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I am at a point of not knowing which way to go with my HBG/CC/HSB pond. It is fun, but ...

I did a grow-out cage this year for the HBG. I put about 110 1-2" HBG in the cage in May. I moved them to the pond about three weeks ago when I was finding a floater every couple of days. Most were 3-4 inches. But, there were only 53 of them.

My son called me last night about his IBC aquaponics tank. Also in May, we took a dozen northern strain bluegill, about 3-4 inches, from my main pond. They spawned at some point. The originals are now 7-8 inches, and the babies are 3-4 inches. There is enough biomass in the tank, where he is seeing mortality. We have the tank covered in opaque plastic, so it is very dark. I need to take a net to see what is in the tank.

My HBG cage and his aquaponics tank have both been fed with ESSHUP's BG food. It is interesting the the regular bluegill seem to have grown faster than the HBG.


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Ken, did you have that many morts in the HBG cage, or were there escapees?


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Bill, I did change my plans in certain ways in regards to the predators--no cats and no HSB. I was also way off on my numbers. I did add 38 WE and probably the same amount of SMB in December of 2013. Last December I also put in 10 lbs of mature YP and 20 Lbs mature GS from Rex. So far, I could not be happier w/this combination. The first two walleyes I sampled came as escapees from my overflow in Feb of this year. One measured 14 in, and the other 13 1/2, both in excellent condition. I've caught others since then, the last in June, measuring 16 in. However, I wasn't pleased w/its girth. I know little about WE in ponds. I still am amazed that it grew a foot in just a year and a half.

I caught the first SMB March of this year. It was over 10 inches and in good condition. The others I've caught since then have been identical. Again, I'm impressed as these were just 2 in long when stocked.

YP are doing well. I catch them regularly when fishing for the HBG. I did not see any reproduction from them. They are pretty foreign for my region, but I am enjoying them as a bonus fish.

Probably as no surprise, I've caught fewer RES than anything, but I've not really fished for them, and I know there are some dandies in there.

I still have plenty of FHM, but their numbers have drastically declined overall. I doubt they will be here by next year. I have no clue as to the GS. I don't see them and have never caught one. I know nothing about their habits. Since I've never found any dead ones, I only assume they're still in there and doing fine.

It may seem weird, but I have made a concerted effort to limit my fishing in this pond. I guess I still see it as if it's in its infant stage and don't want to intrude too much. I only fish it in the spring and fall and avoid the hot months.

The HBG have impressed me beyond imagination. I stocked in 2012 and 2013 between 500-600. I undertook my first harvest this spring before they spawned. All fish under 8" were automatically removed. All over 9 were returned. Those in between were selectively harvested based on body characteristics. All females were removed. The most harvested in one day was 21. The last day, we only managed 4. All the rest were above the 9 inch mark. Body condition was excellent. We harvested around 125, not counting all that were too small. Most are at a lb apiece. The longest was near 10". They seem to be developing more girth than length, and I'm fine w/that. I plan on harvesting another 50-75 this fall. I have caught many offspring. To my eyes, they are identical to the HBG, not at all heavy on the GSF genes.

I hope this helps.

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B.Wilson - Thanks. Great pond update. Fish seem to be growing well due to the plan of allowing fatheads to produce lots of young before adding predators. You are seeing it helps fish growth a lot to have lots of forage fish. Give us an update each fall and or spring as you monitor your fishery. The info will be helpful to all members. It will be interesting to see how the golden shiner maintain their numbers. I think adding HSB would have severely reduced shiner density in the pond's early development.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 09/02/15 11:09 AM.

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Maybe the myth needs a little clarification. In my opinion HBG are no different than other lepomids, in that there will typically be scenarios or conditions that both favor, and at the other end of the spectrum, discourage optimum growth patterns.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Ken, did you have that many morts in the HBG cage, or were there escapees?


Tony,

I had 4-6 floating morts over about a 7 day period before I moved them from the cage into the HBG pond.

