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#421798 - 08/21/15 08:06 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
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Registered: 08/08/02
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So when is the EPA going to take ownership of millions of ponds? Sounds like quite an undertaking.



Edited by Cecil Baird1 (08/21/15 10:27 PM)
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







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#421800 - 08/21/15 08:12 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
JKB Offline
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Registered: 12/03/09
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Loc: Michigan
The EPA only picks on small people. I know a defense contractor that polluted hundreds of wells and some top waters. The EPA went after them, but got their butt kicked.

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#421809 - 08/21/15 09:24 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
Zep Offline
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Registered: 07/27/10
Posts: 3070
Loc: Dallas & Wills Point, Tx
And they want to tell us how to manage our ponds!

EPA Causes Massive Toxic Spill In Colorado

_________________________
Fishing has never been about the fish....


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#421813 - 08/21/15 09:31 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
sprkplug Offline
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6945
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Fortunately, want and get are worlds apart. wink
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

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#421822 - 08/21/15 10:26 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: Zep]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
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Registered: 08/08/02
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Loc: Northeastern Indiana
Originally Posted By: Zep
And they want to tell us how to manage our ponds!

EPA Causes Massive Toxic Spill In Colorado



That wasn't the EPA itself but a subcontractor right?
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







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#421830 - 08/21/15 11:48 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
Zep Offline
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Registered: 07/27/10
Posts: 3070
Loc: Dallas & Wills Point, Tx
Originally Posted By: Cecil Baird1
That wasn't the EPA itself but a subcontractor right?


Ha Ha....yeah Cecil it was the contractor that the EPA chose to do the work and was under EPA control. It would be like if you get deathly ill on a flight and the airline claimed "hey it wasn't us it was the contractor we hired" implying "it's not our fault". Even CNN calls it the "EPA Spill". I guess when the EPA does something good we should say "well it wasn't the EPA itself, it was the subcontractor"?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/09/us/colorado-epa-mine-river-spill/
_________________________
Fishing has never been about the fish....


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#421831 - 08/22/15 12:05 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
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I respectfully disagree Zep.

When the U.S. government hires subcontractors and the railroad or a truck line to transport nuclear waste, and there is a derailment or truck accident do we automatically jump on the government?

In this case the contractor accidentally ruptured a containment wall. Didn't matter if the EPA was in charge. Sheet happens.

Seems to me some folks just want to jump on the EPA or it makes a more attention grabbing headline.

No doubt that is toxic material if they say it is, but it sure looks like iron ferrate precipitate to me that will settle out and eventually be consumed by bacteria.
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







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#421835 - 08/22/15 06:46 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
FINnFUR Offline


Registered: 03/24/15
Posts: 113
Loc: South Cemtral Virginia
Originally Posted By: Cecil Baird1
I respectfully disagree Zep.

When the U.S. government hires subcontractors and the railroad or a truck line to transport nuclear waste, and there is a derailment or truck accident do we automatically jump on the government?

In this case the contractor accidentally ruptured a containment wall. Didn't matter if the EPA was in charge. Sheet happens.

Seems to me some folks just want to jump on the EPA or it makes a more attention grabbing headline.

No doubt that is toxic material if they say it is, but it sure looks like iron ferrate precipitate to me that will settle out and eventually be consumed by bacteria.



I don't know but I would bet money under the secrecy of this administration we are not going to find out the real truth any time soon.
The report I heard said the contractor was doing exactly as directed and the EPA doesn't seem to be in denial of responsibility .

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#421839 - 08/22/15 08:29 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
sprkplug Offline
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Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Let's say I decide to hire someone to mow my lawn. I schedule a meeting with a maintenance concern, and together we walk my property. I lay out how I want the lawn mowed, what height I want it cut, what days to cut it, and what areas to mow. They accept my terms, and we agree on a price. They are of course, insured and bonded.

During the course of their first visit one of their mowers, operated by one of their own employees, picks up a rock and hurls it through my neighbor's front picture window. Should the story in the newspaper read "Sprkplug breaks glass"??

Should I have been out there, monitoring their progress? Or do I trust in the fact that they are professionals, but acknowledge that accidents, do in fact happen? Does an accident always have to imply negligence on someone's part? Am I to blame for breaking that window? They were after all, mowing in the manner I outlined to them?

