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SetterGuy,
From the look of the radar image, you may be near full pool sometime today.

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John F...how's the radar look for us in SW Arkansas?? lol. Nevermind. frown Hoping we get a break soon. You guys in the NW got a pretty good rain earlier in the week didnt you? I know west central got a pretty good one. It was well north of us.


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Originally Posted By: SetterGuy
TJ,
Update. We had 2"+ rain earlier this week. My rain gauge is showing 4" for the month.
It brought the water up another foot. So, now I'm up 18" from when I treated the pond. I'm up 2' from the lowest point, before the draught ended.
I marked it at 24 1/4" below the bottom of the pipe.
I will be back up on Aug 3rd and get a measurement then. I don't get a lot of wind on the pond, but I do lose a fair amount of water to evaporation. Earlier I had a 5 gallon bucket of water sitting on the dam. It lost about 1/2" of water to every inch the pond dropped.
So my leak essentially doubled the evaporation rate.
I'm hoping the increased hydraulic pressure from this extra 2' of water will help force the soilfloc into the leak..


Bear in mind evaporation rates for a bucket and a pond are not equal, rates for a pond will be higher. There's no hard rule as it depends on many variables of the pond, just keep that in mind when comparing pond evaporation vs. bucket rates. What was your daily water loss prior to treatment?


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Like TJ said...I see alot more evap on windy days than still days...we have had alot of hot windy days lately also... frown We live on a hill so wind is a big variable for me.

I'm going to just make a simple gauge. Going to get an ice cream bucket and a 2x4 and the first 3 feet of a tape measure, screw the 3ft section of tape measure on to the 3 1/2" side of the 2x4 (I have sooo many old tapes laying around that won't suck all the way in but I don't want to throw away...lol), screw the 2x4 to the ice cream bucket, fill with gravel and set it in the water. It doesn't take a long piece of tape or deep water to check water loss...I'm going to use 36". Set it in water around 28" to start with. From there begin a log...once it gets to low for that I will move it, and reset my starting point.

If you don't have an old tape, you can get them in the $2.99 box in the front of any parts store.

Just a thought, what I'm going to do.

Last edited by peachgrower; 07/22/16 12:37 PM.

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I encourage everyone I help to measure daily vertical water loss to help determine application rates of polymer. Accelerated leaks require heavier application. Further, it's important to establish baseline data to compare against following treatment to verify degree of application success.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Originally Posted By: peachgrower
John F...how's the radar look for us in SW Arkansas?? lol. Nevermind. frown Hoping we get a break soon. You guys in the NW got a pretty good rain earlier in the week didnt you? I know west central got a pretty good one. It was well north of us.


We got 1.85 inches of rain on Friday, the 15th. That's the last measurable rainfall we have received. It was enough to make our small creek run, and I was able to extend the rain by pumping some of it from the creek to my pond. The pond came up 18" total. It is now down almost 6 inches from that high level.

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Originally Posted By: teehjaeh57

Bear in mind evaporation rates for a bucket and a pond are not equal, rates for a pond will be higher. There's no hard rule as it depends on many variables of the pond, just keep that in mind when comparing pond evaporation vs. bucket rates. What was your daily water loss prior to treatment? [/quote]
TJ
I kept records all during the draught from Jan to May. I'm traveling and don't have that info with me. Good to know about the different evaporation rates. I guess that would mean my leak is not as bad as I thought. I do get very little wind on the pond, as its surrounded by trees.
I won't see the pond for a week and a half, so no data for a while. We did get 2-3" more rain yesterday. So, if anything, soilfloc is an excellent method to end a draught. I imagine my rain guage is overflowing at this point. I don't recall reading that on the label, maybe they should change the label to "rain maker!" wink


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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Update. More rain since I got my last measurements. I went by yesterday, and the pond was only down 14". (It was down 4' at one time due to draught and leak.)
I am going back up this weekend, and was going to see if there was a drop in the water level. However, I see we are getting more rain this morning. Who knows, I might get back to full pool at this rate. It would appear that soilfloc will definitely bring in rain. It's worth the investment for that reason alone. (Just kidding..)

The good news so far, is that I went down behind the dam yesterday. There is no moving water in the old ditch bed. It used to have a trickle current when the pond was at this level. There was some very orange (algae) water standing in the ditch bed, but it was not moving. I'm pretty sure it came in off the back of the dam, and the hillsides from the last rain. So, I'm thinking that the soilfloc has helped, but I can't get a measurement that means anything until the rain lets up.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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Back up at the pond. Three days later. It's almost full. We've had another 2.5" of rain and the pond is up another 6". I think I'm still getting some inflow seepage out of the woods, or I would measure the level. We have more rain coming, so I still won't see a drop in the water level. It's a great problem to have (not being able to measure a water level drop)
I still give soilfloc all the credit. It's a draught buster! wink
Going to move my feeder back a foot or so. It's almost under water.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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Update.. We were at the pond all weekend. The water is perfect for swimming. Measured the waterline at 3:00 on sat and sun. Had a 1/4" drop from day to day. The last significant rainfall (2") was Thursday. Not sure if I was still getting and below ground water seeping "into" the pond.
That is a pretty significant improvement in water loss. Too early to tell. I'll be back up Wednesday and check again. If I have a 1/4" per day water loss, I'll be a very happy camper.
Yesterday morning..



