Pond Boss Forums GENERAL QUESTIONS Property Projects & Construction Using Nails for Floating Dock Construction

I bought a couple kits in the past. Didn't need the tool, but they came with free batteries that cost much less than buying the batteries alone.

Only during the winter months, Scott.....Ford engines make great ballast for added traction when you throw a couple in the bed. And there's plenty of non-running ones to choose from!

For awhile I sent my worn out battery packs in with my interstate batteries supplier, for rebuilding. It worked pretty well, and it was cheaper than buying new OEM stuff. But, the last one I had rebuilt just didn't give me the life expectancy I was hoping for, and when I disassembled it myself I found offshore, very generic batteries inside.

So, I simply switched to buying the offshore battery packs from Ebay. All new components and housings, (Interstate reuses the old housings), appeared to be the same knockoff batteries that IB was using to rebuild my Milwaukee packs, and it was half the cost of having them rebuilt, including shipping. 1/4 the cost of Milwaukee packs, and the performance has been excellent. I have several now.

I don't add anything for traction in my truck. Just hit the shifter once in a while if need be.

Ford, Chevy (GMC) Dodge, whatever works for you!

Ended up getting the dock finished using coated decking screws. Turn out great. Thanks for the advice.

Want to build a 14'x4' gangplank. What is the best way to attach it to the ground and to the dock so that water level fluctuations don't cause problems? The dock is on a 1.5 acre pond. Thanks!

I'll see if I can find photos of what I've done in the past. I have a 12'x4' walkway to my main floating dock. The 10'x10' floating platform can easily float 18 inches above and below full pool while the platform remains essentially level.

As for land anchors, I've used a post hole digger on my tractor to dig 8-10 inch diameter holes, a minimum of 36 inches deep, and at least 12 inches above the mean water line (full pool). The holes get filled with dry pre-mixed (Sac-Crete) type concrete mixes. I place hardware into the top and just moisten it. Natural soil moisture, that close to the pond edge, will harden and cure the remainder of the pre-mix in a couple of days.

I've always used agricultural gate hardware. I just can't find links to exactly what I've used. But, they are similar to these examples:







Good luck,
Ken

For a floating dock, I use Dockbuilders hardware.

https://www.dockbuilders.com/wooden-gangway-hardware.htm

I hate to resurrect an old thread but a recent revelation forces me to do so. I built my dock with galvanized ring-shank nails and 15 months later all is well. A few weeks ago I was watching an episode of Lake Life on DIY network and Nate was building a dock with nails for the frame and screws for the deck boards. If it's good enuff for Nate, it's good enuff for me!

My fixed dock is doing pretty well after 12 years and my floating dock after 11 years. Some deck boards warp on the ends, but unlike the deck boards on my porch which snap the screws, the dock boards can just be re-nailed.

Nothing wrong with resurrecting an old thread. I much prefer that than having lots of new threads discussing the same thing and having the discussions fragmented all over everywhere where they are hard to find. I like reading and learning from the old threads.

The thing I like about the screws is that when I make the inevitable mistakes that I do, with screws it is easy to correct the mistakes. Sometimes with nails (depending on the type of nails and the amount I use) it involves destroying what has previously been done instead of being able to repair or re-purpose the materials.

Don't get me wrong, I have 4 different air powered nail guns, and when something involves doing a lot in a short time, the nail guns win hands down. But for small projects and stuff I am designing on the fly, a rechargeable impact driver and screws are my "go to" tools.

My sentiments exactly. I don't use very many nails, except for certain projects like installing asphalt shingles or clapboard siding or oak flooring, etc. 90 percent of the time I use screws. I'm a tool junkie, and my nail guns often gather dust, but my impact drivers get a workout...heck, they hardly sit long enough to cool down. Over the years, I've learned a fair amount about fasteners, and the selection and application of something as prosaic as a screw can often involve a number of factors in the decision-making process. Whenever I've taken the time and effort to choose the best fasteners for the job and install them correctly, it has paid off.

For pressure-treated dock decking in a freshwater environment, especially when using lumber treated with one of the ACQ treatments, I like to use GRK PHEINOX™ R4­™ Stainless Steel screws. If I recall, those are type 305 stainless.

(NOTE: In a saltwater environment, I would strongly recommend finding a source of deck screws made of type 316 stainless, which is less subject to corrosion in sea water than types 304 or 305).

I've used a few thousand of the GRKs for various projects, including a couple of docks, and they work great. That said, I've successfully used other brands as well. When working with PT lumber, which is often one of the southern yellow pines (SYP), I like to predrill the boards with an appropriate size pilot hole and sometimes a shank hole as well, depending on the brand and type of screw I'm using. Despite being a 'softwood,' SYP can have pretty hard latewood rings and is sometimes called a 'hard pine.' I've found that in general, predrilling seems to make installation easier, with fewer twisted screws or cracked boards. In softer woods, predrilling might not always be required, although I still do it most of the time.

I've observed that the GRK screws seem less prone to twisting than some other brands that I've used. It seems to me that SYP PT wood can sometimes be pretty 'grippy' compared to some other softwoods, requiring more torque to install screws, which is one reason (besides the hard latewood rings) that I like to predrill my PT project lumber. Still, there's no guarantee that you won't occasionally twist the shank of a screw when installing PT wood decking on a PT frame. However, I don't recall breaking a single deck screw in the last dock deck that I built. Nor have any snapped since then.

