Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Soil questions Renovated pond dropping a little

Whenever we've done the dye test and we were in the source of the leak the colored water appeared. So in my experience the dye was not filtered. It's possible your leak is in another area, or that there are more than you suspect per our conversation. Origins of water leaks are tricky to determine often times. I'd treat the area of your highest confidence and measure the leak following application to determine results. If nothing happens, you may need to reapply in that area or consider full pond treatment as the leaks may exist elsewhere, per our conversation.

I ended up dyeing the entire pond, no colored water yet seen. I will keep checking.

One way to check.

Take a bucket of water from the pond, pour it on the ground slow/fast enough to mimic the size of the stream of water that is leaking out. See if you can see any dye in that water.

If you can, it's most likely not water from inside the pond that is leaking into that particular stream of water that you are seeing.

My WAG? The dyed water in the pond isn't dark enough to see the dye when it's in a smaller volume of water.

You probably wont be able to see it unless you are using an enormous amount of dye or using the dye that is designed for leak detection. (the bright green stuff)Take a jar of water from your pond and you will see the dye is almost clear. The reason it looks darker in the pond is because of the depth(amount of water you are trying to see through). I tried the same thing you are and I know the water is making its way to a certain spring because I just drained the pond in the fall and it stopped. could never see the dye. However I did find a better way to detect. My pond has a ph of about 8.8 all the springs on my ground are around 7.5 (neutral)except for the one where the pond water is going. It has a ph of (guess?) about 8.8. Might help you determine if it is actually pond water you are seeing.

Jar of water from pond looks light blue. Jar of water from behind dam looks clear. I used a substantial dose of dye.

The situation is, my neighbor to the west has a 1/8 acre pond; the east side of his dam is about 60 feet west of mine, top to top. He has enormous (24 inch plus) cottonwoods and ash trees growing on his dam, and one 18 inch ash at the east base of it. His pond drops fairly rapidly after a big rain. I can't tell if the water is coming from my dam or his. I suspect his, or it could be a combination.

Will he let you dye his pond? If not can you find a difference in water from his to yours? In my case the ph was different enough to confirm where the water was going. It did not help me find the source of the leak though. I completely drained it last fall and cleaned it out. When it was drained the spring almost completely quit, where as before it ran about 10 gpm. When I was scraping the pond and cleaning the muck out I did locate a sand vein about 1/4 inch deep by about 25 feet long. I noticed it because as I was scraping I could see certain areas where the dirt would just kind of slide off the dirt below it. Have yet to see if it fixed my problem and will probably try the soilfloc TJ has if not. Hope this helps and good luck. I have been dealing with mine for about 5 yrs off and on when I have time and it can be very frustrating.

I am going to try Soilfloc too, if the wind ever stops. I already have 55 pounds of it on hand. If that doesn't work, the pond project will be abandoned, as I have already put too much into it. There are enough other ponds and public waters near here that I can fish that after a point it is not worth the effort.

Wow John, I'm sorry to hear you are even considering abandoning your pond project. Hopefully the soilfloc will do the trick.
My pond filled again a few weeks ago. I was up there yesterday, and it had dropped 3".
Slow enough that I am not going to drain it, but still fast enough that I'd like it to stop.
The last time I talked with TJ, I got the impression that you should not use the soilfloc, unless the temps were in the 50s. I thought I should just wait for spring.
You might want to double check, just to give yourself the highest chance for success.
As far as my leak is concerned, I think the seep I'm seeing behind the dam isn't enough water to to equal my water loss, I think I must have water dropping into a subterranean level, that I just never see.
I sure hope you get your leak fixed.
Jeff

The consultant at Aqua Ben (Sandra) said it is OK to apply Soil-floc as long as there is no ice on the pond in the area it is applied. It has to sink.
I have worried with this pond long enough, and spent enough. If the wind ever becomes completely calm and allows me to do the Soilfloc treatment, and if the treatment doesn't work, then what else is there to do without spending a ton of money?

I agree. If I can't get mine to hold water, it'll be a big food plot in a few years. I hoping it'll hold at some level. Either that, or hold out for a lot of rain.
I'm not investing the same amount again.