9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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Hey man congrats!! Hope that level of fall continues and doesn't get any larger. I think I'm closer 1/2-3/4 per day. I have no water coming in except rain. On a windy hill, two trees around whole thing, 95-100 degree days. Probably to be expected...but would LOVE to be in the 1/4" range!!


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Originally Posted By: peachgrower
Hey man congrats!! Hope that level of fall continues and doesn't get any larger. I think I'm closer 1/2-3/4 per day. I have no water coming in except rain. On a windy hill, two trees around whole thing, 95-100 degree days. Probably to be expected...but would LOVE to be in the 1/4" range!!


Thanks. If it stays at this drop rate, I'll be sleeping so much better.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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I may have spoke (or written) too soon. Back at the pond. It's down a little over an inch in three days. I believe that's still a slower leak than what I had, but would still equate to almost a foot per month. After our five month draught this winter and spring, I was down 4'. Not sure I can put my pond in the "success" column.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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Hi Jeff

Whats your evaporation rate? What was your starting daily loss? You're looking at .33" daily currently, in Lincoln last two days it's been about .25" daily [hot and windy], so 80% of the loss would be due to evaporation [at least here in Lincoln], so you might be better off than you think. I sure hope so!

In my mind, there's very little difference between evaporation and leaking - one goes up, the other goes down - all ponds lose water over time between irrigation or rains. For me it's about reducing water loss to an manageable/acceptable standard. 3" weekly is the goal of many people - I work with folks losing 12" weekly or more. Every scenario is different, obviously.

IIRC you spot treated in area you suspected a leak, and that's the most cost effective way to approach a leak issue and encourage everyone to try and save money and use the sniper approach. However, one of the risks of spot treatment is you may treat some of the leaks, but potentially more exist in areas left untreated. In the end, a guy can live with the results or consider retreatment - at least there's a choice and no one has broken the bank yet. I always ensure to convey this to everyone - re application may be necessary to achieve desired results, and even then it may not happen. In 90%+ cases we've seen at least a 50% reduction in water loss - so historically speaking the odds are in our favor, but it's not an exact science by any means. Plenty of variables - and I'm still learning more daily. In the cases where it failed, I still have zero clue on what the heck happened.

Losing .33" daily in mid August doesn't seem too bad to me - but all depends on previous daily loss data and your personal expectations. Here to help any way I can.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Hello Pond boss friends. I have been on here for a few years mainly reading and trying to catch up. This will be the first big story then I will follow up with questions in the different sub groups. I had become a member on here a few years ago when my pond was new and had sense lost my username and password stuff so I rejoined so to speak.
Like many stories I started my pond project without the great aid of this forum as I didn’t find it till after our pond was dug. As digging my contractor found somewhat of a gravel vein so to speak so we had to dig below that for the core and dam, this ended up making the dam end (deep end) 18 feet deep with steep sides. The rain started and the money got short due to the extra digging so we stopped hoping the water would fill the dam end and “backwater” into the shallow areas knowing if it did that we could always dig and pack this end in the future. There are acres of runoff so the pond filled with a size between ¾ acre and 1 acre. (closer to the ¾). Then the water level dropped. This went on for about 5 years and would always stop leaking at around a 6 foot depth. It was up and down. As you can imagine it was a sickening eyesore so to speak. Last year I rented a giant pump and drained it with the understanding a guy was going to start bringing in better clay to reline it and as is sometimes common after a month it rained again and was so I couldn’t do anything.
During the years I had measured a consistent daily drop of 7 inches so it was huge. The pond would drain in days. I started researching the soilfloc and decided as a last ditch effort I would try it. I was very skeptical as most are since there is not any typical magic powder for ponds. My plan was to wait till it rained and got the deep end filled this is about 1/3 of an acre and 12 feet deep. It was calculated I should use 3 units for this area.
I purchased this and sat it at the ready knowing rain was possible. July 4th I woke up to an almost full pond again, fuller than I had planned for. I was going to wait for it to drop some to the smaller plan but my wife repeated what I had told her that it was a gamble and lets just do it. She convinced me to start. We concentrated 1 unit over the deep end we knew the leak was in this area since it always drained down to that level. The wind picked up and we called it quits with only 1 of the 3 units in.
We put a stake in the ground to measure from expecting like last time I would need to move it about every day. I took diligent notes. The first day we lost 3 inches of water. I then waded out and put a more permanent stake in the next day. In 12 hours we lost 1 inch. It had stabilized to around 2 inches for a few days. We are not a month and a few days into it and I am now losing an average of 1 inch per day. Ok so that is still a loss, I know evaporation is around ¼ to 1/3 inch per day. We have had more rain so it has come up and down and I have taken all that into account with starting over on measurements after the rain. I still have the other 2 units to apply and will soon.
Long long story short I am thrilled. I never imagined the pond would stay at the level it is. I know my long story is not the normal from this use but this stuff worked on my situation. I was probably lucky in some ways. I don’t know where the leak is at now. It has stayed up so it could still be in the deep end or also in part the other end as it has never held water for this length up there. I now have weeds and had a bloom right away that my other posts will cover plus aeration.
Thanks for reading.
A happy pond owner.
Dave


