Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Tilapitopia 3.0

I bought another barrel for sap storage this year as well. Removeable, clamp type lid, and for once it didn't formerly contain a substance that was awful to scrub out. Dried chilies. Simple to clean, no odor. Lid has a replaceable seal, and they are liquid tight. Will probably switch out the other barrels for this type next season.

Not sure I would add fertilizer. Your feed should be enough especially once your fish load increases. Sounds like your nitrates and or alkalinity are too low? Another possibility is you are getting rid of your solids too fast. In Aquaponics the solids release nutrients better if they are allowed to break down a little.

Cecil,

I get that. I did not know about the break down of solids as well as I should have, I get it now, that makes sense. I have been adding a little more feed each day and the fish are readily eating it. I might try adding just a little more feed daily.

Thanks for the info.

Can someone explain to me how the algae helps balance an aquaculture system? This is a new concept to me. People on the aquaponics forums freak out if they have algae blooms. Personally i dont fret about them. My outdoor system seems to get one every year in the spring when the weather first starts to warm up but it lasts a couple weeks and then dissipates. I know tilapia are filter feeders and can eat the algae using filtering in their gills. But algae can also cause PH fluctuation and if you arent aerating at night it can cause low O2 for the fish.

I am not arguing one way or the other, just making a pros and cons list. And i feel like i must bee leaving some 'pros' out.

I build algae blooms ibc tanks like yours to feed sunfish larva/fry. I start with aquaponics water (adds a lot of N) and add some rock phospate (adds a lot of P) and the water looks like lime green jello in 24 hours. You should be getting plenty of N and micronutrients from the fish/fish food. If you already already have pond fertilizer on hand, for sure use that but if you are looking for an inexpensive fish safe/organic addition a couple of tablespoons of rock phosphate is probably all you need to really set your bloom off.

Brian,

First off, I am NO expert, I am a student.

I want the algae for the fry if I get a spawn or two. I aerate 24/7. I am keeping the water temps around 80F. We are feeding the Tilapia more aggressively now that the bio media is fully mature.

Also I have been told that green water limits male tilapia "bed" size and hopefully this will also cut down on bad behavior on their part.

Those are the hopes.

PH is steady at 7.4-7.6


Also, you have to remember, I am just over wintering Tilapia because I want the fish for the next season in the ponds, so my motives are a little different than aquaponics folks.

Spark - Yeah, those mostly contain solids of some sort and are internally lined, well, with a liner before they dump product in, so the liner contains stuff and the barrels are really clean.

Bought a few closed top that had liquid smoke, and that was like tar. Didn't know it at the time and got a half dozen for my sister, and two for my mom. When we got into that mess, I felt really bad, gave them their money back and sold them at an auction to a horse farm for a whole lot more than I paid. Auctioneer listed it as food grade, and was open to the public for personal inspection

Those barrels were the nightmare from the abyss!

I'll bet that liquid smoke was nasty. I once set about re-purposing a barrel (or two) that contained butter. Never again.

I have a garage aquaculture system that i use to overwinter tilapia as well. So i am understanding of your goals. I dont try to get them to spawn in my garage system, is that one of your goals?

Usually the numbers in crowding is enough to protect the fish from aggressive males.

If you want fry to live you will need to consider a couple of things
1) some sort of protection from predation in the ibc, and
2) some way to keep them from going into the aquaculture plumbing (or an inline trap to catch them once they leave the ibc through your drain.

This is an intex pool but i have also done overwintering in IBC. I have 200 in that 900 gallon pool. I have don 40-50 in a ~250 gallon ibc





brian

Really nasty. It was like baked on and flowing at the same time. My Honda pressure washer would not even touch the stuff, and that's when everyone gave up. Pretty much like Tar.

Sorry for the people that bought them, but the auction was run by another company and I had no say in the content on how they advertised.

HF:
The green water is probably a good thing for the fry. I let my tanks get as much of that as possible before the fry are born. I also let a lot of solids build up at that time. There seems to be conflicting knowledge on whether the fry eat the waste from the mother. Some say yes, others say no. I personally have found that the fry grow faster if there is an abundance of solids from the mother at the time the fry are released, as compared to keeping the tank clear. I've done both ways. Within a few weeks of them roaming around, the tanks get to be very cleaned, just like a filtering system, till they get about an 1" long. Then it comes to an end.

I will agree with bcotton about the difficulties he mentions of having any fry in your set-up. To add to those thoughts, the mother gets very defensive when the fry are released, and can stay this way for weeks after. I could see the possibility that she will literally die from exhaustion defending here fry. That, or she will kill others keeping them away. I think it would go one way or the other.

Brian,

I do have structure made out of 1/4 inch netting in both IBCs. It is a cylinder about 8 inches in diameter that runs top to just off the bottom. Further I do have both drains "protected" by the same netting. After that, I then have a filter that would also stop the fry from gaining access to the rest of the system.

FnC,

Thanks for the view point. I had not read that either, I'll do some more reading. Is there any report or article you would point me towards? Rex told me to add some "Housing" for the mothers if I am trying to get the fry numbers. I am working on that as well.

For now, it looks like I have the basics working well and it is time to up my game!!

Cecil posted this link a while back: http://alliedaqua.com/blue-tilapia-fingerlings.html

The thought buzzed my bean to get some to mess with. How many would one put in a small 40G tank for starters? (have 4) Also have (2) 100G and (2) 180G if needed for growth.

