content
Chairman, Pond Boss Legacy award; Moderator; field correspondent
Lunker

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 8194
Loc: Lincoln, NE
Tony, amazing. I love this thread.
_________________________
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau





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#430198 - 11/27/15 02:35 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
DonoBBD Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 1993
Loc: Ontario, Canada, Eh.
My father, my self, and my three boys have built a sugar shack this summer and ordered up a stainless evaporator pan. Last year the boys hauled all the sap up with four wheelers and it was alot of work. This year we're going to cook back there. Woods there its win win.

I would be interested in more detail about the tubing. We built the shack in the lowest point of the bush. We can tap 100 trees if we are ambitious enough.

Cheers Don.

P.S. we tapped only hard maples and the syrup was very light in colour but very sweet.
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7/8th of an acre, Perch only pond, Ontario, Canada.

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#430207 - 11/27/15 06:07 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Bobby, I have you on the list and would love to trade. Hopefully mother nature and the new job will team up to allow for a good season.

Don that is awesome! How about some pics of the shack and your setup?? We're new to this tubing stuff ourselves, but I will provide all the detail I can if you let me know what you're interested in. Good luck!
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#430316 - 11/29/15 05:49 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
DonoBBD Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 1993
Loc: Ontario, Canada, Eh.
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Bobby, I have you on the list and would love to trade. Hopefully mother nature and the new job will team up to allow for a good season.

Don that is awesome! How about some pics of the shack and your setup?? We're new to this tubing stuff ourselves, but I will provide all the detail I can if you let me know what you're interested in. Good luck!


Few pictures of the cooker last year. It was really a big pan and we did it in batches. Had it running over at my dads place or Grandpa so he could feed the fire and keep an eye on it.

The shack is made up from what the boys salvaged from our old home that we just finished the demo on. There was a lean too on the side of the house that was our hot tub room built on a heavy 2X6 deck. The windows and door are from the old house.

The side with the chimney is where we will put the cooker this year.

Cheers Don.


Attachments
cooker.jpg (307 downloads)
shack.jpg (287 downloads)
shack2.jpg (305 downloads)
shack3.jpg (314 downloads)

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7/8th of an acre, Perch only pond, Ontario, Canada.

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#430318 - 11/29/15 06:30 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5907
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Looks great Don! Looks like you are good to go whatever Ma Nature throws you for weather. I really like your repurposing of the old materials. So many folks throw stuff like that in a burn pile and then have to go buy new when they need it.
_________________________

You'll never know what ya can catch unless you wet a line!

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#430319 - 11/29/15 06:37 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
It does look good! Will the evaporator sit outside the shack, under roof? Also, I see in the first photo you have rigged up what looks like a hand held blower, for an air under fire (AUF) setup? How did that work out, did it increase your GPH boil rate?

Discretionary afterthought....being north of the border, are you required to notify the federation of your efforts? Not meaning to stir anything, simply curious.


Edited by sprkplug (11/29/15 06:42 PM)
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#430320 - 11/29/15 06:52 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Finished up the tubing run today, by terminating the sap line into a barrel located just outside of the sugarhouse. If everything works like we hope it will, I will move the barrel inside next season, giving us a 450' run with 15 trees piped directly into the shack. No buckets, no trudging through the mud and snow. Just pump right from the barrel into the evaporator.



_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#430329 - 11/29/15 08:06 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
DonoBBD Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 1993
Loc: Ontario, Canada, Eh.
There is no need for a permit when building a sugar shack in Ontario Canada.

Yes the evaporator will sit out side un insulated. We are putting steel around that side so block the wind and will have it open to the bush side where the wood pile is. You can see we started strapping it for steel on the bottom.

Yes that is a hair dryer hooked to a aluminum tube forcing air into the fire. It doubled our heat and helped get the boil not just at the front but back closer to the smoke stack. If you look that is a bottom off an old oil tank that we welded on some L channel to the top cut edge and added a fire place door.

We learned too that putting sand in the bottom of the tank banking it up at the back then sloping to down to the front. Then laying the fire brick on top of the sand we got a much better boil at the back too. The more surface area you can get to boil the better.

The new one will have a float, temp gauge, and fins on the bottom for more surface area in the heat.

Oh ya for a hobby that doesn't pay any bills you need to use old used things. The only new stuff in this adventure is the bottles and the evaporator pan. We even got the spile's and buckets from another sugar bush that went to piping. The shingles are left over lumber yard miss fits for $10's. The siding is from the old house. Everything is from the old house other then the screws and some left over 2X6 from the new house.

Cheers Don.


Edited by DonoBBD (11/29/15 08:12 PM)
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7/8th of an acre, Perch only pond, Ontario, Canada.

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#430330 - 11/29/15 08:32 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
I hear you on re-purposing stuff. Our evaporator is an old oil tank also, although I did weld up an arch inside to force heat up closer to the pan. The firebrick helped a lot also. I'm considering AUF, but the stack temps already push 1000 degrees at times on natural draft, so we boil pretty hard the way it is. Sounds like you are getting a drop flue pan. Watch your sap levels....drop flues can be unforgiving. Wise choice on the float box with that configuration.

I wasn't sure if Ontario was under the same strict policies as Quebec is. The Federation doesn't play around. I hear they will post guards at your property to enforce the regs.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#431533 - 12/13/15 06:30 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Making Christmas candy tonight, to pass out to friends. On the menu: Maple nuts.

Heat maple syrup WAY past the point it became syrup. 240 degrees in this case.


Pour molten syrup over dry roasted peanuts.

Stir until you think your arm might fall off. Suddenly, there will be a slight crackling sound as the syrup goes to sugar...keep stirring until the sheen is replaced by a dull coating.

Spread the maple nuts out to dry, and hope you've made enough. You haven't, because you can't stop eating them yourself. You realize you will not have enough to give out. Decide to make another batch. Eat other batch also. Repeat next year.


_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#431537 - 12/13/15 06:42 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5907
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Looks great!

So walnut syrup nuts next year as well? Hmmmmm....Might need to use walnuts. smile


Edited by Bill D. (12/13/15 07:26 PM)
Edit Reason: Typo
_________________________

You'll never know what ya can catch unless you wet a line!

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#435661 - 01/24/16 07:07 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
It begins, 2016.

_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#435665 - 01/24/16 07:19 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
Bill D. Offline


Registered: 10/19/14
Posts: 5907
Loc: Boone County Illinois
Wow! I would have thought it's way too early. Do you know what triggers the rise of the sap?
_________________________

You'll never know what ya can catch unless you wet a line!

Top
#435672 - 01/24/16 07:56 PM Re: Making Maple Syrup [Re: sprkplug]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6952
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Yes I do, Bill. Trees contain a fair amount of carbon dioxide, which is acted upon by temperature. When it's warm, the CO2 expands and creates pressure, which will cause the tree to "bleed" through a wound, or taphole. Colder temps will cause the CO2 to contract, which creates a vacuum and draws water through the roots and up into the crown.

So, the warmer daytime temps expand the CO2 and the resulting pressure increase, (along with gravity), cause the sap to run back down from the crown, creating the flow that sugarmakers harvest. At night when the temps drop, water is pulled back up the tree, replenishing the reservoir. To get a sap run, we need nighttime temps below freezing, (mid 20's), and daytime temps above freezing. (low to mid 40's).

I'll try and post a vid from earlier today, showing the CO2 bubbles in our first run of tubing.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
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