Mine has now dropped 12 inches since the big rain (19 days) We have had 0.6 inches rain since then. Still no dye showing outside pond, but within a few hours after I applied the dye, the seep through the site of the former drain ditch stopped, and now is only a damp spot in the clay. The dye somehow flocculated the pond fairly well, but have lost 1-3/4 inches of water in the three days since. Curiously, the new 4 ft deep minnow pond right above the main pond has only lost about 1/2 inch in the same 19 days, and it was built using only a small dozer and backhoe.

Pond dropped three more inches in eight days with only 0.2 inches precipitation. I still have not used the Soilfloc due to endless wind. Hopefully we will get more rain, and I can apply it to a fuller pond. It's too cold to pump from the creek these days, as my pipe is not buried, and my pump is gasoline powered, thus has to be run out in the open. No dye ever showed outside the pond.

Sounds like the leak might be slowing. If it was getting worse, I would be worried. If it is slowing it may indicate suspended particles in the water may be clogging up the leak slowly, which would be a good thing. If outflow was increasing, that might indicate erosion was taking place which would be a very bad thing.

You might also be getting some settling of the dam helping things.

Hopefully the Soil Flock will finish up taking care of the problem leak.

No wind late this afternoon. I put down a small amount of Soilfloc (about 3-1/2 pounds), with each throw of Soilfloc followed by a handful of bentonite as instructed to help the polymer sink. I only targeted the specific areas I suspect of seeping. It is wait and see now, and maybe do some pumping if the weather warms enough.

After multiple spot treatments involving use of about 10 to 12 pounds of Soilfloc and 50 ponds of bentonite, I have managed to reduce daily water loss to about 1/4 inch. I managed to stop the seep in the former ditch through the dam a few weeks ago, then have worked on other suspected leaks. Hopefully, after more rains and inflow of a little more clay, the remaining minor seeps may stop. If not, I have more Soilfloc. It's very hard to find an application window without wind. BTW, the pond has a visibility of over four feet without use of alum.

John,
Great news! Sounds like the soilfloc made a positive difference. I will be doing a similar application this spring.
Just curious, how did you identify suspected trouble spots for treatment? I have a similar leak, drops less than an inch per day, I can see where it comes out at the base of the dam in the old ditch bed. I suspect the best place to treat it would be where the water side of the dam transitions in to the actual bottom of the pond, but without any dye info, it's just a guess.
Good job so far. Have you pumped it back to full? Up in my part of Missouri, we haven't seen any significant moisture since the 1st of the year.
Jeff

Jeff,
I targeted the areas opposite damp spots behind the dam, trying to get the Soil-floc to sink at the junction of the dug out part and the dam. As suggested by the Aquaben consultant, I would throw Part A, then Part B, then a couple handfuls of granular bentonite on top to help it sink, since I was targeting spots, not the whole pond. I may have to do more treatments. I have been pumping enough to keep the pond from going low, but now the creek is starting to dry up. No significant precipitation here in about seven weeks.

Update to an old thread:
I kept the 1/4 acre pond high through most of the summer by pumping, then after July 31, I couldn't pump any more due to the creek drying up. The pond continued to go down about 1/2 inch on average a day until it lost about 22.5 inches, then it seemed to be all evaporation. In total I lost about 34-1/2 inches of water, but only 12 inches between Sept 12 and Dec. 24. So, about 1/2 inch a day for 43 days, then less than 1/8 inch average per day for the next 103 days. After the rains on Dec 24 and 26, I pumped 25 inches of water into it. Since then, it is down 3.5 inches in five days (about 5/8 inch per day). I have checked everywhere. No damp spots on the back of the dam, no wet spots in the closely mowed field behind the dam. Could it be that hydro static pressure is pushing water out through the bottom until it reaches a certain level, then it stops leaking at that level? (pond is 11 feet deep when full, got down to 8 feet deep) If it was leaking into the soil at the relatively undisturbed side of the pond above the dam, then my minnow pond just ten feet horizontally and 6 inches vertically above the main pond would leak there too, but it doesn't. Have used a half unit of soil floc late last winter/early spring around the base of the dam, and not much changed except a few damp spots dried up. While the pond was down, all the soft clay above the water shrank and dried, and I thought the leak would stop, but it hasn't. The pond is in all red/gray clay; very little rock. Still hoping it will seal sometime, but pumping when I can is a whole lot cheaper than a full soil floc treatment. Edit: I determined in August that the water that used to be behind my pond was coming from the neighbor's pond, not mine. His pond dried up in the drought, and the area is completely dry now.