In my opinion I didn't break that window. Yes, they were working for me, and yes I told them where to mow. But I relied on them to take my directions and implement them in a safe manner. Do I need to follow their mowers around, calling out obstructions and hazards, or can I rely on my contractor to carry out the job professionally?
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#421840 - 08/22/15 08:46 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: sprkplug]
timshufflin Offline


Registered: 08/12/13
Posts: 207
Loc: Jerome, MI
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Let's say I decide to hire someone to mow my lawn. I schedule a meeting with a maintenance concern, and together we walk my property. I lay out how I want the lawn mowed, what height I want it cut, what days to cut it, and what areas to mow. They accept my terms, and we agree on a price. They are of course, insured and bonded.

During the course of their first visit one of their mowers, operated by one of their own employees, picks up a rock and hurls it through my neighbor's front picture window. Should the story in the newspaper read "Sprkplug breaks glass"??

Should I have been out there, monitoring their progress? Or do I trust in the fact that they are professionals, but acknowledge that accidents, do in fact happen? Does an accident always have to imply negligence on someone's part? Am I to blame for breaking that window? They were after all, mowing in the manner I outlined to them?

In my opinion I didn't break that window. Yes, they were working for me, and yes I told them where to mow. But I relied on them to take my directions and implement them in a safe manner. Do I need to follow their mowers around, calling out obstructions and hazards, or can I rely on my contractor to carry out the job professionally?


Ah sparky, if only that's what had happened. Instead, I hired a company to provide me water for my cattle. The company I hired doesn't have all their own infrastructure and they sub contracted a trucking company to bring me their water. When the water was delivered, it was contaminated. The company that I hired DOES get to wear this. The company I hired DOES have to face the music, be liable for any damage, and apologize to me. I don't give two craps about the company I hired's personal issues with their subcontractor. Those two can sue each other all day for all I care. There is only ONE entity liable to me and one that owes me my money back.

sparky, you are couching this in straw man arguments.
_________________________
I just got a new pond, I made it twice because I aint so bright.

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#421844 - 08/22/15 09:03 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
TGW1 Offline


Registered: 09/19/14
Posts: 2331
Loc: Harrison Co. Texas
idiots, just plain idiots. I see it more than I want to. My explanation of such things would be where a company with vast experience in doing X job is hired based on their experience. But then some young guy with this degree is the boss over the job and over rides the experience that was hired. Screw up is what happens most every time. Remember the Gulf of Mexico blow out that was in the news a few yr's back. I would bet a dollar to a donut, the same thing happened with the EPA screw up.

Tracy
_________________________
Do not judge me by the politicians in my City, State or Federal Government.
Thank The Good Lord the government in Washington DC gets little done.
Outlawing guns will make a lot of us down here in the South
Outlaws and proud of it

Tracy

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#421847 - 08/22/15 09:30 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
sprkplug Offline
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6945
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
I actually agree that in this case, the EPA must bear the ultimate responsibility for the water hauled to those folks. What I'm disagreeing with, is the manner in which this is portrayed by the news, and those who seemingly have an axe to grind with the EPA. Difficuilt to be objective that way.

The headline of the story linked to in this thread, make it sound as if the EPA rolled into town in a fleet of government tanker trucks, filled with contaminated water.

"EPA angers Navajos by sending water for their livestock in filthy tanks"

No, don't believe they did. The contractor hired by the EPA screwed up. If that headline would read "Contractor hired by EPA delivers tainted water", I wouldn't be posting right now. Yes, some will argue that it's splitting hairs. But to me, these small differences are important, and demonstrate what we've become as a society. It's easier, and preferable, to blame the government rather than a fellow, private citizen or business.

Who sourced those tanks?? Was it the EPA, or was it left up to that private firm? Who delivered that tainted water? Pretty sure that wasn't the EPA themselves.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#421849 - 08/22/15 09:57 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: sprkplug]
timshufflin Offline


Registered: 08/12/13
Posts: 207
Loc: Jerome, MI
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
I actually agree that in this case, the EPA must bear the ultimate responsibility for the water hauled to those folks. What I'm disagreeing with, is the manner in which this is portrayed by the news, and those who seemingly have an axe to grind with the EPA. Difficuilt to be objective that way.

The headline of the story linked to in this thread, make it sound as if the EPA rolled into town in a fleet of government tanker trucks, filled with contaminated water.

