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teehjaeh57 #403324 03/10/15 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted By: teehjaeh57
CMM I have a shipment of YP in NE in Spring - fish will be age 1 2014 class and probably 4-8" - larger fish will be females, smaller likely males. Let me know if I can help you out - have several clients ordering and I have a few ordered for myself. Maybe Rex can pay a visit and deliver to you unless he's got a line on fish sooner than he suggested. Happy to help my PB family if I can, let me know.

Cool experiments guys - I can't wait to see how thing go for you. The few YP that make it through the predators should be impressive. I want to see some 14" MO YP!


Teehjaeh57,

I am very interested in your YP. I am worried that most of the 4" fish won't make it due to predation by lm though. Is that a reasonable worry? I believe 100 larger yp is what was recommended for my 4 acre pond with established lm and bg.
What kind of pricing are we looking at for these fish, delivered? If I understand correctly, I will have to check with RM (Rex) on delivery prices? Will the females be spawned out already?

Hate to disappoint you but I am not sure my pond will deliver 14" MO perch for you, I am looking at these as an additional forage for the LM, (and possibly some hsb later if they establish well??).

This was a happy post to see on my lunch bread!! YP, YP, YP make my LM Happy, Happy Happy!
CMM


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Teehjaeh57
PM sent!
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CMM #426015 10/07/15 06:01 PM
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Update for this thread. Rex, Rainman, is scheduled to be out here later this month with 100 yp. 65 probable females and 35 smaller hopefully males. Will try for some pics of the fish.

In anticipation of the stocking, I added 8 brush piles as spawning and hideouts for the YP. My vegetation has also expanded some with coon tail, brushy and American pondweed and primrose. Oh, and a small floating island. Don't know how much help for spawning the primrose will be, but the big bass love to hide under that stuff.

Next year, yp on the fly!!! And fatter bass I hope.

I will post average wr for the lm from this year once I get the numbers run to compare with years going forward.

Cmm


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I am confident this experiment will work, and I think you'll be surprised by size your adults may achieve. There won't be many fish in the upper ranges, so competition for resources will be lower, resulting possibly in some real trophies.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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CMM #426019 10/07/15 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted By: CMM
Update for this thread. Rex, Rainman, is scheduled to be out here later this month with 100 yp. 65 probable females and 35 smaller hopefully males. Will try for some pics of the fish.

In anticipation of the stocking, I added 8 brush piles as spawning and hideouts for the YP. My vegetation has also expanded some with coon tail, brushy and American pondweed and primrose. Oh, and a small floating island. Don't know how much help for spawning the primrose will be, but the big bass love to hide under that stuff.

Next year, yp on the fly!!! And fatter bass I hope.

I will post average wr for the lm from this year once I get the numbers run to compare with years going forward.

Cmm


I am confused, I thought with YP you want more males than females to have multiple males available to fertilize each egg strand. Have I got it mixed up?

Last edited by Bill D.; 10/07/15 06:30 PM. Reason: Clarification

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Bill D. #426023 10/07/15 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
I am confused, I thought with YP you want more males than females to have multiple males available to fertilize each egg strand. Have I got it mixed up?


Probably not. As far as I know it's multiple males per single female to make sure the eggs get covered.

Bill D. #426026 10/07/15 06:51 PM
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Bill D, I thought I read somewhere more males also, but Rex said I had it backwards. That is normal for me!

This is an experiment for me. I want more and diverse forage for the lm, but I also thought that I could enjoy a tasty yp sammich once in a while too. I just can't see myself eating broiled golden shiners, even with lemon and garlic.

Really hoping I have the right mix of cover for some recruitment.

Cmm


CMM

CMM #426027 10/07/15 06:52 PM
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Thanks for the confirmation JKB

CMM,

Now I am curious, why are you stocking females 2:1 to males. Won't you just end up with a lot of unfertilized eggs?

Bill D.


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CMM #426028 10/07/15 06:57 PM
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CMM,

Looks like we were posting at the same time. smile

Maybe Rainman will see these posts and provide the answer.

Anyway, ya can't beat a YP sandwich!


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CMM #426045 10/07/15 08:39 PM
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Bill D. I am sure hoping the males will stay busy with all those girls. They should be young and full of themselves.

Cmm


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CMM #426075 10/08/15 11:31 AM
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I found where I read about ratio of male to female...

Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
For good fertilization of eggs they suggest more males than females and a ratio of 10:1 or more. Cecil will have input. You can get fertilization with a 50:50 mix but you will likely see eggs in the strands that are not fertilized.

One thing you can do is keep all or some the fish in the cage until they lay eggs. Cecil and I get YP laying eggs in cages all the time. Remove selected egg strands and hatch them in the pond on brush, baskets or live boxes. After the spawn hand pick the YP you want to grow out and continue as brood stock. One year old males from the 2014 hatch will be available to fertilize next years egg strands.



I found it here...

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=407571&page=1

Last edited by Bill D.; 10/08/15 11:31 AM.