HF-
Sorry to say, I read a lot but don't save the references very often. I have come across a lot of articles talking about the housing for the mothers. I have always assumed they were doing this housing when she is mouth brooding. She can't protect herself very much and would rather hide and have her backside protected. I think once the fry are released, they will go where they want and leave that "home", to be eaten or learn quickly and go back. Meanwhile the mother will frantically go protecting them.

I never found to much info about leaving the fry with the mother. Most will take the eggs from her and throw them into an incubator. I will say, if you want the fastest/strongest growth, the incubator seems better. The eggs/fry grow much bigger compared to leaving them mouth brooded. I contribute this to the fact the eggs in the mouth are confined and thus stunted right from the start, much like overcrowding any fish in a pond. However, incubators are more work to fuss with. Just have to figure out which way is best for you.

I have not actually sacrificed a hatch of fry by adding in other fish once the fry are released. Might be an interesting experiment sometime. The way it is now, the mother goes ballistic anytime something gets near the tank. You can actually hear her scratching the glass with her teeth. And yes, she bites any hands that go into the water...

Lots of variables there. Others are a lot more knowledgeable about carrying capacities than me. I would say if you kept it to the 40G, about 25. Keep there growth monitored so they don't get to big by spring time for release. Possibly in the 4-5" range? If you wanted to make use of all those tanks.... get hundreds!!!!

Thanks Jim!

20-30 is what I was thinking for the 40G.

Just about have that setup ready. Got to cut a sheet of PVA to cover the OSB top on the stand and a bit of electrical.

Brian - Any improvement after the firmware upgrade?

Was also wondering what LED light rig you have? Been looking at a few for aquarium rigs due to the close proximity of water, but not finding anything that I can go from true zero output to 100%. Everything seems to have that 10% or so "click factor".

Did that email on the CB's make sense?

Phil,
The new firmware is running better numbers most of the time. The sweep is faster and a little more aggressive. The batteries are getting to float sooner in the day allowing more available heat if needed, but right now, it is not needed. We are only running one heater and it is keeping the temps around 83F.

The LED light was from marineland. I got the advanced version. It is programable for time on and off. Also, it has moonlight simulation using blue LEDs. Ours is powered off the solar power side.

The CB explanation was great. I understood it all, thanks for that!!

So currently, we are in a very good place. The water is right, the solar power is right and the heaters are right. The new CBs work like a champ and we are feeding them like the pigs they are. Now if I can get them to spawn, and we can grow out a good number, this will be our best attempt to over winter our Tilapia.

Brian - All sounds good!

I've noticed that everyone seems to be running open top barrels for their biofilter, meaning, the media is exposed to light.

Correct me if I am wrong, but should not the media be in total darkness 100% of the time?

IDK, JKB. All media biofilters I am aware of are all open to light. Even my Fluidized Sand Bed filters use clear plastic. I think it is more important to have dissolved oxygen.

In a "green water" system, algae is the substrate for bacteria, light is essential for the algae.

I keep mine dark. I cut the top of a blue barrel off with a reciprocating saw where it narrows and then flip it over. Makes a perfect snug lid. However I do allow a slight crack away from the nearest light to allow carbon dioxide to escape. I also keep light dim in my fish room 24/7 with a dimmer switch.

I believe an open top is functional but my darker mbbr's increase the carrying capacity of the media especially the nitrobacters. Bacteria does not like light and an extreme example is ultraviolet light which kills bacteria.

Btw I no longer feed my mbbr's the filtered water from the top of clarifier barrel to the bottom side of the mbbr barrel. I was having issues with mulm building up in the bottom sweep of waterline from the top of the clarifier barrel to the bottom of the mbbr, which reduced flow and subsequent return flow to the fish tank. And increased pressure in the bottom of the barrel also reduces flow. And it's a PITA to disconnect the water line with water in the tank to clean out the water line! Water flies out in the second or two it takes to cap it!

I now drill a hole in the middle of one of the bunghole threaded caps of the lid of the mbbr and push the end of the water line snugly into the hole just a couple of inches. Then attach a hose clamp on the inside on the hose to assure it doesn't pull out. The end of the waterline does not make contact with the water or media in the mbbr barrel. If it does it can mess up the pattern of medIa flow.

Since the bunghole caps are positioned on the outside edge of the lids, the flow immediately goes down with the media in the barrel which goes down on the outside edge and up in the middle.

Thanks for the feedback!

Been flip flopping on media.

Do I get the cheap stuff, or go with engineered media?

If it were not for the seller only accepting paypal, check/money order, I would be the owner of some stuff that I have no performance data on. Blind as a bat in sunlight!

Emailed the USA supplier for the stuff from Denmark to see what they can do with price.

I cancelled the original order to check out other media, but think I'll just go back.

I really like the Allied Aqua stuff because it's pretty much identical to the Kaldness but has a little more surface area at half the price. Started out with Mb3 and turned Brian on to it, but the AA is lighter then Mb3, and requires less air to move.

I think I know what media you are referring to. Interesting stuff and concept.

I may use the AA media or some packed media I'm no longer using in the clarifier in the future vs. the netting. Trap solids with it and then blow and drain the solids out. It would be less labor intensive than spraying off the netting, and probably work better than a radial flow settler.

Phil,

I use the stuff Cecil told me about. It works very well and if you look at the total costs, it is in the noise. I go with best value and the 95% solution.

T3 is running well. With six days in a row of heavy clouds, the batteries were running on empty (29%). Ultimately, we took the second air pump off solar for a day. It was an interesting data point. The good news is that we lost very little heat that week (less than two degrees). The water is green and the quality is very good.

The Tilapia are putting on good weight.

Now I wait to see if they spawn.