"EPA angers Navajos by sending water for their livestock in filthy tanks"

No, don't believe they did. The contractor hired by the EPA screwed up. If that headline would read "Contractor hired by EPA delivers tainted water", I wouldn't be posting right now. Yes, some will argue that it's splitting hairs. But to me, these small differences are important, and demonstrate what we've become as a society. It's easier, and preferable, to blame the government rather than a fellow, private citizen or business.

Who sourced those tanks?? Was it the EPA, or was it left up to that private firm? Who delivered that tainted water? Pretty sure that wasn't the EPA themselves.







You are not splitting hairs, you are making excuses for left wing ideas. Hire a contractor to build your home and your kitchen counter tops come out a wreck and there will be one person on the hook, the sub who put the granite in. The newspaper headlines should read "XYZ contractor has continued history of poor counter top installation". It's up to XYZ contractor to get their crap in order. When I manufacture firearms I have to wear every single step of the process. If a part that I have sub contracted out fails, people will be posting on the internet NOT that a sub contractor failed but that I failed. This is how personal responsibility works.

The XYZ contractor can go and post about the poor work of the sub but that's their thing. We are talking about the end user here, the farmer/indians. They were the customer and they get to complain about the contractor, not the sub.
_________________________
I just got a new pond, I made it twice because I aint so bright.

Top
#421850 - 08/22/15 10:18 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
sprkplug Offline
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6945
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
The XYZ contractor can go and post about the poor work of the sub but that's their thing. We are talking about the end user here, the farmer/indians. They were the customer and they get to complain about the contractor, not the sub.

They may "get" to, but that's not actually accurate is it?

When you manufacture a firearm for a customer, do you allow that customer to stand over your shoulder at the lathe or mill, admonishing you to ream here, counterbore there, chamfer this? Not simply adding design input, but telling you how to do the job? Or do you remind them that they are the customer, (which is the EPA in this case) who has contracted you, the professional, to do a job? "Please allow me to do my job, I don't need micromanaging??"

That's how I see it...the Navajo's weren't the customer, the EPA was. The way I read that article, any contract made was between the EPA (customer), and the trucking firm (contractor. I fully agree that the EPA must stand for PART of the blame...but not all. And the media should not twist and manipulate facts simply for the sake of sensationalism, but rather report the issue without regard to political agendas.

That's my beef with this whole thing. It's become too easy to blame government for our own shortcomings.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#421854 - 08/22/15 10:55 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: sprkplug]
SoSauty Offline
Lunker

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 126
Loc: South Sauty Creek Northern AL
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
The XYZ contractor can go and post about the poor work of the sub but that's their thing. We are talking about the end user here, the farmer/indians. They were the customer and they get to complain about the contractor, not the sub.

They may "get" to, but that's not actually accurate is it?

When you manufacture a firearm for a customer, do you allow that customer to stand over your shoulder at the lathe or mill, admonishing you to ream here, counterbore there, chamfer this? Not simply adding design input, but telling you how to do the job? Or do you remind them that they are the customer, (which is the EPA in this case) who has contracted you, the professional, to do a job? "Please allow me to do my job, I don't need micromanaging??"

That's how I see it...the Navajo's weren't the customer, the EPA was. The way I read that article, any contract made was between the EPA (customer), and the trucking firm (contractor. I fully agree that the EPA must stand for PART of the blame...but not all. And the media should not twist and manipulate facts simply for the sake of sensationalism, but rather report the issue without regard to political agendas.

That's my beef with this whole thing. It's become too easy to blame government for our own shortcomings.


Let's look closely at where accountability needs to be: Whether guns or lawn mowers, once a safe functioning product has been provided, it is the user, not the manufacturer who is the accountable party. When it comes to an agency in charge of safe water, the EPA, not any other party, is accountable. To delegate the responsibility is to have no accountability. Which is where govt bureaucracies like to position themselves. We shouldn't be discussing whether the EPA should pay for the damage caused. Rather, the EPA should not be so inept as to be implicit in these sort of events. How hard is it to keep containment walls from being breached?


Edited by SoSauty (08/22/15 11:18 AM)
_________________________
Self-educated rednecks, the real intelligentsia.