Another reason I usually prefer screws over nails is that I'm not always the best shot with a hammer, and if I don't hit my thumb, I sometimes dent the wood, which can be embarrassing.

PT wood, which is usually wet (unless you use KDAT - Kiln Dried AFTER Treatment), will shrink quite a bit in most situations, and if it's fastened with screws it's an easy matter to give each screw an extra cinch with a Torx screwdriver after the wood has stabilized for a while.

And, as snrub said, mistakes are easier and quicker to fix when using screws than with nails.

A few more thoughts about selecting screws for wooden decking and about predrilling: I try to select screws with a 'grip length' roughly equal to the thickness of the deck boards that I'm screwing down to the joists. This grip length might be a completely unthreaded portion of the shank, or there might be some special threads on that portion of the shank that are different from the rest of the threads and designed to interact with the wooden deck boards. The chances are you'd be using what might be called 'production' screws rather than 'traditional' wood screws, in which case the shank clearance hole may often be the same size as the pilot hole, so in many cases only one drill bit should be required. The term 'production wood screw' might not be a universal term, although I've seen/heard it in various places. I've seen some charts on the Internet that provide suggested pilot and shank hole sizes for both production and traditional wood screws and for hardwood vs. softwood. Here's an example of such a chart, whose link I found on the Wood Magazine website. It includes silhouettes of typical traditional and production wood screws, so you can see the difference, along with pilot and shank hole sizes.

http://images.meredith.com/wood/images/pdf/screwchart.pdf

However, I can't say if the hole sizes listed in this or any other chart would be appropriate for every screw product, material, or other situation. You should still contact the specific screw manufacturer to see exactly what they recommend in terms of pilot hole sizes (and shank clearance hole sizes if needed). While you have their attention, you could ask them what they think would be the most appropriate fastener for your application. That might sound like nit-picking, but a five-minute phone call can avoid a lot of problems.

By the way, some screws may be manufactured with a feature that is supposed to eliminate the need for drilling pilot holes, or maybe eliminate the need in some materials and not others. While I think it's a good feature, I'm not convinced that such a feature is always a perfect substitute for pilot holes. In some situations, maybe. That's something else that you could ask about when contacting a manufacturer. I've discussed this with some professional carpenters, but have not heard consistent opinions about it.

Thanks Indy, I'll be starting on a floating dock soon.

PM me when you get ready to start, and I'll be glad to throw in my .02 worth.

Also, I updated my previous post in this thread with more details and observations about fasteners, in case it's of interest.

Gotta' love pondboss....calling the fastener manufacturer to discuss shank clearance dimensions in a pilot hole. That has to be an entirely new dimension of taking things to the extreme!

Yeah, I know. I suppose I tend to be very detail-oriented...drives my wife nuts sometimes. I'm into things like restoring historic homes and antique vehicles, machine-shop work, archaeological investigations, etc., and my attention to detail tends to carry over into things like dock construction...not that it's a bad thing to get the small things right, of course.

By the way, I think I've noticed a comparable level of attention to minutiae in some PB forum discussions on things like, for example, fish feeding strategies or types of algae in ponds, etc. I figure it's all relative...

Now, if you want to see some extreme attention to detail, look at some wood boat-building forums. I pale into insignificance in comparison to the obsession with details that I've seen in some of their discussions, even on fasteners.

I hear you, Spark! Anything with doing is worth doing obsessively.

Bocomo, I just viewed your pond project thread, and let me say that I'm very impressed with your data gathering and recording. Talk about attention to detail...wow! I'm guessing that it all might be leading up to some kind of manifesto or magnum opus on the subject. With such a systematic approach, you'd probably make a good archaeologist (that's a compliment, by the way).

Thank you for reading and for the compliment. I'm a scientist, so I do love data and charts. We don't really have a budget for electrofishing or a total pond rehab, so rod and reel management is really our only option. It has been a fun project and our bass are definitely getting bigger.

What field of science?

I am a cancer researcher. I have a background in biochemistry but now I do mostly biology.

Ancient One, just you don't feel like you are the only one in the room, I measure the minor diameter of the screws with a dial caliper to correctly size the holes.......

What?!?! You don't use the three wire method when measuring thread? Savages!

Excellent. Maybe we had the same shop teacher. My teacher in junior high always had a caliper tucked inside his pocket protector, and he had some little saying or poem for almost every shop activity to help us remember the steps. The problem is I can't remember the poem he had for measuring wood screws for predrilling. All I recall is that it had the words 'root' and 'shank' and something 'stank,' and something to remind us to adjust for hardwood or softwood. He was a great guy and very wood-savvy, even if he wasn't a great poet.

Do they still have shop classes in public schools these days? Or is it considered too dangerous now?

Ah, now that conjures up memories of my metal shop class. Actually, I've been known to use the three-wire method when I've been threading on my lathe and couldn't find the correct thread micrometer to check the pitch diameter. Usually, however, it's easier for me to find where I left a thread micrometer than where I left the little calibrated wires. If there's one thing I've learned over the years, it's that small things are easier to lose than big things, and that shiny things are pretty.