I don't know what might have happened to the other 50-or-so. I expected some morts, but not that many.

Worst of all, I moved about 25 RES, 2-3 inches, from one of my grow-out ponds to that same cage after I removed the HBG. There were only four remaining in that cage last week when we got back from the beach after about 10 days.

A neighbor was checking on our place, and feeding the cages while we were gone. He said that he was noticing that there were fewer and fewer RES coming up for feed each evening. He pulled the cage a few days before we got home and said there were less than ten in the cage.

I'm not sure if there is a hole I can't see, or if maybe a water snake is getting in there. I seriously doubt the fish could jump out the top. If they died, maybe there was a Donner Party. That particular cage is covered with 2-inch square plastic "poultry netting" that would allow a reasonable size water snake to sneak in and gorge himself, and still get out.

I guess I need the Pond Boss CSI team. If the HSB or RES were able to escape, it means that I now have HBG in my main pond. That is where all my cages are located. No problem with the RES -- that was to be their autumn home anyway.

I'm at a crossroads with my HBG. I'm not sure if I might not be better off moving to pure strain bluegill. However, I've got a very nice and even CC and HSB population in that pond, plus two nice koi. I'm getting too old to want to kill off the pond and wait another three years to have friends enjoying the action in that pond.

I have same conundrum you have faced. Do you put in lots of tiny HBG, or do you do a grow-out? If that doesn't work, like what happened to me this year, then what? crazy

Conudurum Curmudgeon Ken


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Would a 2" mesh cage restrain a 1-3" bluegill? (Or RES). I use 1/2" mesh on the main cages, and 1/4" on the fry cages.

As I mentioned earlier, I am seriously contemplating adding HBG into another one of our ponds. This project would be more in line with the "traditional" application of HBG, that being a fun to fish and easy to catch setting. No trophy aspirations here, just raise the fish to a pound or so, harvest as we see fit, and re-stock as necessary. What this situation allows us to do, is utilize slightly bigger stockers initially. Since max growth is not a concern, I don't need to source smaller fish and get them on the program asap in order to maximize potential.

Purchasing 4-5" HBG is a little more expensive than buying 2" fish, but they are better suited to immediate turn-out into the pond, or at least won't need to spend much time in the cage before doing so. And they should still hit that 1 lb mark easily and quickly.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Quote:
Would a 2" mesh cage restrain a 1-3" bluegill? (Or RES). I use 1/2" mesh on the main cages, and 1/4" on the fry cages.


Oh! No!

Only the top is 2" mesh. The sides and bottom on this particular cage are 3/8" mesh.

Last edited by catmandoo; 09/02/15 02:43 PM. Reason: correcting the grammar corrector

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Ha! I was hoping I had misunderstood you.

"Er, excuse me Ken, but I think I see your problem right here." grin


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Cecil thanks for the link. That's awesome!!

Just curious, but what would a competition quality 2lb bluegill fetch? Seems like there would be a huge jump from that 1.5 lber!


Most likely if I reach that milestone I will either mount it or have it molded to be available to myself and others. I'd ask a couple hundred bucks for it if I sold a 2 lb. bluegill. Had one molder tell me I really screwed up by not molding my "unofficial" state record yellow perch.

I once sold an 8 lb. largemouth to a taxidermist that made molds for $200.00. The fish came from one of two water supply lakes that supplied water to a 200 pond goldfish farm in Martinsville, Indiana. I'm thinking a 2 lb. bluegill is rarer than an 8 lb. bass up here in the north?

Love your hybrids but surprisingly most taxidermists have no interest in them. I see one supplier sells them as regular bluegills when one can tell they are not, by the large mouth size in proportion to the body.

I should mold my own fish as I have lots of interesting specimens, but so far am so busy I'm not sure I want to start another project. And not sure I want to expose myself to fiberglass resin on a regular basis. I was told by one molder that once you get good at it, it becomes addictive.

Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 09/03/15 09:39 PM.

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