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#421855 - 08/22/15 11:18 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: SoSauty]
sprkplug Offline
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6945
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Originally Posted By: SoSauty
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
The XYZ contractor can go and post about the poor work of the sub but that's their thing. We are talking about the end user here, the farmer/indians. They were the customer and they get to complain about the contractor, not the sub.

They may "get" to, but that's not actually accurate is it?

When you manufacture a firearm for a customer, do you allow that customer to stand over your shoulder at the lathe or mill, admonishing you to ream here, counterbore there, chamfer this? Not simply adding design input, but telling you how to do the job? Or do you remind them that they are the customer, (which is the EPA in this case) who has contracted you, the professional, to do a job? "Please allow me to do my job, I don't need micromanaging??"

That's how I see it...the Navajo's weren't the customer, the EPA was. The way I read that article, any contract made was between the EPA (customer), and the trucking firm (contractor. I fully agree that the EPA must stand for PART of the blame...but not all. And the media should not twist and manipulate facts simply for the sake of sensationalism, but rather report the issue without regard to political agendas.

That's my beef with this whole thing. It's become too easy to blame government for our own shortcomings.


Here the fault in your logic: Whether guns or lawn mowers, it is the user, not the manufacturer who is the accountable party. When it comes to an agency in charge of safe water, the agency, not any other party, is accountable. To delegate the responsibility is to have no accountability. Which is where govt bureaucracies like to position themselves.


I see no fault. If a manufacturing defect exists within a gun, or a lawnmower, how is the user to be held accountable? As I see it, there was a contractor, (the trucking firm), a customer, (the EPA,) and an end user, (the Navajo residents of the area). There were no sub-contractors. I do not know for a fact, but I'm guessing that there was no contract between the EPA and the Navajo regarding trucking in water. But I'm willing to bet that one certainly exists between the EPA and the trucking concern.

Personally I don't think that should make any difference, but I know that many on the forum place a great emphasis on literal interpretation and crossing those T's and dotting those I's. If that be the case, then where does legal accountability for this fiasco lie? Once again I don't think that should matter, as I'm comfortable recognizing the intent behind the action.


edit...I see the post I replied to has been changed somewhat, so perhaps this post has lost relevancy. I will keep my post original, as I'm too lazy to go back and edit.....


Edited by sprkplug (08/22/15 11:23 AM)
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#421856 - 08/22/15 11:22 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: sprkplug]
SoSauty Offline
Lunker

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 126
Loc: South Sauty Creek Northern AL
"as I'm comfortable recognizing the intent behind the action."

Wow, that's pretty easy to hide behind and foster an out of control government. Feelings are what matter. A government of feelings. A constitution of feelings. Our country is lost.

As to when the EPA will take control of our ponds, not for a while. This little power grab was just to desensitize us so they can get away with doing so in another 5 or 10 years. The only silver lining in this event that they won't have enough bureaucrats to see all their micro management dreams come true.

Sprkplg: *Good to keep the quote there, it clarifies my original post and your response is correct. I'm editing in 'preview' now rather than posting then editing. My bad.


Edited by SoSauty (08/22/15 02:22 PM)
Edit Reason: ,
_________________________
Self-educated rednecks, the real intelligentsia.

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#421857 - 08/22/15 11:31 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6945
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
SoSauty, my position might be better understood by reading through all of the pages in this thread. Page three, post # 414391 would be a good starting point.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#421859 - 08/22/15 11:45 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: sprkplug]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
SoSauty, my position might be better understood by reading through all of the pages in this thread. Page three, post # 414391 would be a good starting point.


Mine too.
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







Top
#421861 - 08/22/15 11:53 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: sprkplug]
SoSauty Offline
Lunker

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 126
Loc: South Sauty Creek Northern AL
Not wishing to be combative, just that idea of "intent" vs means testing is where we are today, and its' implications for the near future are scary. I've read all posts of this thread, see post #416054. I've just retired from teaching, common core and such. Nothing but one big bureaucratic erasure of accountability. Lots of little rehashed old ideas repackaged without a viable method to determine what's effective.

If an agency can't measure up, that's a good place to start cutting. Out here in Alabama, the TVA regularly has environmental spills, usually a containment berm gives way. There are few incentives to get it done right. TVA gets fined and we pay higher rates. Just makes TVA a govt collection agency. Voting and decision making on "feelings" rather than scientific principle and results, is and will continue to be our country's downfall.