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CMM #426077 10/08/15 01:28 PM
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My post should have read for 100% fertilization of all YP egg ribbons a 10:1 male to female ratio is suggested by the "experts". This ratio was likely proposed for a high YP production commercial goal. For regular sport fish growing a lower ratio of M:F will definitely result in lots of fertilized eggs. If one's goal is to have lots of larger fast growing perch for harvest which will be mostly the females, then the M:F ratio can be close to a 50:50 or even 30:70 ratio. The 30M:70F ratio should still provide plenty of fertilized eggs for the regular sport fishery.


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CMM #426083 10/08/15 02:41 PM
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Has there been a thread on pondboss on how to sex male vs female perch by their physical characteristics (visible on the outside at least)?

CMM #426086 10/08/15 03:20 PM
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Urogenital opening - females are crescent, males are round. Also female YP will be noticeably gravid in Fall, Winter and Spring prior to spawn. I posted several photos in threads in the past regarding this, should be helpful if you can track them down. I think most were ice fishing last Winter.


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CMM #426090 10/08/15 03:38 PM
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Here is a link to a previous PBoss Forum discussion about sexing yellow perch. TJ reports he reliably determines YP sex at all times of the year.

In my experience the best accuracy of determining sex is in spring when females have swollen bellies containing eggs (prespawn) and presence of milt from males. Also a for a couple weeks post spawn the females are easily recognizable by having noticeably enlarged genial orifices. IMO at other times if you are careful and diligent sexing YP using genital orifice shape it results in 90%-95% accuracy. In my experience this technique works best on mature fish that have spawned at least once.

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=28819&Number=369678#Post369678

Cecil Did you ever ask Rob Rode why YP need a cold period for egg development if YP usually start egg development in August-September?

Last edited by Bill Cody; 10/08/15 03:55 PM.

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CMM #426094 10/08/15 03:58 PM
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Per Bill, easiest right before spawn for sure, there's really no way to miss a gravid female vs fusiform male, and of course milting is 100% verification. I'd agree 90-95% accuracy with urogenital opening per Cody - I separate them based on initial review regardless of season, but cage them and always check again in March/April right before the spawn to make sure I was right. Again, 90-95% of the time initial estimate was correct. When in doubt, I toss them in the male cage.


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teehjaeh57 #426102 10/08/15 04:27 PM
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Just remember, if you are going for a single sex YP pond, one fish of the wrong sex will put all your work and effort in the trash can.


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teehjaeh57 #426108 10/08/15 05:10 PM
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At what age do female YP produce viable egg ribbons?

Bill D. #426110 10/08/15 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bill D.
I found where I read about ratio of male to female...

Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
For good fertilization of eggs they suggest more males than females and a ratio of 10:1 or more. Cecil will have input. You can get fertilization with a 50:50 mix but you will likely see eggs in the strands that are not fertilized.

One thing you can do is keep all or some the fish in the cage until they lay eggs. Cecil and I get YP laying eggs in cages all the time. Remove selected egg strands and hatch them in the pond on brush, baskets or live boxes. After the spawn hand pick the YP you want to grow out and continue as brood stock. One year old males from the 2014 hatch will be available to fertilize next years egg strands.



I found it here...

Bill D, thanks! That's what I remembered!

Bill C, thanks for the clarification. I do have a very small, less than 1/2 acre, pond, but it is chock full of gsf and two lm right now. I plan on draining it this fall, hitting it hard with lime and then using it as a grow out in just the manner you suggested. With no aeration, I won't put too many in, but think I can do some grow out/seining. Right now I use it as a bait pond for gsf when I go cat fishing.

Cmm


http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=407571&page=1


CMM

CMM #426132 10/08/15 07:52 PM
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I have seen viable YP eggs in 1 yr old female northern perch usually in females that are 7"-8" long. I have also seen spawn season eggs in a YP that was 3.75" long (I have the picture) which I assume was a 1 yr old female.


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Bill Cody #426135 10/08/15 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
I have seen viable YP eggs in 1 yr old female northern perch usually in females that are 7"-8" long. I have also seen spawn season eggs in a YP that was 3.75" long (I have the picture) which I assume was a 1 yr old female.


Something sticks in my memory (from a long time ago) that is basically what you are saying.

The 3-4 year maturity deal I recently read didn't sound right.

CMM #426136 10/08/15 08:19 PM
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That is great news considering the 100 small YP that I added this spring. Hopefully the males will be ready as well.

CMM #429332 11/15/15 11:15 AM
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Good news, Rex is delivering yp to me tomorrow! Bad news, possibility of rain (the Rainman cometh). I have chains and a back hoe... Please Lord let that be enough.

Cmm


CMM

CMM #429341 11/15/15 01:48 PM
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Get some pictures of when Rex is stuck in the mud. Pics of the fish would be good too!

Last edited by Bill Cody; 11/15/15 01:48 PM.

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Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
Get some pictures of when Rex is stuck in the mud. Pics of the fish would be good too!


grin


If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






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