Thanks
Dave
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Thanks for sharing, Dave. Glad to hear your expectations were exceeded. Next time contact me for a Pond Boss family discount and save a little money!


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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My losses were 5.7 inches in the past week. I still have a leak somewhere, but don't see wet spots anywhere near the pond. I think evaporation has been less than 1/4 inch per day. My minnow pond right next to the main pond has lost about an inch and a quarter. All I can tell the Soilfloc did for my pond was stop one seep through the dam where I knew it wasn't compacted well. I applied it on that spot very heavily, about three times the recommended rate. But, that was actually a small seep, volume wise. My daily losses are still about 80% of initial losses. It's cheaper for me to pump periodically than to buy something that might or might not work. At least, with leaking and pumping, I am getting new, clear, water in and nutrient laden water out.

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Been crunching numbers since I saw your post. Over the last four days I have dropped 1 3/8". I am not sure about my evaporation rate. My pond is not exactly straight east of Lincoln, a bit south. I think I can assume it would be similar to your 1/4" evaporation rate per day. If so, I'm really not doing too bad. The total loss is .34" per day. That is 10.3" per month. Which is certainly a slower leak rate than before treatment. If we go through another four month time period without rain, I'll be better off than the last four month long draught.
I did only spot treat, so I cannot expect a 100% seal. My apologies, if I appeared too negative. I was pretty pumped when I only lost 1/4" that first day.
FYI, we are supposed to get some rain tomorrow. Then cooler weather. The good news is, my SMB are fat and happy.



Difference between .33" and .25" is .08" - I think this could very easily be due to evaporation - if not triple that number.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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Beautiful SMB.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

[Linked Image from i1261.photobucket.com]


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To evaluate the true value of a polymer treatment, I encourage one to compare the costs of polymer treatment vs other leak reduction methods. Compaction often results in losing entire fishery to drain and move in equipment and the project can exceed the original pond construction costs - $10 - $20k or more. Even with compaction, there's no guarantee the leak[s] will be addressed. Ask me about it sometime, I know this lesson well.

A liner is likewise not only invasive and requires draining the pond/losing fishery, but even more costly when one includes professional installation I think it's $2/sq ft or more. 1/2 acre pond would run $40k+.

Or, one can take a chance on a polymer treatment which costs around $80/1,000 sq ft. EIGHTY dollars. When a polymer treatment improves seepage rate, even fractionally, it's a huge win compared to the alternative treatment methods. In the end, a pond owner is literally several thousand dollars ahead, not to mention they get to preserve their fishery and keep all their water and not have to start over from scratch. Oh, and the application can typically be completed in a few hours as opposed to weeks or months of planning, draining, seining, etc. Important to keep those numbers and details in mind when evaluating the efficacy and true value of the polymer treatment.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

[Linked Image from i1261.photobucket.com]


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Even so, I can pump a lot of water for $880.00. I bought the inexpensive 2 inch HF pump for initial filling and maintenance, so I would have it anyway. Many ponds around here leak for a year or so, then gradually seal as the clay settles, as rollers are not typically available, and bulldozer compaction takes a while to settle. I will re-evaluate before next summer. Still, the gradual water changes from periodic pumping improve quality and clarity.

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Good point John - unfortunately many are reliant on natural precipitation as their sole source of irrigation, wells or pumping water are not options for them.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Pumping from other water sources of course means one is risking introduction of invasive species of organisms (fish, plants, etc). Basically anything in the water source can be introduced into ones pond. Something all should carefully consider prior to electing to do so.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

[Linked Image from i1261.photobucket.com]


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That's great John. Of course I'm speaking generally for the benefit of the forum at large.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Update. Two more days without rain. Measured on the 15th, it had dropped 5/8", so I'm still doing ok. Just not getting any rain,, as usual.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
Otter attack in 2023
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