I do agree that the spill probably won't make a great difference in 3 years.
_________________________
Self-educated rednecks, the real intelligentsia.

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#421862 - 08/22/15 11:56 AM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
sprkplug Offline
Ambassador
Lunker

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 6945
Loc: Freedom, Indiana
Change is nearly always scary, but most often necessary, nonetheless.
_________________________
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.

Top
#421863 - 08/22/15 12:11 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
FINnFUR Offline


Registered: 03/24/15
Posts: 113
Loc: South Cemtral Virginia
Farm Bureau did a little analysis of "Waters of the USA"
Fact or Fiction - interesting
http://www.fb.org/tmp/uploads/FACT_or_FICTION-Copy.pdf

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#421864 - 08/22/15 12:59 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
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Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
The Farm Bureau has it's own agenda.

They poo poo any study to determine if the increasing number of irrigation wells will have an effect on the aquifers in my state. Any plans to restrict water usage are immediately blocked by the Indiana Farm Bureau.

I have to wonder when I see the farmer across the road pumping 800 gpm during a driving rainstorm. Some crank them up even when there is a 100 percent chance of rain within hours. We see more and more government subsidized irrigation wells popping up and the state has no plans to monitor ground water levels.

Near me there is a field of corn without irrigation and one with. This year there doesn't seem to be any difference.

The manager of a trout rearing station north of me says he can tell when the big commercial farms start pumping.

Ask Esshup what happens to his pond and ground water level when the irrigation wells crank up.



Edited by Cecil Baird1 (08/22/15 01:02 PM)
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







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#421865 - 08/22/15 02:04 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
SoSauty Offline
Lunker

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 126
Loc: South Sauty Creek Northern AL
Originally Posted By: Cecil Baird1
The Farm Bureau has it's own agenda.

They poo poo any study to determine if the increasing number of irrigation wells will have an effect on the aquifers in my state. Any plans to restrict water usage are immediately blocked by the Indiana Farm Bureau.

I have to wonder when I see the farmer across the road pumping 800 gpm during a driving rainstorm. Some crank them up even when there is a 100 percent chance of rain within hours. We see more and more government subsidized irrigation wells popping up and the state has no plans to monitor ground water levels.

Near me there is a field of corn without irrigation and one with. This year there doesn't seem to be any difference.

The manager of a trout rearing station north of me says he can tell when the big commercial farms start pumping.

Ask Esshup what happens to his pond and ground water level when the irrigation wells crank up.

That's a good point CB. Where I went to school in San Marcos, TX an outfit would give glass bottom boat tours, now the aquifer has dropped dropped and the business went away. On the flip side, the farms aren't farming in the So San Juaquin Valley in Cali. There's enough water in the Sacremento R. and a wonder of a canal system, the Friant Kern Canal, to transfer the water. The EPA is blocking the water for farms because of a non-native minnow, which numbers less than a 100 and could be preserved in a couple of 40 gal aquariums. The original intent of the endangered species act was to protect ONLY native species, but now that's out of control as inevitably the EPA will soon be.

My stance is that state concerns could and should be handled by the states. This is not the 1st nor the 21st environmental disaster event, involving a containment berm being overseen by the EPA. If the agency causes more problems than it solves, dismantle it, especially if it's federal, and incentivize the states to step up.

As to Fin'Fur's point, yes the Farm Bureau has a vested interest. What I read in the article is that farms ought to have equal respresentation when it comes to water use concerns, not delegated to a "lesser politically favored status."


Edited by SoSauty (08/22/15 02:20 PM)
Edit Reason: ,
_________________________
Self-educated rednecks, the real intelligentsia.

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#421868 - 08/22/15 02:54 PM Re: Who will own our ponds if the EPA gets its way? [Re: anthropic]
FINnFUR Offline


Registered: 03/24/15
Posts: 113
Loc: South Cemtral Virginia
Thats nothing new - everybody has a agenda to some degree.
Including the EPA which are driven by appointed folks tied to the green movement.
They make it sound like everyone else is promoting dirty polluted water and it
ain't so.
EPA also uses your taxes to get public support for their proposal through social media.
Its against the law but will never get prosecuted.
They had the law finalized and printed before the time period closed for opinions.
We have federal agencies making law with out congress - We have no vote in the matter anymore.

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